Do you think Daenerys and Jon Snow

[A Ghost of Someone]

12 hours ago, Sir Matthis Light said:

 Most likely shock but he is of BOTH StarkandTargaeyen lines and the true defacto leader of ALL the 7 Kingdoms so they should really be cool with it. The undead are coming, and their gonna have to come to terms it ASAP lol. With all the sh*t that happen to the family I'm sure they( Sansa/Arya ) are still going to love Jon no matter what, he fought hard to place them back into Winterfell.

Arya loves him, probably on the show too. Show Sansa, who knows? They change her from one scene to the next and frankly, I do not trust her, especially so long as Littlefinger is alive and near her. He has mental power of her on this show that defies logic, even for a fantasy Universe. They show I do not trust either but another question is how will Dany take it when SHE finds out who Jon really is and if Jon is somehow legit (Kingsguard at Tower of Joy are big indication that he is) then she should be bending the knee to him, not the other way around. Just curious.

[Meera of Tarth]

22 hours ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

Jon might find out at the end of the season, after they have "relations". As far as his family goes, I do not see Sansa or Arya approving as she is a Targ and her Dad was a monster. The question I am wondering is, what will the reaction by by them when they find out Jon is not a Stark and is a Targ, therefore not the rightful King of the North and not a "Stark" in name after all?

oh this is good. then Lyanna's speech and the election might be anulled by default.

maybe then they would elect Bran.

[Lord Friendzone]

Just now, Meera of Tarth said:

oh this is good. then Lyanna's speech and the election might be anulled by default.

maybe then they would elect Bran.

Why are you so set on Bran this or that? Jon gave up the North, so it's now in the hands of Dany. She could make anyone including Jon Warden of the North. Could be even Bran but he's got his own purpose and that is as 3ER. He's not power hungry and undesrtands the threat. It seems fans want him to be something he might not even want to be or not be so "I want to be Lord of Winterfell" and same for Jon giving up his title. These guy of them all knows what is going on and that titles means fuck all when white walkers come. Jon as a natural leader will be important even without title, same Dany or Tyrion. Bran too with his knowledge. Jaime, Brienne, Hound and Jorah.

22 hours ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

Jon might find out at the end of the season, after they have "relations". As far as his family goes, I do not see Sansa or Arya approving as she is a Targ and her Dad was a monster. The question I am wondering is, what will the reaction by by them when they find out Jon is not a Stark and is a Targ, therefore not the rightful King of the North and not a "Stark" in name after all?

If Bran tells them the nature of Rhaegar's and Lyanna's relationship, why would they be mad at Jon? They'll still view him as brother and Stark. he's half Stark and they'll having other thing to do like dealing with like white walkers. Jon is not going to find out next season, season 8 is more likely going by the leaks info.

22 hours ago, GravyFace said:

There's uncle/niece marriages in the Stark family tree. Why would Jon be so opposed to it, if it's been his family history. 

Because Jon is Jon. He has his own head. But more or less Ned, being arg and his parents. That would be main thing for him to comprehend.

[Meera of Tarth]

because bran is the rightful heir. He deserves it and I think that Martin would not write a preductable story about a crippled boy with powers. i think he can have both things, although I don't know the ending of course. He likes writing about bastards, crippled and broken things. If the bastard and the dwarf can have different things maybe Bran will too.

of Jon is the rightful heir of the seven kingdoms someday Bran could be Lord or King again as he deserves.

[Commander Jon Snow]

In the books, Bran is not even the heir anymore because of Robb's will. If Bran becomes Lord of Winterfell, it will be because Jon dies or because Jon sits the IT. He will probably not be giving him his seat in either medium before the very end.

[Le Cygne]

13 hours ago, Meera of Tarth said:

because bran is the rightful heir. He deserves it and I think that Martin would not write a preductable story about a crippled boy with powers. i think he can have both things, although I don't know the ending of course. He likes writing about bastards, crippled and broken things. If the bastard and the dwarf can have different things maybe Bran will too.

of Jon is the rightful heir of the seven kingdoms someday Bran could be Lord or King again as he deserves.

Yeah, I think Jon is very mindful of such things, we saw his love for Rickon last season, and we saw his love for Bran when they parted. He knows Robb thought Bran, the rightful heir to Winterfell, was dead. Jon seems destined for the seven kingdoms, and Bran for Winterfell. Perhaps the final passage of the story will be like his first passage, only it will be something like this: The morning had dawned clear and bright, with a warmth that hinted at the end of winter. A time for wolves, a dream of spring...

[Lord Friendzone]

14 hours ago, Meera of Tarth said:

because bran is the rightful heir. He deserves it and I think that Martin would not write a preductable story about a crippled boy with powers. i think he can have both things, although I don't know the ending of course. He likes writing about bastards, crippled and broken things. If the bastard and the dwarf can have different things maybe Bran will too.

of Jon is the rightful heir of the seven kingdoms someday Bran could be Lord or King again as he deserves.

Not like truborn was ignored for a bastard. It seems D&D have their own mind and way of doing it. They'll  have what to do do with white walkers and Bran most of all knows it. Who is KitN, Lord of Winterfell or not. Thy got this bussines to sort out, then we can talk.

Jon is not rightful heir to Seven Kingdoms, as Viserys was named an heir by Aerys and it passes to Dany as the next one.

Bran could be Warden and Lord of Winterfell, whether Dany or whoever will sit on that chair. I hope his future is not only as a tree.

[Meera of Tarth]

On 24/11/2016 at 2:48 PM, Le Cygne said:

Yeah, I think Jon is very mindful of such things, we saw his love for Rickon last season, and we saw his love for Bran when they parted. He knows Robb thought Bran, the rightful heir to Winterfell, was dead. Jon seems destined for the seven kingdoms, and Bran for Winterfell. Perhaps the final passage of the story will be like his first passage, only it will be something like this: The morning had dawned clear and bright, with a warmth that hinted at the end of winter. A time for wolves, a dream of spring...

wow, that would make a superb pargraph!  Bran the last POV

[A Ghost of Someone]

I do not exactly see Jon surviving the story. books and show. I may be wrong and I kinda hope I am but I think he dies. As for Dany, well, I have no use for her but I would prefer Northern Independence. The Targs are like a plague that has infected Westeros. The show may not play this out but when the Starks first surrendered the Kingdom when Torhen knelt, it may have set off a chain of events or atmosphere if you will, that allowed the Others/White Walkers to come back. Kings of Winter, that means something, Winterfell, that means something too. That Kingdom bend the knee and the crown was surrendered to the Sister F er x 2 = Aegon the Conqueror. I think the North needs to be free and it needs to have the Starks as Kings. This is again probably more fore the books as the show is a twisted nightmare of incest promotion and we know that Dany and Jon are Nephew and Aunt. I hope it does not go that far.

[Sir Matthis Light]

51 minutes ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

I do not exactly see Jon surviving the story. books and show. I may be wrong and I kinda hope I am but I think he dies. As for Dany, well, I have no use for her but I would prefer Northern Independence. The Targs are like a plague that has infected Westeros. The show may not play this out but when the Starks first surrendered the Kingdom when Torhen knelt, it may have set off a chain of events or atmosphere if you will, that allowed the Others/White Walkers to come back. Kings of Winter, that means something, Winterfell, that means something too. That Kingdom bend the knee and the crown was surrendered to the Sister F er x 2 = Aegon the Conqueror. I think the North needs to be free and it needs to have the Starks as Kings. This is again probably more fore the books as the show is a twisted nightmare of incest promotion and we know that Dany and Jon are Nephew and Aunt. I hope it does not go that far.

So you think due to the Starks surrendering their Kingship to House Targaryen that allowed the Others to start coming back? Gotta say I personally don't think so, but it is interesting to think about. It seems more likely their coming back has something to due with the lack of magic over the centuries since the time of Aegon "The Younger", then it sudden reappearance.

 

[A Ghost of Someone]

Just now, Sir Matthis Light said:

So you think due to the Starks surrendering their Kingship to House Targaryen that allowed the Others to start coming back? Gotta say I personally don't think so, but it is interesting to think about. It seems more likely their coming back has something to due with the lack of magic over the centuries since the time of Aegon "The Younger", then it sudden reappearance.

 

In the books, it may have something to do with it but GRRM has not given a lot of info on them. He has promissed that in TWOW, due, well overdue, that we will see what REALLY lies in the far North. As for the show, they are not that complex and they do not care so it will not be that much of a factor most likely.

[Le Cygne]

5 hours ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

I do not exactly see Jon surviving the story. books and show. I may be wrong and I kinda hope I am but I think he dies. As for Dany, well, I have no use for her but I would prefer Northern Independence. The Targs are like a plague that has infected Westeros. The show may not play this out but when the Starks first surrendered the Kingdom when Torhen knelt, it may have set off a chain of events or atmosphere if you will, that allowed the Others/White Walkers to come back. Kings of Winter, that means something, Winterfell, that means something too. That Kingdom bend the knee and the crown was surrendered to the Sister F er x 2 = Aegon the Conqueror. I think the North needs to be free and it needs to have the Starks as Kings. This is again probably more fore the books as the show is a twisted nightmare of incest promotion and we know that Dany and Jon are Nephew and Aunt. I hope it does not go that far.

All of this. Rather than yet more incest.

[Lord Friendzone]

10 hours ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

I do not exactly see Jon surviving the story. books and show. I may be wrong and I kinda hope I am but I think he dies. As for Dany, well, I have no use for her but I would prefer Northern Independence. The Targs are like a plague that has infected Westeros. The show may not play this out but when the Starks first surrendered the Kingdom when Torhen knelt, it may have set off a chain of events or atmosphere if you will, that allowed the Others/White Walkers to come back. Kings of Winter, that means something, Winterfell, that means something too. That Kingdom bend the knee and the crown was surrendered to the Sister F er x 2 = Aegon the Conqueror. I think the North needs to be free and it needs to have the Starks as Kings. This is again probably more fore the books as the show is a twisted nightmare of incest promotion and we know that Dany and Jon are Nephew and Aunt. I hope it does not go that far.

I see Jon being a reluctant King, who will hate ruling and living in KL or elsewhere than Winterfell, death is another option but he already died so.

We don't know much about the Others and what brought them back. It's easy to blame Targs for everything and in this fandom it seems to be a popular opinion. Don't think Torrhen kneeling to Aegon set of chain of events. Targs do played a part  but so we can did others. Not like Starks are out of this because they're responsible too (if we'e going by this logic), but let's throw it on only Targs.

Btw it's not an incest according to the laws of Westeros. It even it's not like if Jon did it with Sansa or Arya that would be to many a lot more gross...but still not an incest relationship. Plausible, so can you and other please not saying it's an incest, when it isn't. Even if they'll have a kid, who's to say it wouldn't perfectly healthy kid.

North needs to be free, needs this or that. I like them too more than anybody but you're pushing it too far.

[A Ghost of Someone]

1 hour ago, Lord Friendzone said:

I see Jon being a reluctant King, who will hate ruling and living in KL or elsewhere than Winterfell, death is another option but he already died so.

We don't know much about the Others and what brought them back. It's easy to blame Targs for everything and in this fandom it seems to be a popular opinion. Don't think Torrhen kneeling to Aegon set of chain of events. Targs do played a part  but so we can did others. Not like Starks are out of this because they're responsible too (if we'e going by this logic), but let's throw it on only Targs.

Btw it's not an incest according to the laws of Westeros. It even it's not like if Jon did it with Sansa or Arya that would be to many a lot more gross...but still not an incest relationship. Plausible, so can you and other please not saying it's an incest, when it isn't. Even if they'll have a kid, who's to say it wouldn't perfectly healthy kid.

North needs to be free, needs this or that. I like them too more than anybody but you're pushing it too far.

Jon may or may not live, same with just about everyone

I have many issues with the Targs and my possible theory on the connection with "awakening" the others is not concrete, obviously. No, incest practicing is just one red flag as far as "something is wrong" with them. Westeros is no better off after 300 years of the Iron Throne and some of the Kingdoms are worse than others. The North most likely had supporting funds for the Wall/Night's Watch squeezed away to KIng's Landing and considering the current situation with the Night's King/Others and the depleted watch, that has been a huge problem.

As far is incest goes, brother/sister, aunt/uncle, nephew/neice is pretty damn bad, fantasy or not.

[Le Cygne]

35 minutes ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

Jon may or may not live, same with just about everyone

I have many issues with the Targs and my possible theory on the connection with "awakening" the others is not concrete, obviously. No, incest practicing is just one red flag as far as "something is wrong" with them. Westeros is no better off after 300 years of the Iron Throne and some of the Kingdoms are worse than others. The North most likely had supporting funds for the Wall/Night's Watch squeezed away to KIng's Landing and considering the current situation with the Night's King/Others and the depleted watch, that has been a huge problem.

As far is incest goes, brother/sister, aunt/uncle, nephew/neice is pretty damn bad, fantasy or not.

Yeah, incest is tragic, in fact, the subject of many tragic plays.

Those tragic plays, there's usually something that goes like this:

I am no maester to quote history at you, Your Grace. Swords have been my life, not books. But every child knows that the Targaryens have always danced too close to madness. Your father was not the first. King Jaehaerys once told me that madness and greatness are two sides of the same coin. Every time a new Targaryen is born, he said, the gods toss the coin in the air and the world holds its breath to see how it will land.

[A Ghost of Someone]

29 minutes ago, Le Cygne said:

Yeah, incest is tragic, in fact, the subject of many tragic plays.

Those tragic plays, there's usually something that goes like this:

I am no maester to quote history at you, Your Grace. Swords have been my life, not books. But every child knows that the Targaryens have always danced too close to madness. Your father was not the first. King Jaehaerys once told me that madness and greatness are two sides of the same coin. Every time a new Targaryen is born, he said, the gods toss the coin in the air and the world holds its breath to see how it will land.

That is the quote right from the product and practicer of Incest itself and SO TRUE. He married his own sister, against the wishes of his father Aegon VI who was enlightened enough to see that incest was really bad but he let them do it anyway. UGHH

[Lord Friendzone]

1 hour ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

Jon may or may not live, same with just about everyone

I have many issues with the Targs and my possible theory on the connection with "awakening" the others is not concrete, obviously. No, incest practicing is just one red flag as far as "something is wrong" with them. Westeros is no better off after 300 years of the Iron Throne and some of the Kingdoms are worse than others. The North most likely had supporting funds for the Wall/Night's Watch squeezed away to KIng's Landing and considering the current situation with the Night's King/Others and the depleted watch, that has been a huge problem.

As far is incest goes, brother/sister, aunt/uncle, nephew/neice is pretty damn bad, fantasy or not.

Going by the books, I'd be inclined to say he lives and rules.

Brother/sister and parent/child is considering incest, rest not. Because look Ned's parents were cousins and how their kids turned out. Not exactly mad. Making stupid decisions Lyanna, Brandon? Yes, but that is not exactly being mad, insane or unhealthy. Plenty of people within the story made those.

It seems a lot of people including Northerners started to slowly overlook Night's Watch and White Walkers threat as the years went by. i'd say  all the powerful families and house contributed to current situation. Targs on the top are seen as the main one. If Iam not mistaken, George's favourite House is Targaryen and he wrote quite a lot stuff on them.

[Le Cygne]

Aunt/nephew and uncle/niece incest is a parent's sibling having sex with his child. Lots of bad things in Westeros are not against the law. If aunt and nephew have sex, they will have them do it then find out they are related. That's how stories go. And stories like this don't end well.

See: Oedipus. However, the baby was found by shepherds and raised by King Polybus and Queen Merope as their own. Oedipus learned from the oracle at Delphi of the prophecy that he would end up killing his father and marrying his mother but, unaware of his true parentage...

The story didn't end well.

[Le Cygne]

Quote

In the Empire chat with fans, Martin reveals that his favourite House is Stark, because, “After all, it all began with the Starks.”

http://www.hypable.com/game-of-thrones-author-george-r-r-martin-stark-is-my-favourite-house/

[A Ghost of Someone]

1 hour ago, Lord Friendzone said:

Going by the books, I'd be inclined to say he lives and rules.

Brother/sister and parent/child is considering incest, rest not. Because look Ned's parents were cousins and how their kids turned out. Not exactly mad. Making stupid decisions Lyanna, Brandon? Yes, but that is not exactly being mad, insane or unhealthy. Plenty of people within the story made those.

It seems a lot of people including Northerners started to slowly overlook Night's Watch and White Walkers threat as the years went by. i'd say  all the powerful families and house contributed to current situation. Targs on the top are seen as the main one. If Iam not mistaken, George's favourite House is Targaryen and he wrote quite a lot stuff on them.

Huge difference between firs cousins and siblings, aunt/ uncle and especially generation after generation.