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Illyrio


Venus414

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I'm fairly new and I'm wondering if it's been sorted out for sure- this matches the description of Illyrio and I could guess on a couple other guys but I'm wondering if this is known? And who are the rest, and what it means.  I have a tiny idea but I'm going to see what I get here. 

 

Could it be Illyrio? 

A Feast for Crows - Arya II

Poisons. She understood then. Every evening after prayer the waif emptied a stone flagon into the waters of the black pool.

The waif and kindly man were not the only servants of the Many-Faced God. From time to time others would visit the House of Black and White. The fat fellow had fierce black eyes, a hook nose, and a wide mouth full of yellow teeth. The stern face never smiled; his eyes were pale, his lips full and dark. The handsome man had a beard of a different color every time she saw him, and a different nose, but he was never less than comely. Those three came most often, but there were others: the squinter, the lordling, the starved man. One time the fat fellow and the squinter came together. Umma sent Arya to pour for them. "When you are not pouring, you must stand as still as if you had been carved of stone," the kindly man told her. "Can you do that?"
"Yes." Before you can learn to move you must learn to be still, Syrio Forel had taught her long ago at King's Landing, and she had. She had served as Roose Bolton's cupbearer at Harrenhal, and he would flay you if you spilled his wine.

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8 minutes ago, Venus414 said:

I'm fairly new and I'm wondering if it's been sorted out for sure- this matches the description of Illyrio and I could guess on a couple other guys but I'm wondering if this is known? And who are the rest, and what it means.  I have a tiny idea but I'm going to see what I get here. 

 

Could it be Illyrio? 

If you're referring to the fat man, I don't recall Illyrio being described with a hooked-nose. And Illyrio gets described as really fat (at least by Tyrion). Of course, these are Faceless Men who can change how they look, so it's anyone's guess. They probably have it down to a science which facial features are "seen" first by people when they judge a stranger. ie. someone having a huge mole on their face – take it away, and no one sees the fellow as the same person. Still, it's not a bad idea, if Illyrio is either allied with more people or he's not really Illyrio at all... 

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31 minutes ago, Liver and Onions said:

 

If you're referring to the fat man, I don't recall Illyrio being described with a hooked-nose. And Illyrio gets described as really fat (at least by Tyrion). Of course, these are Faceless Men who can change how they look, so it's anyone's guess. They probably have it down to a science which facial features are "seen" first by people when they judge a stranger. ie. someone having a huge mole on their face – take it away, and no one sees the fellow as the same person. Still, it's not a bad idea, if Illyrio is either allied with more people or he's not really Illyrio at all... 

Are all visitors necessarily faceless, because the attractive man changes his appearance in the same passage in the OP - fat with golden teeth sounds like Illyrio to me! Who else could it be? Unless it's just some random.  But I have a feeling they're people that are introduced in the story?

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1 hour ago, Venus414 said:

I'm fairly new and I'm wondering if it's been sorted out for sure- this matches the description of Illyrio and I could guess on a couple other guys but I'm wondering if this is known? And who are the rest, and what it means.  I have a tiny idea but I'm going to see what I get here. 

 

Could it be Illyrio? 

A Feast for Crows - Arya II

Poisons. She understood then. Every evening after prayer the waif emptied a stone flagon into the waters of the black pool.

The waif and kindly man were not the only servants of the Many-Faced God. From time to time others would visit the House of Black and White. The fat fellow had fierce black eyes, a hook nose, and a wide mouth full of yellow teeth. The stern face never smiled; his eyes were pale, his lips full and dark. The handsome man had a beard of a different color every time she saw him, and a different nose, but he was never less than comely. Those three came most often, but there were others: the squinter, the lordling, the starved man. One time the fat fellow and the squinter came together. Umma sent Arya to pour for them. "When you are not pouring, you must stand as still as if you had been carved of stone," the kindly man told her. "Can you do that?"
"Yes." Before you can learn to move you must learn to be still, Syrio Forel had taught her long ago at King's Landing, and she had. She had served as Roose Bolton's cupbearer at Harrenhal, and he would flay you if you spilled his wine.

I don’t think it is Illyrio. Illyrio is known for his yellow forked beard, his hugeness and the rings on his fingers. Tyrion makes a remark somewhere that in order to get Illyrio’s rings someone would have to cut off his fingers. Illyrio has special furniture built that will support his weight.

Arya saw him once in KL describing him as grossly fat.

GoT c. 32"If one Hand can die, why not a second?" replied the man with the accent and the forked yellow beard. "You have danced the dance before, my friend." He was no one Arya had ever seen before, she was certain of it. Grossly fat, yet he seemed to walk lightly, carrying his weight on the balls of his feet as a water dancer might. His rings glimmered in the torchlight, red-gold and pale silver, crusted with rubies, sapphires, slitted yellow tiger eyes. Every finger wore a ring; some had two.

The fat man you mention does show up again in the DwD Ugly Little Girl chapter.

Eleven servants of the Many-Faced God gathered that night beneath the temple, more than she had ever seen together at one time. Only the lordling and the fat fellow arrived by the front door; the rest came by secret ways, through tunnels and hidden passages. They wore their robes of black and white, but as they took their seats each man pulled his cowl down to show the face he had chosen to wear that day. Their tall chairs were carved of ebony and weirwood, like the doors of the temple above. The ebon chairs had weirwood faces on their backs, the weirwood chairs faces of carved ebony.

I agree that it is possible that some of these people may have been seen in other places.

 

 

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On 10/23/2016 at 0:03 PM, Clegane'sPup said:

I don’t think it is Illyrio. Illyrio is known for his yellow forked beard, his hugeness and the rings on his fingers. Tyrion makes a remark somewhere that in order to get Illyrio’s rings someone would have to cut off his fingers. Illyrio has special furniture built that will support his weight.

 

Arya saw him once in KL describing him as grossly fat.

 

GoT c. 32"If one Hand can die, why not a second?" replied the man with the accent and the forked yellow beard. "You have danced the dance before, my friend." He was no one Arya had ever seen before, she was certain of it. Grossly fat, yet he seemed to walk lightly, carrying his weight on the balls of his feet as a water dancer might. His rings glimmered in the torchlight, red-gold and pale silver, crusted with rubies, sapphires, slitted yellow tiger eyes. Every finger wore a ring; some had two.

 

The fat man you mention does show up again in the DwD Ugly Little Girl chapter.

 

Eleven servants of the Many-Faced God gathered that night beneath the temple, more than she had ever seen together at one time. Only the lordling and the fat fellow arrived by the front door; the rest came by secret ways, through tunnels and hidden passages. They wore their robes of black and white, but as they took their seats each man pulled his cowl down to show the face he had chosen to wear that day. Their tall chairs were carved of ebony and weirwood, like the doors of the temple above. The ebon chairs had weirwood faces on their backs, the weirwood chairs faces of carved ebony.

 

I agree that it is possible that some of these people may have been seen in other places.

 

 

 

This is awesome! He "walked like a water dancer" maybe he seemed fatter the first time? Wasn't there a passage saying why would cat of the canals or blind Beth know someone from winterfell or along those lines, arya was just salty when she saw the fat man, idk.  No beard or rings but same body same teeth? Hmm.  There's also the silks and wearing another's likeness "people see what they expect to see" 

maybe it's just me seeing what I expect to see ha

 

manderly Varys and brown Ben plum are also fat, idk

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 10/23/2016 at 10:19 AM, Liver and Onions said:

 

If you're referring to the fat man, I don't recall Illyrio being described with a hooked-nose. And Illyrio gets described as really fat (at least by Tyrion). Of course, these are Faceless Men who can change how they look, so it's anyone's guess. They probably have it down to a science which facial features are "seen" first by people when they judge a stranger. ie. someone having a huge mole on their face – take it away, and no one sees the fellow as the same person. Still, it's not a bad idea, if Illyrio is either allied with more people or he's not really Illyrio at all... 

I just learned there's a fat master with a hooked nose in he sworn sword, I just did a post on hooked noses lol 

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  • 4 months later...
On 10/26/2016 at 4:25 AM, Horse of Kent said:

It does not seem likely that one of the FM is a slaver.

While I see your point, they serve no one.  They'll kill whoever as long as they don't know them personally. They work for money (or other valuables) so while I think it's unlikely their endgame has anything to do with slavers, I bet they have to deal with them.  Manderly is fat  too. 

I wonder if the cheesemonger is related to the butterwell/Targ bastards. Butter wells were dairy people.

 

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On 10/23/2016 at 10:51 AM, Michael Mertyns said:

We don't know exactly how quickly time is passing during Arya's stay at the HoBaW, but I'm kind of doubtful that it is slow enough for "from time to time" to accommodate trips to and from Pentos while still allowing Illyrio to spend most of his time in Pentos.

Plus there's a good chance he's dead:

 

Quote

DwD Tyrion I
I could live for years on his rings, Tyrion mused, though I'd need a cleaver to claim them.

Quote

DwD The Merchant's Man

One of the corpses was so fat that the ship's cook had to cut his fingers off with a meat cleaver to claim his rings. It took three Meadowlarks to roll the body into the sea. 

 

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Someone on reddit reckoned he was Godric Borell, and the "squinter" was the customs guy from Selhorys. Here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/5iogft/spoilers_extended_a_character_you_dont_remember/

https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/5j6thc/spoilers_extended_one_moore_faceless_man_in_the/

https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/5lbbcz/spoilers_extended_the_fattest_faceless_of_them_all/

The gentleman has good tinfoil but I don't believe he's identified the remainder of the men yet.

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Somewhat OT, but I've wondered how Arya always knew the handsome man was always the same handsome man, despite different noses and beard-colors. Was it just that he was always with the fat man and the stern man?

(And fwiw, if she can recognize the handsome man whatever the shade of his facial hair or nasal topography, I would expect her to recognize Illyrio from KL; she is generally pretty good at recognizing folks).

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18 hours ago, Venus414 said:

Hana ! there's a good chance that Bran,Rickon, Davos, Cat, Beric, patch face etc etc are dead too.

Well we have them on-page being not entirely dead. As far as I can recall, we don't see Illyrio in person after he leaves Tyrion's company early in ADWD.

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On 4/16/2017 at 6:09 PM, Therae said:

Somewhat OT, but I've wondered how Arya always knew the handsome man was always the same handsome man, despite different noses and beard-colors. Was it just that he was always with the fat man and the stern man?

(And fwiw, if she can recognize the handsome man whatever the shade of his facial hair or nasal topography, I would expect her to recognize Illyrio from KL; she is generally pretty good at recognizing folks).

On 4/16/2017 at 1:29 AM, Illyrio Mo'Parties said:

Someone on reddit reckoned he was Godric Borell, and the "squinter" was the customs guy from Selhorys. Here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/5iogft/spoilers_extended_a_character_you_dont_remember/

https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/5j6thc/spoilers_extended_one_moore_faceless_man_in_the/

https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/5lbbcz/spoilers_extended_the_fattest_faceless_of_them_all/

The gentleman has good tinfoil but I don't believe he's identified the remainder of the men yet.

Thanks! That's good stuff.

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