blckp Posted October 2, 2016 Share Posted October 2, 2016 so smallfolks really cheers for targaryens ? Quote "When the old king was still alive, he'd not have stood for this." "King Robert?" Arya asked, forgetting herself. "King Aerys, gods grace him," the old man said, too loudly. A guard came sauntering over to shut them up. The old man lost both his teeth, and there was no more talk that night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeeves Posted October 2, 2016 Share Posted October 2, 2016 There are plenty of loyalists out there. Given what the war of the five kings have done, there will be more than a few who would welcome the dragons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minstral Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 The lower commons and peasantry of the seven kingdoms are like any people, and therefore a political people. There would be "loyalists" made through current events (The relevant analysis in the link is past the description of wildfire). These are people and will put up with tyranny to a point. After Joffrey murders his people at his gate it is no coincidence that we begin to see prophets appear to denounce the king and his court as illegitimate. Later during the riot in ACOK, when Joffrey's viciousness is on full display, we see that the people of KL will not consent to being murdered by their would-be-monarch and predictably turn on him. But before this, Robert's reign was legitimized to the people of KL because of the supposed prosperity that he brought, but it is thrown out the window when something goes bad. It is reactionary, but they might default to a claimant of a dynasty if they are not respected. In a historical context, a king would usually be cognizant of the fact that he needed to keep the people of his capital happy and/or content. If not then the monarch could see minor riots turn into palace coups. The Byzantine emperors knew this fact, but were still replaced on occasions when mobs from the horse races ousted them from the throne. English monarchs would later try their damnedest to make sure London was content as to not incite riots (in the context of the War of the Roses and later the reign of the Tudor dynasty this would be important, though it was not always consistent). During the Hundred years war we even see powerful lords appeal to the citizenry of the Paris in order to achieve power (which is another extremely complicated discussion that I won't expand upon, look up John the Fearless if interested). In the context of the story though, the Targs seemed to learn this lesson after the Dance, and it might explain why the Lannister's were unprepared for the ramifications of their actions during the bread riots during Joffrey's short reign. In fact its the type of thinking that Jorah espouses, that the smallfolk don't care who rules them so long as they are left in peace, that makes the nobility and us the readers take the lower class people in the story for granted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Warning Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Rule 1 of moaning about things: It was always better before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Mertyns Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Aerys may have been mad, but his rule was generally pretty stable thanks to Tywin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 On 2/10/2016 at 4:37 AM, blckp said: TV series belongs to the TV forum not here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blckp Posted October 5, 2016 Author Share Posted October 5, 2016 On 2016-10-3 at 11:51 PM, Jon's Queen Consort said: TV series belongs to the TV forum not here. its fact Targaryens brought piece and prosperity to westeros till starks destroyed peace for personal revenge , quote is from book Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess Daenerys Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 2 hours ago, blckp said: its fact Targaryens brought piece and prosperity to westeros till starks destroyed peace for personal revenge , quote is from book Are you referring to Barbrey Dustin's talk of southron ambitions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 I'm sure the Targaryens remain very popular in Kings Landing, Dragonstone and surrounding islands, and the Crownlands. All these places did well out of Targaryen rule, and suffered sacks and war under Aerys's successors. In the North, and Dorne, I'd say that the loyalty of the Smallfolk is focused on the Starks and Martells respectively. Probably other lords enjoy similar support in other parts of Westeros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 9 hours ago, blckp said: its fact Targaryens brought piece and prosperity to westeros till starks destroyed peace for personal revenge , quote is from book Firstly your videos are about the TVseries and secondly prove it. Where in the books someone can find this quote? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scott Malkinson Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 23 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said: Firstly your videos are about the TVseries and secondly prove it. Where in the books someone can find this quote? It was in aCoK, when Arya is brought from the village where she was taken captive to Harrenhal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scott Malkinson Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 On 2-10-2016 at 3:37 AM, blckp said: so smallfolks really cheers for targaryens ? as Jorah says: Quote The common people pray for rain, healthy children, and a summer that never ends. It is no matter to them if the high lords play their game of thrones, so long as they are left in peace. They never are. So long as the king leaves them be, the smallfolk will consider him a good king. If he doesn't though... And Robert plunged their land into chaos during Robert's Rebellion and later may have forced them to fight in the Greyjoy Rebellion, thereby disturbing their peace. No wonder they like Aerys better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 8 minutes ago, Ser Scott Malkinson said: It was in aCoK, when Arya is brought from the village where she was taken captive to Harrenhal. It was said that the Targs were beloved by the common people or that something wouldn't had happened if Aerys was the King? Because it that case it was just one man and someone should remember what we also learn. That the BwB who have the support of smallfolk and nobles alike and not just one man, fight for Robert's realm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scott Malkinson Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 6 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said: It was said that the Targs were beloved by the common people or that something wouldn't had happened if Aerys was the King? Because it that case it was just one man and someone should remember what we also learn. That the BwB who have the support of smallfolk and nobles alike and not just one man, fight for Robert's realm. I'd say the smallfolk support the BwB because the BwB protects them, not because of Robert. But I agree that it wasn't the Targs specifically that are beloved by the common people, it's rather that kings who do not disturb their peace are beloved by the common people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 5 minutes ago, Ser Scott Malkinson said: I'd say the smallfolk support the BwB because the BwB protects them, not because of Robert. But I agree that it wasn't the Targs specifically that are beloved by the common people, it's rather that kings who do not disturb their peace are beloved by the common people. My point was that the people who are most beloved and supported by the smallfolk are fighting for Robert's realm so the Rebels were not the most hated people in Westeros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blckp Posted October 6, 2016 Author Share Posted October 6, 2016 On 10/5/2016 at 5:43 AM, Jon's Queen Consort said: Firstly your videos are about the TVseries and secondly prove it. Where in the books someone can find this quote? as mentioned abovie its from Arya's chapter, also tv lore is based on books and its known fact starks rebellion destroyed peace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackfyre Bastard Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 As much as It don't approve of the show making an appearance on the books section, I think is a fair use of it to drive a point. (so long as nobody mentions Ollys, Talisas or Bad Poosies, we're cool) There are numerous smallfolk who yearn for the return of the Targaryens. It was Nimble Dick who told Brienne and Pod: Quote “Aegon sent his sister up to Crackclaw, that Visenya. The lords had heard o’ Harren’s end. Being no fools, they laid their swords at her feet. The queen took them as her own men, and said they’d owe no fealty to Maidenpool, Crab Isle, or Duskendale. [...] we bow only to our own lords, and the king. The true king, not Robert and his ilk.” He spat. “There was Crabbs and Brunes and Boggses with Prince Rhaegar on the Trident, and in the Kingsguard too. A Hardy, a Cave, a Pyne, and three Crabbs, Clement and Rupert and Clarence the Short. Six foot tall, he was, but short compared to the real Ser Clarence. We’re all good dragon men, up Crackclaw way.” AFfC Chapter 20 - Brienne III Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WSmith84 Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Given this and the 'Does Westeros hate the Starks?' thread, I'm beginning to suspect that the OP doesn't like the Starks... Obviously, evil Ned and Robert should have demanded that Jon Arryn execute them. They were clearly in the wrong. The Targaryens shouldn't share any of the blame at all (like say, nearly all of it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 12 hours ago, blckp said: as mentioned abovie its from Arya's chapter, also tv lore is based on books and its known fact starks rebellion destroyed peace Te TV lore belongs as the name show to the TV forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRANDON GREYSTARK Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 I could chalk it up to the loyalty of the Crown and Riverlands to the memory of the Targaryens or the agitprop of Varys and Illyrio ,but the easy answer is nostalgia for the good old days ,one land one king ,the Westermen and the Northmen were where they belong in the own lands .Banditry was what happen to someone else . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.