Centrist Simon Steele Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 1 hour ago, Dr. Pepper said: But, ya know, they followed their training and nothing is wrong with that training. People shouldn't prank and people shouldn't walk outside their door when police show up unexpectedly. Although, they can easily get shot on their own homes, too, even when they call the police for assistance. It's just police training, all the civilians fault. Police showing up at your house is meaning, more and more, that you're going to be shot. Whether you did anything or not. I've read this story (you linked) from multiple sources trying to process it--and I am certain that there was a time when police officers knew that not all calls they received were "real." They treated calls as possible pranks, had to use probable cause, etc. At least, that's in my fantasy land of how the police should work. They do not have a right to execute people. This guy did nothing. Absolutely nothing. So many people did nothing and they're dead, but like this story, a diversion is used to fool the public: not the police. Video gaming culture. I don't know why I'm even typing this. It seems to be getting worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted December 30, 2017 Author Share Posted December 30, 2017 19 hours ago, Dr. Pepper said: A man in Witchita was murdered by police for opening his door. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/29/us/wichita-shooting-swatting.html The local police are blaming the entire event on pranksters rather than on the one had pulled the trigger within moments of a man walking out his front door. Obviously swatting is a problem and should be dealt with according. Trigger happy cops should, too. A perfect example of police valuing their lives above the lives of the people they are supposed to protect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 This is some very sad news. https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/12/30/574514217/erica-garner-who-became-an-activist-after-her-fathers-death-dies?sc=tw Erica Garner, daughter of Eric Garner who was murdered by police, has died at age 27. Quote Activist Erica Garner has died, after suffering brain damage following a heart attack. She was 27 years old. Her official Twitter account announced her death Saturday morning. She entered the public eye in July 2014 when her father, Eric Garner, died after being put in a chokehold by a New York City police officer. Eric Garner was seen on video saying, "I can't breathe" 11 times before he died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 Very sad also, Eric Garner was three years ago, wow. Feels like just earlier this year. Guess it’s a consequence of the frequency and pervasiveness of police brutality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry of the Lawn Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said: Very sad also, Eric Garner was three years ago, wow. Feels like just earlier this year. Guess it’s a consequence of the frequency and pervasiveness of police brutality ..and also the fact that nothing's changed despite all the publicity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 On 12/31/2017 at 9:53 AM, larrytheimp said: ..and also the fact that nothing's changed despite all the publicity yep, she and her long suffering family were hassled by nypd right up until the very end, forced out of her room just as doctors were taking her out of the coma Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 Holy hell, that's scary. There are some linked stories in that thread about cops shooting people who were deaf or had earphones and so couldn't hear to follow directions. I saw some in that twitter thread try to blame the clerk. It's so frustrating because (presumably) the clerk wasn't specially trained to deal with people who might be committing dangerous crimes. In any case, they clearly strolled in and saw that there was no armed robbery. It was merely a dude standing alone in an aisle looking at hair products. Their training needs to be fixed. I'm glad this man was able to walk away to share his story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted January 4, 2018 Author Share Posted January 4, 2018 6 hours ago, Dr. Pepper said: Holy hell, that's scary. There are some linked stories in that thread about cops shooting people who were deaf or had earphones and so couldn't hear to follow directions. I saw some in that twitter thread try to blame the clerk. It's so frustrating because (presumably) the clerk wasn't specially trained to deal with people who might be committing dangerous crimes. In any case, they clearly strolled in and saw that there was no armed robbery. It was merely a dude standing alone in an aisle looking at hair products. Their training needs to be fixed. I'm glad this man was able to walk away to share his story. You are absolutely right. There is something fundamentally wrong with the way police officers are being trained if a guy whereing headphones and holding a bottle of shampoo ends up being held at gunpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 Nothing fatal with this one, but an abuse of power from law enforcement nonetheless, though it's also a focus on abuse of power from those in power. A teacher stood to ask a question at a school board meeting in Louisiana that concerned a 28% pay increase for the superintendent when the teachers and staff hadn't had a pay raise in years. She was told to leave, she leaves and then on her way out is handcuffed. Pretty much everyone involved is on her side, including the county prosecutor. The principal says it was all her fault because she was acting like a child by standing up and asking questions at a public meeting. http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-louisiana-teacher-arrest-20180110-story.html In several articles I've read, a lot of the interviewees mention that it's common for women who ask questions at these meetings to get escorted out or banned. One thing that is so noticeable is that there appears to be only two women on the entire board and all those photos behind them are nothing but men. This officer could have ruined this woman's life and her career if no one had been there filming what happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centrist Simon Steele Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 On 1/4/2018 at 5:16 AM, Ser Scot A Ellison said: You are absolutely right. There is something fundamentally wrong with the way police officers are being trained if a guy whereing headphones and holding a bottle of shampoo ends up being held at gunpoint. You know, when I was a kid in the 80s, I got so frustrated with horror movies because if cops ever actually showed up, they were usually polite to the bad guy. The cop would politely look around the house (not too hard) while our killer would be kicking at fingers reaching up between the floorboard in an attempt to be seen. But the cop would shamble on back to his cruiser. No problems here. I hated it. SHOOT THEM COPS! I'd screamed this ALL THE TIME, when I was six thru nine years old. And you know what? Even then, I feel like I understand in real life, a soft, careful approach was the best way 99 percent of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Winter Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 While not going into an in-depth analysis, these stories I've heard over a last couple of years lead me to believe that US police basically has a license to murder anyone they wish with complete impunity. Being unarmed, complying with police instructions or even being a kid are not guarantees you'll survive the encounter with trigger-happy officers. Afterwards, they'll use some ridiculous justifications, usually in lines of "following the procedure", "we maybe thought (s)he was armed" or "resisting the arrest" and walk away scot-free, most of the times not even losing their job, rarely going to trial and even more rarely actually getting convicted on said trial. We scoff at the historical times, where one class (usually nobles) could freely humiliate or sometimes even kill ordinary folk with impunity, but I don't see how situation nowdays is any better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted January 11, 2018 Author Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Knight Of Winter said: While not going into an in-depth analysis, these stories I've heard over a last couple of years lead me to believe that US police basically has a license to murder anyone they wish with complete impunity. Being unarmed, complying with police instructions or even being a kid are not guarantees you'll survive the encounter with trigger-happy officers. Afterwards, they'll use some ridiculous justifications, usually in lines of "following the procedure", "we maybe thought (s)he was armed" or "resisting the arrest" and walk away scot-free, most of the times not even losing their job, rarely going to trial and even more rarely actually getting convicted on said trial. We scoff at the historical times, where one class (usually nobles) could freely humiliate or sometimes even kill ordinary folk with impunity, but I don't see how situation nowdays is any better. Exactly. Our Society has created an entire class of people who can kill with impunity and face little or no likelihood of criminal culpability for having taken someone’s life. The deck is stacked in favor of the officers even in the most egregious incidents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-14/california-man-charged-in-kansas-for-fatal-hoax-call/9327198 Quote A California man accused of making a hoax emergency call that led to the fatal police shooting of an unarmed man in Kansas has been charged with involuntary manslaughter. Key points: Involuntary manslaughter carries a sentence of 31 to 136 months Barriss was convicted in 2016 on two counts of making a false bomb report to a TV station Andrew Finch was shot on his doorstep by police who were called to his house Tyler Barriss made his first court appearance in Kansas via video link from jail on Friday following his extradition from Los Angeles. The 25-year-old is also charged with giving false alarm and interference with a law enforcement officer. Bond was set at $500,000. I haven't seen anything to suggest that the person who actually pulled the trigger will suffer any consequences beyond paid admin leave. And of course no word yet that training will be improved so that cops don't murder citizens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted January 17, 2018 Author Share Posted January 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, Dr. Pepper said: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-14/california-man-charged-in-kansas-for-fatal-hoax-call/9327198 I haven't seen anything to suggest that the person who actually pulled the trigger will suffer any consequences beyond paid admin leave. And of course no word yet that training will be improved so that cops don't murder citizens. That's because it seems those in power believe Police never make mistakes and all deaths at the hands of police are justified by the officers "fear". You are absolutely right that training and procedures need to change and they need to change yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Dr. Pepper said: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-14/california-man-charged-in-kansas-for-fatal-hoax-call/9327198 I haven't seen anything to suggest that the person who actually pulled the trigger will suffer any consequences beyond paid admin leave. And of course no word yet that training will be improved so that cops don't murder citizens. I'm left wondering why the dispatch didn't notice the foreign area code and investigate that more and relay to the cops that it might be a hoax. Details like that that are lost in communication can save lives. Take the Tamir Rice murder, and yes, that was murder, IDC what the courts said. The person who called in to report seeing a kid with a gun also said that they thought it was a toy, but they couldn't be sure. That was never relayed to the cops that went to investigate the situation, and if it was, maybe they wouldn't have committed a drive by shooting on a kid who wasn't old enough to buy a ticket to a PG-13 movie. 1 hour ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: That's because it seems those in power believe Police never make mistakes and all deaths at the hands of police are justified by the officers "fear". You are absolutely right that training and procedures need to change and they need to change yesterday. Part of the problem is self-fulfilling. A career as a LEO naturally appeals to individuals with authoritarian world views. Not like Trump's, mind you, but it creates a situation where the authority is unwilling to have their authority questioned, and the people that most strongly support the police also share these views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted January 18, 2018 Author Share Posted January 18, 2018 2 hours ago, Tywin et al. said: I'm left wondering why the dispatch didn't notice the foreign area code and investigate that more and relay to the cops that it might be a hoax. Details like that that are lost in communication can save lives. Take the Tamir Rice murder, and yes, that was murder, IDC what the courts said. The person who called in to report seeing a kid with a gun also said that they thought it was a toy, but they couldn't be sure. That was never relayed to the cops that went to investigate the situation, and if it was, maybe they wouldn't have committed a drive by shooting on a kid who wasn't old enough to buy a ticket to a PG-13 movie. Part of the problem is self-fulfilling. A career as a LEO naturally appeals to individuals with authoritarian world views. Not like Trump's, mind you, but it creates a situation where the authority is unwilling to have their authority questioned, and the people that most strongly support the police also share these views. Indeed. We need to try to prevent people from becoming police for the sake of the power trip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 https://www.wcpo.com/news/state/state-ohio/sheriff-one-person-shot-in-columbus-courtroom deputy fatally shoots a teen inside a courtroom. despite the fact that anyone entering a court room like this is subjected to pretty rigorous security checks and could not have had any kind of weapon on them, yet here we are with another young man, in need of help struck down by another shitty coward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigFatCoward Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 9 hours ago, dr. thicc president said: https://www.wcpo.com/news/state/state-ohio/sheriff-one-person-shot-in-columbus-courtroom deputy fatally shoots a teen inside a courtroom. despite the fact that anyone entering a court room like this is subjected to pretty rigorous security checks and could not have had any kind of weapon on them, yet here we are with another young man, in need of help struck down by another shitty coward There is nothing in that article to say whether the use of force was justified or not. If he was being attacked by multiple members of the family and genuinely feared for his life then in this case the use of the weapon may have been reasonable. In addition only one shot was fired, this isn't same as the overkill you often see when US police go gun crazy. Also the fact that you shouldn't be able to get weapons into a court is not the same as you can't. People get bombs on planes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 6 hours ago, BigFatCoward said: There is nothing in that article to say whether the use of force was justified or not. If he was being attacked by multiple members of the family and genuinely feared for his life then in this case the use of the weapon may have been reasonable. In addition only one shot was fired, this isn't same as the overkill you often see when US police go gun crazy. Also the fact that you shouldn't be able to get weapons into a court is not the same as you can't. People get bombs on planes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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