Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 9 minutes ago, Tempra said: I didn't move any goal posts. Trump never said or inferred that he would sidestep the judicial process to jail Clinton. If Trump were in charge of the law, Clinton would be in jail. How, precisely, is this not saying that he wouldn't sidestep the judicial process to jail Clinton? "If Trump were in charge of the law, Clinton would be in jail" is precisely saying that there is no due process involved. 9 minutes ago, Tempra said: The fact that he believes she would be in jail if he were president (and he appointed a special prosecutor), just reaffirms his belief that she is guilty and the FBI investigation is illegitimate, not that he desires to overthrow the government. Then he should have said that. Believing someone is guilty is not the same thing as actually having their guilt. If you want to say it that way, you say that if they were found guilty they would be in jail. That's not what Trump said. There was no 'finding guilt' part of his sentence. Instead, he stated that if he were in charge of the law Clinton would be in jail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 And on a lighter note, the current attack on Obama and Clinton is that they are demon-possessed. Seriously. Quote Imagine how bad she smells, man? I'm told her and Obama, just stink, stink, stink, stink. You can't wash that evil off, man. Told there's a rotten smell around Hillary. I'm not kidding, people say, they say -- folks, I've been told this by high up folks. They say listen, Obama and Hillary both smell like sulfur. I never said this because the media will go crazy with it, but I've talked to people that are in protective details, they're scared of her. And they say listen, she's a frickin' demon and she stinks and so does Obama. I go, like what? Sulfur. They smell like Hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis is the man....nis Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 It seems his tape comments have done damage he can't undone Rasmussen Hil +7, UPI Hil +6, and NBC Hil +11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempra Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 3 minutes ago, Kalbear said: If Trump were in charge of the law, Clinton would be in jail. How, precisely, is this not saying that he wouldn't sidestep the judicial process to jail Clinton? "If Trump were in charge of the law, Clinton would be in jail" is precisely saying that there is no due process involved. Then he should have said that. Believing someone is guilty is not the same thing as actually having their guilt. If you want to say it that way, you say that if they were found guilty they would be in jail. That's not what Trump said. There was no 'finding guilt' part of his sentence. Instead, he stated that if he were in charge of the law Clinton would be in jail. Why even appoint a special prosecutor in that case? He could simply order the U.S. Marshals to seize and deliver her to to an FCI, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Just now, Stannis is the man....nis said: It seems his tape comments have done damage he can't undone Rasmussen Hil +7, UPI Hil +6, and NBC Hil +11 Note that the last two were taken before Pussygate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Just now, Tempra said: Why even appoint a special prosecutor in that case? He could simply order the U.S. Marshals to seize and deliver her to to an FCI, no? It's immaterial, honestly, because the question is not what he can do, but what he wants. And what he wants is to be in charge of the law and jail Clinton. That's what he wants. He doesn't want due process. He doesn't want a fair trial. He has already found her guilty, and he wants to punish her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis is the man....nis Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Uh oh the Apprentice tapes are being released and Huffpost got it's hands on a transcript Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempra Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Kalbear said: It's immaterial, honestly, because the question is not what he can do, but what he wants. And what he wants is to be in charge of the law and jail Clinton. That's what he wants. He doesn't want due process. He doesn't want a fair trial. He has already found her guilty, and he wants to punish her. The statement you want to ignore is immaterial. Why am I not surprised? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunderMifflin Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Obama nailed it when he called Trump insecure. Thats the entire essence of pussy grabbing tapes imo. Which I don't think in any way is an admission of sexual assault, I think that's pretty ridiculous. I'm surprised more people don't know at the least someone sort of like this. Certainly isn't normal but I've seen a few of these people around from time to time that are somewhat like that. Of those, most are a bit more charismatic than saying "grab em by the pussy" but the same sentiment is still there. Trump just looks like an insecure dude trying to impress some other dudes talking about all the hot chicks he bangs. I don't think that deserves jail time. It deserves to be mocked and ridiculed at the very least though. Unpresidential certainly. That being said I wouldn't be shocked if some better evidence of an actual sexual assault(s) he committed emerges but for now Im just seeing a douche that has to seem important if it's the last thing he does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 The Orange Stalin states over and over that if he is in control anyone who disagrees with him, crosses him, gets in his way, is a competitor will go to the gulag or worse. He is the worst threat to the United States' form of democracy and its Constitution we've ever seen running for POTUS. Maybe. There is David Duke and some others, but none of them ever got as close to winning an election as he has. Nor does SEE anything around him that isn't himself. Fer gawdessas' sakes! HE LIVES IN A MIDDLE City! This middle city bs -- I've been in the middle city of cities very small, mid-sized and very great on a constant basis, and many of them repeatedly-- and all of them are thriviing, filled with brew pubs, locavore restaurants, ironwork street lights, farmers' markets, Fun Friday Nights, etc. This is about as far from his descriptions as you can get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Just now, Tempra said: The statement you want to ignore is immaterial. Why am I not surprised? It's immaterial to what he wants. And what he wants was on discussion, and what you wanted to dismiss out of hand. It's a good thing that it doesn't exist as it stands, but what he wants is to punish opposition to him. That's what he desires. He indicated how he might try to do it, but what he wants is her to be in jail. That's a pretty important point - that what he wants is to be an authoritarian controller. You can argue reasonably that he can't, currently, legally do that, and that's fine - but that's not what we were arguing about. We're arguing what he wants. And what he wants is to suspend the current rule of law and dictate precisely the outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 2 hours ago, Jaime L said: If you don't change your board name to Ken Bone, I don't know why we even have a board to begin with. Jamie L posting in the politics thread? 2016 really is breaking all the norms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteGabriel Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 8 minutes ago, DunderMifflin said: That being said I wouldn't be shocked if some better evidence of an actual sexual assault he committed emerges but for now Im just seeing a douche that has to seem important if it's the last thing he does. You mean like the multiple women who've accused Trump of doing exactly what he bragged about in that recording? Quote Earlier this year, the New York Timesinterviewed dozens of women who’ve worked with Donald Trump. Temple Taggart, a former Miss Utah who was 21 when she met Trump in 1997, described Trump behaving exactly as he boasts in the recording. “He kissed me directly on the lips. I thought, ‘Oh my God, gross.’ He was married to Marla Maples at the time. I think there were a few other girls that he kissed on the mouth. I was like, ‘Wow, that’s inappropriate.’” ... In 1997, Trump was sued for sexual harassment. The New York Times recently published details of the plaintiff’s allegations. Jill Harth, who regularly met with Trump in the ‘90s to form a business partnership, described how Trump repeatedly groped her, pushed her against a wall, and tried to kiss her. In 1993, she said Trump was showing her around his Mar-a-Lago estate in Florida. “I was admiring the decoration, and next thing I know he’s pushing me against a wall and has his hands all over me,” Harth told the New York Times. “He was trying to kiss me. I was freaking out.” http://qz.com/804486/the-women-whove-accused-donald-trump-of-sexual-assault/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 14 minutes ago, Stannis is the man....nis said: Uh oh the Apprentice tapes are being released and Huffpost got it's hands on a transcript So far nothing nearly as explosive as pussy-grabbing, but plenty more examples of Trump being an asshole. Its only a couple transcripts thus far though. Important to note, no tapes have been leaked yet. Its just transcripts from tapes, and we've seen too many examples now where it takes actual audio/visual evidence for this kind of stuff to make a difference to people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 12 minutes ago, DunderMifflin said: That being said I wouldn't be shocked if some better evidence of an actual sexual assault(s) he committed emerges but for now Im just seeing a douche that has to seem important if it's the last thing he does. The USA today's front page lists at least 20 women who have accused Trump of sexual harassment or assault. This goes from a pageant contestant being grabbed and kissed to a business partner being groped repeatedly at meetings to Trump going through a woman's locker room and seeing the pageant contestants naked to the actual accusations of rape by 2 women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerPaladin Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 3 minutes ago, Zorral said: The Orange Stalin states over and over that if he is in control anyone who disagrees with him, crosses him, gets in his way, is a competitor will go to the gulag or worse. He is the worst threat to the United States' form of democracy and its Constitution we've ever seen running for POTUS. Maybe. There is David Duke and some others, but none of them ever got as close to winning an election as he has. After New Jersey's primary, I could sense "loyalty oaths" coming. Trump's brownshirts aggressively attack any republican who is not on board, from congressmen all the way down to city council and party officials. Most of the Ds I know have been worried about his policy stances or our world standing or even that he's a "laughing stock" or a misogynist in his personal life. It's deeper, and it's starting to show through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunderMifflin Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 7 minutes ago, DanteGabriel said: You mean like the multiple women who've accused Trump of doing exactly what he bragged about in that recording? http://qz.com/804486/the-women-whove-accused-donald-trump-of-sexual-assault/ No I mean better than what currently exists. Just my opinion. There are plenty of people accussing both candidates of illegal wrongdoings. The only way I know to keep it fair in my head is to not fully believe any of it nor to fully disbelieve any of it. Also, me not being any sort of witness to any of the alleged crimes hurts my ability to know who should be punished. Plus, I normally don't like seeing anybody go to jail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteGabriel Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Just now, DunderMifflin said: No I mean better than what currently exists. Just my opinion. There are plenty of people accussing both candidates of illegal wrongdoings. The only way I know to keep it fair in my head is to not fully believe any of it nor to fully disbelieve any of it. Plus, I normally don't like seeing anybody go to jail. Yeah, if you throw your hands up and just say both are being accused of "wrongdoings," you can go an entire election without having to think about anything. Well played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunderMifflin Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 1 minute ago, DanteGabriel said: Yeah, if you throw your hands up and just say both are being accused of "wrongdoings," you can go an entire election without having to think about anything. Well played. I don't see how forming a conclusion in any way indicates that one has put any more or less thought into a subject than a person who hasn't formed a conclusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Quote There are plenty of people accussing both candidates of illegal wrongdoings. That is true. However, only one candidate has had multiple lawsuits settled for sexual assault. Only one candidate is currently being tried for rape of a 13 year old girl. Only one candidate is on record as stating how they sexually assault women. Only one candidate has settled 20 lawsuits on sexual harassment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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