mormont Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Well, we can hope. Besides, it's apt given his campaign's apparent resurrection from the dead at the last... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S John Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Reading Scot's post in the last thread that his parents are voting for Trump. Yep.... mine too. And all three of my living grandparents are voting for Trump. Beyond that, I have one uncle out of a total of the 16 aunts/uncles I have that will definitely not vote for Trump. One. My sister and I are suitably horrified, but unsurprised. Honestly probably any Republican would pick up their votes but I knew that my dad voted for Kasich in the primary and my mom for Rubio, so I was hoping that since neither of them wanted Trump to get the nomination that they might at least vote 3rd party. Surely they are gonna take a pass on Trump, right? I know that they DO have objections to him, I have heard with my own ears my dad calling Trump a clown. But, at the end of the day, I really think that a couple of decades of Clinton thrashing in right wing media has done its job. Clinton, to them, is THE DEVIL. Nobody could possibly be worse than Clinton. I've spoken to a few of my cousins that are close to my age about this and my family is pretty much exactly what you would expect as far as how white folks are voting in this election. The older ones w/ blue collar backgrounds and w/o college degrees are voting for Trump. The younger ones w/ a college education are for Clinton, or probably more accurately - just horrified by Trump enough that they are going to vote for Clinton. I wish the old farts would all just stay at home. I feel like that generation has left us with enough bullshit to solve as my generation is beginning to get into office-holding age. It's like they just want to kick us in the head one more time, and with Trump they're gonna make it a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sologdin Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 23 minutes ago, mormont said: Well, we can hope. Besides, it's apt given his campaign's apparent resurrection from the dead at the last... nietzsche wrote about this, as i recall it, in his zarathustra: Quote When Zarathustra had spoken these words, he again looked at the people, and was silent. And to his heart he said: There they stand; there they laugh: they do not understand me; I am not the mouth for these ears. Must one first batter their ears, that they may learn to hear with their eyes? Must one clatter like kettledrums and penitential preachers? Or do they only believe the stammerer? They have something of which they are proud. What do they call it, that which makes them proud? Culture, they call it; it distinguishes them from the goatherds. They dislike, therefore, to hear of “contempt” of themselves. So I will appeal to their pride. I will speak to them of the most contemptible thing: that, however, is the Last Trump!" And thus spoke Zarathustra to the people: It is time for man to fix his goal. It is time for man to plant the seed of his highest hope. His soil is still rich enough for it. But that soil will one day be poor and exhausted, and no lofty tree will any longer be able to grow there. Alas! there comes the time when man will no longer launch the arrow of his longing beyond man -- and the string of his bow will have unlearned to whiz! I tell you: one must still have chaos in oneself, to give birth to a dancing star. I tell you: you have still chaos in yourselves. Alas! There comes the time when man will no longer give birth to any star. Alas! There comes the time of the most despicable man, who can no longer despise himself. Lo! I show you the Last Trump. "What is love? What is creation? What is longing? What is a star?" -- so asks the Last Trump, and blinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 S John, What I don't understand is that my strong sense if fairness and compassion... comes from my parents. How can we see this so differnetly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IheartIheartTesla Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 If Trump/Clinton lose Florida, I wonder if Republicans/Democrats would blame Johnson/Stein for 4 years of corruption/anarchy? Its election-based create your own story. Senate forecasts have moved a bit towards D, makes me feel a little better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris the Blade Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 I know a few family members of mine are voting for Trump. They can go die in a car fire for all I care at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerPaladin Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Won't vote for Trump, can't vote for Clinton, and Gary Johnson proved he was a doofus. I'm leaving the line blank. Looking out across the landscape, the picture is similar to John and Scot's. Older republicans are 100% on board for Trump, older democrats are 100% on board for Clinton. Of the middle aged like myself, there are a few still holding on for Gary Johnson, and a lot of "disgusted with the whole process" types, who are split. Still a good amount of Trump support among the "college educated", but my circle are business and engineering degrees. Shockingly, there is a cohort of Trump support among the younger folks I know. I think there might be a strong vein of "let it burn" among some millennials, they certainly aren't supporting Trump for his policy positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Walker Texas Ranger Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Because Hillary Clinton is the devil. Something something emails, something something Benghazi. But imagine if Kanye West in 2016 was running, and he was being as incomprhensible and almsot as offensive as Trump. And his opponent was Donald Rumsfeld. And a few spots in the Supreme Court were at stake, would you consider Making America Ye Again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S John Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 12 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: S John, What I don't understand is that my strong sense if fairness and compassion... comes from my parents. How can we see this so differnetly? I know, same, I don't understand it either. 5 minutes ago, Boris the Blade said: I know a few family members of mine are voting for Trump. They can go die in a car fire for all I care at this point. Kind of hard to take your anti-Trump vitriol seriously when you prove yourself equally vile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maithanet Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 4 minutes ago, SerPaladin said: Won't vote for Trump, can't vote for Clinton, and Gary Johnson proved he was a doofus. I'm leaving the line blank. Out of curiosity, would you support the Libertarian party reaching 5% to get public funding next election? Because if so, you could make the pragmatic argument that you could vote for Johnson in spite of being a doofus, because you already know he won't win anyway, and perhaps the next Libertarian would be more impressive. But if you don't feel any particular affinity towards the Libertarians, then it doesn't really matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Boris, I don't give or retract my love for family members based upon how they cast their ballots on Election Day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maithanet Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 4 minutes ago, White Walker Texas Ranger said: Because Hillary Clinton is the devil. Something something emails, something something Benghazi. But imagine if Kanye West in 2016 was running, and he was being as incomprhensible and almsot as offensive as Trump. And his opponent was Donald Rumsfeld. And a few spots in the Supreme Court were at stake, would you consider Making America Ye Again? I've heard this hypothetical before, but I just don't know how useful it is. Without hearing the awful things that West has hypothetically said, and seeing why Democrats are inexplicably voting for him in the primary, it is impossible to say. All I can say that I vastly prefer Dick Cheney to Donald Trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Most of my family are voting for Trump. It confirms all the reasons I've estranged myself from these deplorables. I have one aunt who tries to pretend she's mildly intellectual and she keeps writing that she just doesn't know how to make a choice because they are both so similar and equally bad. I've let her know several times that they are very different candidates. Most recently I finally just told her she's a Trump voter based on every meme she posts which confirms her deplorable title and that her wavering is really more that she hasn't come to terms with the fact that Trump's candidacy and her implied support for every position of his confirms that she's an avowed bigot when she's been trying to pretend for her whole life that she's above all that. She was upset by that and replied with "Well, I'm certainly not voting for Hillary now." As if you ever were, Auntie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGimletEye Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 22 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: S John, What I don't understand is that my strong sense if fairness and compassion... comes from my parents. How can we see this so differnetly? I can feel you on this one. I was one of those "rednecks for Obama". Accordingly, I know more than my fair share of Trump Supporters and Republicans. Some of the ones I know can be pleasant enough people. So why do they support Trump? The reason is because have convinced themselves to believe in a bunch of nonsense. And to them that nonsense seem logical. And conservative media has effectively demonized Hillary. And they buy into that bullshit. It really isn't difficult to demolish their positions. But, on a personal level, I don't initiate political discussions with friends and family and I don't try to preach to them because it's pretty much pointless. Reasoned arguments will not get them to change their views unfortunately. And fact is that I have known many of these people for a long time and care about many of them, even if I find their political positions atrocious. It' complicated I know. On the other hand, I won't take a lick of shit from any friends or family for supporting Hillary and the Democratic Party, and I've open about that for a long time, and I'll chew and flame that conservative ass if they start with their nonsense and they know it. I don't have many that try to cross me anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sologdin Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 19 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: I don't give or retract my love for family members based upon how they cast their ballots on Election Day. ZOMG i do. unconditional is reserved for children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shryke Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 27 minutes ago, SerPaladin said: Won't vote for Trump, can't vote for Clinton, and Gary Johnson proved he was a doofus. I'm leaving the line blank. Looking out across the landscape, the picture is similar to John and Scot's. Older republicans are 100% on board for Trump, older democrats are 100% on board for Clinton. Of the middle aged like myself, there are a few still holding on for Gary Johnson, and a lot of "disgusted with the whole process" types, who are split. Still a good amount of Trump support among the "college educated", but my circle are business and engineering degrees. Shockingly, there is a cohort of Trump support among the younger folks I know. I think there might be a strong vein of "let it burn" among some millennials, they certainly aren't supporting Trump for his policy positions. More then likely millennials voting Trump are mostly just young bigoted white men. There is no shortage of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 I've got a few tea party family members (all in Florida) sprinkled among an otherwise liberal to extremely liberal extended family, so they'd probably vote Trump. Except they're all Jewish, and they really don't like the anti-semitism stuff. I suspect they'll end up leaving the line blank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris the Blade Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 27 minutes ago, S John said: I know, same, I don't understand it either. Kind of hard to take your anti-Trump vitriol seriously when you prove yourself equally vile. Yea, nah, don't pull that false equilency being intolerant of bigotry is intolerance bullshit with me. I have zero respect or love for people that support Trump and agree whole heartedly with his oppressive and fascist policies. That includes family. I'm under no obligation to be civil to uncivilized people and hold their fucking hands or walk on eggshells with them. Fuck them. 25 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: Boris, I don't give or retract my love for family members based upon how they cast their ballots on Election Day. Well that's you. You can love people that support candiates that have horrible and oppressive policies and think certain demographics in the US don't deserve rights and to be treated equally or have a right to make their own choices, all you want. I realize what supporting candiates like Trump and Pence means. I do not love my enemy, and make no mistake, Trump and Pence supporters are the enemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maarsen Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 24 minutes ago, Maithanet said: I've heard this hypothetical before, but I just don't know how useful it is. Without hearing the awful things that West has hypothetically said, and seeing why Democrats are inexplicably voting for him in the primary, it is impossible to say. All I can say that I vastly prefer Dick Cheney to Donald Trump. Competent evil vs. incompetent evil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shryke Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 From last thread, by Scot: Quote Shryke, Do you mean that after one party "takes all the prizes" they use law and regulation to reinforce their control of all parts of the National Government making the "one party system" perminant? That really does sound frightening. I can hear the "even if there is only one party it's your duty as a citizen to go out and vote" shaming now. Not really no. If for no other reason then that, in the proud tradition of the left-wing throughout history, the minute the right-wing fades into the background is the minute the knives come out for those on the left-wing who aren't as correct as you are. But my point was more that the only real chance the US has right now of having a fully functioning government is for one party to control like the Presidency and the House and the Senate. Because the alternative will involve one of the sides slamming everything into gridlock. Because the system allows it and because the voters would support it and frankly, their voters to some extent would not be wrong to do so. This is, needless to say, a big problem. If your government starts grinding to a halt the minute you have split party control, you done got problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.