A Dance of the Dire Wolves

[Luddagain]

Oh and just to throw some extra colour we need to consider Benjen, his mother Lynara, her father Rodrick who may well still be alive and all those Starks who went to Essos after Torrhen knelt. They are each potential heirs to the Stark legacy, and especially Winterfell.

[Philokles]

Not going to happen. Some of their supporters might want to fight to ensure the primacy of their candidate, but the Starks themselves would never agree making it null.

[Dex drako]

the only one I see happening is Sansa vs Jon.

sansa has never seen Jon as a true brother (like cat) plus she's in little fingers power. he wants to take control of the north through Sansa so Jon becoming King of the north sets them up for conflict. that being said Sansa would like side with Jon at the last minute those likely loser her life in doing so.  

[Leticia Stark]

Starks are good people, they would never fight against each other.

[Lurid Jester]

4 hours ago, estermonty python said:

I agree and I'm not talking about overthrowing the Boltons, I'm talking about what happens once they've successfully teamed up and taken back Winterfell.  What then?  As we know, GRRM loves the "what's next" question just as much as big set piece battles themselves.

So you think that they'll turn on each other?

Have we forgotten that they are Starks?  That Ned Stark raised them?  Aside from Cat's issues with Jon, and Arya being just a touch stabby, the Starks have to be one of the most well adjusted families in Westeros.  

So instead of fighting each other...  Maybe they'll Fight the Others.  

[Dex drako]

1 hour ago, Lurid Jester said:

Aside from Cat's issues with Jon, and Arya being just a touch stabby, the Starks have to be one of the most well adjusted families in Westeros.

you know whats this is why GRRM made Sansa, the family was too freindly so she was made to be the stark that causes trouble for her family

[chrisdaw]

Jon and Arya overwatched by Bran will march on Sansa's throne, but she has no wolf.

The wolf will dance with the dragon. Ghost will die killing Viserion, he will have his guts ripped open by Viserion's claws but rip Viserion's throat. Nymeria might be in on it too, but it seems the foreshadowing points more to Jaime killing her.

[Luddagain]

Lurid

Ned raised Jon. He raised Robb and Bran pretty much too.  Ned raised Arya. He did not seem to have a strong a connection with Sansa who was closest to Cat.  However Ned did NOT raise Rickon.   He was only 3.    Osha is raising Rickon.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

8 hours ago, Dex drako said:

sansa has never seen Jon as a true brother

Quote

She had not thought of Jon in ages. He was only her half brother, but still... with Robb and Bran and Rickon dead, Jon Snow was the only brother that remained to her. I am a bastard too now, just like him. Oh, it would be so sweet to see him once again. 

I don't believe that they would had fight.

[Springwatch]

I don't see the Starks as 'well adjusted' exactly - they have the wolf blood, or at least Rickon and Arya do, and both are a bit too violent for comfort, even before their world turns upside down.

These are children, but among the grown-ups there is Brandon, pretty much a predator, judging by the amount of punishment he gave little Petyr Baelish, not to mention his enjoyment in seducing virgins like Barbrey (and perhaps Ashara).

So, if anyone's going to fight - and it will have to be by proxy - it will most likely be Rickon v's Arya, driven by wolf-blood.

[Philokles]

2 hours ago, Springwatch said:

I don't see the Starks as 'well adjusted' exactly - they have the wolf blood, or at least Rickon and Arya do, and both are a bit too violent for comfort, even before their world turns upside down.

I'm not going to bother with the too violent after her family was killed as it has been gone over so many times, but saying she was violent before?!? Does that make everyone who practices martial arts "too violent for comfort" as well?

2 hours ago, Springwatch said:

These are children, but among the grown-ups there is Brandon, pretty much a predator, judging by the amount of punishment he gave little Petyr Baelish, not to mention his enjoyment in seducing virgins like Barbrey (and perhaps Ashara).

Hardly. Petyr volunteered for the duel and at Cat's request he did not kill him as he could quite easily have done without repercussion. He showed more mercy than Littlefinger deserved and how much he showed back to the Starks. There is nothing wrong with consensual sex. Barbrey has no regrets all these years on.

2 hours ago, Springwatch said:

So, if anyone's going to fight - and it will have to be by proxy - it will most likely be Rickon v's Arya, driven by wolf-blood.

Given how often Arya thinks fondly of her family including Rickon that seems very unlikely. The Stark wolf-blood is most often seen in rash actions in defence of the pack.

[Lurid Jester]

7 hours ago, Luddagain said:

Lurid

Ned raised Jon. He raised Robb and Bran pretty much too.  Ned raised Arya. He did not seem to have a strong a connection with Sansa who was closest to Cat.  However Ned did NOT raise Rickon.   He was only 3.    Osha is raising Rickon.

Which would mean that if "Rickon" starts fighting his family then it's not really Rickon but whoever controls him.  Kind of that whole "in the name of the King" when the king is a baby really means "in the name of the regent".

And to be fair, Osha and Shaggydog are raising Rickon.  Which might be worse. 

[Dex drako]

7 hours ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

I don't believe that they would had fight.

on their own I would agree but Sansa has little finger whispering in her ear and with it very likely Robs will comes into play soon Jon will likely take Sansa's "birthright" from her.  its not hard to see little finger building a feud between the two but I still believe Sansa sides with Jon in the end.

[kimim]

The only possibility is Sansa vs Jon. LF is positioning Sansa to take WF, and a resurrected Jon, free of his Watch oaths, will also go after WF. Either these two make an alliance, or they fight.

[Lurid Jester]

5 hours ago, Springwatch said:

I don't see the Starks as 'well adjusted' exactly - they have the wolf blood, or at least Rickon and Arya do, and both are a bit too violent for comfort, even before their world turns upside down.

You'll notice I said one of the most well adjusted families in Westeros.  That doesn't mean well adjusted by our standards. 

The Starks are a wolf pack that has been scattered by their enemies.  They long to be reunited and it is a feeling that is magnified for those Starks who still have their wolves.  Their violence is directed at their enemies.  They aren't going to turn on each other when they are reunited.  That would be horrible writing and storytelling. 

However if reading the books has led anyone to believe that the Starks are little more than feral beasts who would throat each other then no forum conversation will change their mind. 

[TheSTARKempire]

I honestly feel this post is meant to troll us. From the first book to the ADWD, the stark kids, even in their worst time and extreme situation, think of reuniting with their family members. and the nature of wolf(which represents STARK) is different from that of reptile dragons. Wolves are very social, and they work together for the safety and well-being of the pack. GRRM chose wolf to represent STARK exactly for that reason: to show that the STARKs remain strong so long as they work in tandem and stay united as a pack. The idea that the wolves must/might mirror the dragons is absurd.

Not only that, let's not forget that

(1).the title of the last book was 'A Time for the Wolves' before GRRM changed it to 'A dream of Spring'.

 

(2). There is not so many pages available as to include the dance of direwolves in the last two books. A number of sub-plots needs to be tied and many mysteries need to be explained. the Stark kids have already went through a great deal of trauma. Having them fight against one another is just plain cruel,so A dance of direwolves serve no purpose. just because you want it does not mean you can cherry-pick events and sentences from the book to satisfy your fantasy.

[kimim]

8 minutes ago, Lurid Jester said:

You'll notice I said one of the most well adjusted families in Westeros.  That doesn't mean well adjusted by our standards. 

The Starks are a wolf pack that has been scattered by their enemies.  They long to be reunited and it is a feeling that is magnified for those Starks who still have their wolves.  Their violence is directed at their enemies.  They aren't going to turn on each other when they are reunited.  That would be horrible writing and storytelling. 

However if reading the books has led anyone to believe that the Starks are little more than feral beasts who would throat each other then no forum conversation will change their mind. 

I think the Starks are the last family to get into that kind of a fight, but I still think it's possible between Sansa and Jon. She and Jon have the same political goal: Control WF and control the North. With LF in the mix thanks to Sansa, they could be in conflict. Arya and Bran have completely different goals. Rickon is, of course, a mystery.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

6 minutes ago, kimim said:

Control WF and control the North

Wut? When that became Jon's goal?

[Lurid Jester]

4 hours ago, kimim said:

I think the Starks are the last family to get into that kind of a fight, but I still think it's possible between Sansa and Jon. She and Jon have the same political goal: Control WF and control the North. With LF in the mix thanks to Sansa, they could be in conflict. Arya and Bran have completely different goals. Rickon is, of course, a mystery.

Political goals?  What?  You mean revenge?  Because the Boltons hold WF.  The Boltons who betrayed and killed Robb and Cat. 

This isn't about politics.  It's about revenge.  

And taking back their home. 

[kimim]

4 hours ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

Wut? When that became Jon's goal?

Either as goal or something foisted on him, he's definitely moving towards WF. Jon says that he always fantasized about ruling WF. Robb's will makes him heir to WF. Stannis offers him WF, and Jon rejects it because of the Watch, and because of the strings attached. Jon's death makes it possible for him to leave the Watch without actual desertion, and the PL, if true, puts him on a collision course with the Boltons over WF. Meanwhile, LF is plotting to have Sansa marry Harry the Heir, then move north with a Vale army in order to claim WF. 

Anyway, I honestly don't believe that Jon and Sansa will turn against one another over WF. However, of all the Starks, they're the only two on a collision course. Arya and Bran have nothing to do with this stuff; and Rickon is still a very young child.