US Elections - furniture shopping with disaster

[OldGimletEye]

3 hours ago, Martell Spy said:

Conservatism Never Fails

How the Republican Party will try to explain away Donald Trump’s disastrous campaign.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/interrogation/2016/10/rick_perlstein_on_how_the_republican_party_will_recover_from_trump.html

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I’m kind of famous for coming up with a little epigram, “Conservatism never fails. It is only failed.” I came up with this during my long experience of studying the right, and realizing that basically anything that is politically successful is kind of labeled conservatism. Any failure is wiped off the books in this bad faith utterance that well, of course it failed because it wasn’t conservative. Romney wasn’t conservative enough. McCain wasn’t conservative enough. “Bush wasn’t conservative,” you began to hear in 2004, when the wheels came off the bus with Iraq, and all the rest.

Yep, the Republican Party has become a Dumpster Fire.

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That’s what we’ll hear, “Of course, Trump lost. He wasn’t conservative.” That allows everyone else in the Republican Party, basically, to push the infamous reset button. 

That's where I'd put my money. 

It will be a good time watching these idiots shout at each other about who is the most conservative in the next election cycle.

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 I think what we’ll see is the Paul Ryans and the Ted Cruzes, jockeying for the position of King of Conservatism saying, “We need to wipe the slate clean and go back to Reagan.” The dilemma that raises is that Trump has raised energies in the Republican electorate that may not be able to be so easily contained.

I wonder if Reagan was conservative enough? 

[The Marquis de Leech]

49 minutes ago, OldGimletEye said:

I wonder if Reagan was conservative enough? 

Between the tax increases, the Social Security bail-out, the Keynesian stimulus spending, the negotiating with terrorists, and the anti-nuclear treaties, the actual Reagan wouldn't have a chance in the modern Republican Party.

(Neither would Richard "We're All Keynesians Now" Nixon, or Dwight "Beware the Military-Industrial Complex" Eisenhower. Herbert Hoover would be out too, because he actually listened to the expert advice at the time (even if it was wrong). Calvin Coolidge would pass, up until he reveals he's actually OK about Native Americans and Black people. Warren Harding's out for the 8 hour Day and releasing political prisoners. Taft's out for trust-busting, while Teddy Roosevelt would be considered a communist....).

[Shryke]

Real Reagan? No.

Saint Ronnie? He's as conservative as you want him to be.

[DireWolfSpirit]

That really bothers me that the Presidents brother will be a pawn of Trumps, obviously a mocking situation. Very sad that the Presidents brother would allow himself to be manipulated like this. Most unfortunate, this leaves a pit in the stomach for what I can only foresee as an ultimate cringe moment.

I dont even care about the debate, just feel bad for the President, the Presidents family, and I've never been more disgusted with Trump than I am at this moment.

[Ordos]

I want as many people as possible to watch this because it's the best argument not to vote for Drumpf:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIHXhs7rYps

 

[Horza]

6 hours ago, larrytheimp said:

Thanks, that was a great read.  Loved the explanation of paranoia of the demagogue post WWII amongst US leaders spiralling into more demagoguery.  Very pynchonian.

Hugely recommend Perlstein's Goldwater to Reagan eventual quadrilogy, especially Before the Storm and Invisible Bridge

[OldGimletEye]

6 hours ago, Roose Boltons Pet Leech said:

Calvin Coolidge would pass, up until he reveals he's actually OK about Native Americans and Black people. Warren Harding's out for the 8 hour Day and releasing political prisoners. T

In addition, to what you've cited, I want to give a little more proof of Calvin Coolidge's pinko communist tendencies.

From a speech that good old Comrade Calvin made around 1927 or so:

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The idea of utilizing construction, particularly of public works, as a stabilizing factor in the business and employment situation has long been a plan of perfection among students of these problems. If in periods of great business activity the work of construction might be somewhat relaxed; and if in periods of business depression and slack employment those works might be expanded to provide occupation for workers otherwise idle, the result would be a stabilization and equalization which would moderate the alternations of employment and unemployment. 

................

More than this, the economies possible under such a plan are apparent. When everybody wants to do the same thing at the same time, it becomes unduly expensive. Every element of costs, in every direction, tends to expand. These conditions reverse themselves in times of slack employment and subnormal activity, with the result that important economies are possible.

Calvin Coolidge: A Betrayer of The Conservative Revolution.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

Props to Rubio:

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/exclusive-rubio-talk-wikileaks-donald-trump/story?id=42895586

[BloodRider]

7 hours ago, Horza said:

Hugely recommend Perlstein's Goldwater to Reagan eventual quadrilogy, especially Before the Storm and Invisible Bridge

I am fascinated by the subject matter, but his writing style drives me up a tree.

[Castel]

10 hours ago, Shryke said:

Real Reagan? No.

Saint Ronnie? He's as conservative as you want him to be.

He's like Jesus that way. 

[Zorral]

As far as the Mexican vote goes, maybe not so much for the Orange Stalin?  Many are members of the Culinary Union.  In Nevada they've built a Taco Truck Wall.  They have used the taco trucks this fall as voter registration centers and centers that provide the information on the procedures and paperwork to become a U.S. citizen.  Not Texas, of course, but Nevada.  However, I do know very many chicanos in the southwest, including Texas and not a single supporter of Orange Stalin is among them.  But Texas has very effective apparatus going back to the 1900's to ensure everyone votes as they are supposed to, by gawd.

 

 

[A Horse Named Stranger]

So any spoilers what the final debate has in store? 

Return of the Jedi, Revenge of the Sith, Return of the King. 

Almost any given triology had this big confrontation. And as a supervillain Trump has yet to reveal his superweapon. The rockbottom generator. So I am really curious what it will look like.

[Fez]

My best guess, when the sexual assault allegations come up, Trump will somehow tie it into an insult of Clinton's looks (e.g. 'It's all lies. I'm not attracted to women that ugly, which is also why you're perfectly safe up here.')

[Mlle. Zabzie]

4 minutes ago, Fez said:

My best guess, when the sexual assault allegations come up, Trump will somehow tie it into an insult of Clinton's looks (e.g. 'It's all lies. I'm not attracted to women that ugly, which is also why you're perfectly safe up here.')

I think he'll throw in some gratuitous Bill Bashing (with a "hey we all do it, so it's not disqualifying" message).  I'm sure there will also be some direct accusation of election rigging, and not the construction kind, because he never met a non sequitur he didn't like.

 

[Kalbear]

There was a rumor from a friend of mine who said that Breitbart has another Clinton accuser coming out.

I'm otherwise expecting that Clinton plays not to lose, and baits Trump somewhat but not insanely.

And on that note: while I don't think Clinton looked amazing debating Trump in the first debate, I am not sure there has been a more calculated, planned and thorough takedown of the other candidate at a debate. While a lot of people point to the TrumpTape being a huge deal, it was the first debate where things really took a turn. Remember, prior to that debate polling was basically tied. Afterwards it was something like a 3-4 point jump. 

That sort of thing almost never, ever happens, and especially doesn't happen because of something the other person does - it's usually either being incredibly good (like Clinton was in the Town hall in 1992) or having a personal gaffe (like Bush checking a watch or Dukakis robotically responding to the thought of his wife being murdered). 

[James Arryn]

I predict his surprise guests are 'cops' and he follows through on his thing about having her arrested.

Mostly kidding, but I do think his pattern isn't as defensive as others do; his go-to thing is to attack, and his go-to attack on Hillary is the crooked/criminal thing. I think we'll see a lot more of that. 

[Ariadne23]

6 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

There was a rumor from a friend of mine who said that Breitbart has another Clinton accuser coming out.

That story is out. 

[Maithanet]

5 minutes ago, James Arryn said:

I predict his surprise guests are 'cops' and he follows through on his thing about having her arrested.

Mostly kidding, but I do think his pattern isn't as defensive as others do; his go-to thing is to attack, and his go-to attack on Hillary is the crooked/criminal thing. I think we'll see a lot more of that. 

There are few lows in American politics that this contest has not sunk to, and one of the only remaining ones is physical violence.  Perhaps he can bring a cane and attempt to beat Clinton to death with it, a la Charles Sumner?  I would love to see how the secret service reacts to that.

[Kalbear]

11 minutes ago, Ariadne23 said:

That story is out. 

Ah, there we go.

Seems reasonable on its face. I don't tend to trust Breitbart's investigative journalism, but there's nothing that makes me think it isn't accurate. 

[sologdin]

am not sure what dude thinks is salient about bringing BHO's brother or WJC's accusers?