US Elections: Groper in Chief

[Week]

2 minutes ago, TheKitttenGuard said:

The taxes she face in some are more regressive based and those can be supported by Liberals as Sin Tax with it's morale judgement.  She can no longer attempt NJ since to hike up the gas tax by $.26 cents one good.  Philadelphia has its 2% sales tax on top of state's 7%.

Liberal and Leftists have a reputation of not caring how effective the taxes are taken are done and how to get them.  They look to get more and not care how make more with that they have.

Completely unrelated to the voting for the presidency. You brought up her vote for Trump was related to taxes - how is this relevant to her vote for Trump?

Conservatives have a reputation for support tax cuts for the rich and for business which have consistent lead to poor growth and great income inequality. Are you really arguing that Liberals typically support more regressive tax policies? I agree they support generally higher taxes, however suggesting (with a broad brush) that liberals support regressive taxes as a matter of policy is either incorrect or dishonest.

[LongRider]

23 minutes ago, Silverstar said:

As a fellow Brit, I agree. I don't really get the hatred. I don't really get the unlikeability charges either. She seems no less likeable than any other US politician I've seen much of. Certainly no less likeable than either Trump or Bernie. 

Maybe it's partly a cultural thing to some extent - maybe she'd do far better here in the UK - though I certainly know some people here in the UK who dislike her, but following the elections this time around, the whole thing has utterly bemused me. I really don't get it.

The Clinton hate began in Bill Clinton's presidency and was amplified by the right wing and the nascent Fox News.  The talk shows and the radio shows became echo chambers that amplified all the bogus scandals of Whitewater, suicide of Vince Foster and others.  Speculation and lies were repeated and repeated and repeated until it became a frenzy and then went into overdrive with the payoff being the Lewinsky affair.  Bill Clinton was impeached and Hilary didn't divorce him.

These made fringe elements like Rush Limbaugh a household name while making him very rich.  Hilary was a ripe target because she was a feminist and an activist and as such a complete insult to the right wing.  She was tainted by not divorcing Bill and being an outspoken woman.  Has she made mistakes?  Sure, but with all the investigations out there, she has to be charged with anything. 

So Hilary hate is baked in and she has alot of baggage, much of which is quite bogus really.  During this past election season, the media, which is not liberal, constantly told us over and over that Clinton was unlikable and wasn't trusted and had emails and I heard this repeated on broadcasts for many months.  Some many reports always include the 'not likeable or trusht worthy' memes, and really they usually weren't pertaining to the reports. 

The MSM just couldn't get over talking about Clinton without bringing these up, so it was hard to hear her policies and ideas, but lots of rehashing old news and emails galore.  Much of this added to her defeat.

 

[Martell Spy]

Latino groups argue exit polls were too generous to Trump

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/latino-groups-exit-polls-donald-trump-231268

 

One Person Shot at Anti-Trump Rally in Oregon as Protests Continue Across U.S.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/11/12/one_shot_at_anti_trump_rally_in_oregon_as_protests_continue_across_u_s.html

 

A Million Women Are Planning to March on D.C. When Trump Takes Office

http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/11/a-million-women-to-march-on-d-c-when-trump-takes-office.html

[Future Null Infinity]

Turkey issues travel alert for the United States, citing surge in xenophobic and racist harassment as well as anti-Trump protests

http://usa.liveuamap.com/en/2016/12-november-turkey-issues-travel-alert-for-the-united-states

 

[LongRider]

Quote

•  

 

As President-elect Donald Trump prepares to move into the White House, one of the largest KKK groups in the country is preparing a parade in his honor.

The Loyal White Knights of Pelham, N.C., — “perhaps the most active Klan group in the United States,” according to the Anti-Defamation League — says on its website it is planning a “Victory Klavalkade Klan Parade” for Dec. 3 to celebrate Trump’s election win.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/n-kkk-group-hold-victory-parade-donald-trump-article-1.2868491

[Chaircat Meow]

54 minutes ago, Silverstar said:

 

As a fellow Brit, I agree. I don't really get the hatred. I don't really get the unlikeability charges either. She seems no less likeable than any other US politician I've seen much of. Certainly no less likeable than either Trump or Bernie. 

Maybe it's partly a cultural thing to some extent - maybe she'd do far better here in the UK - though I certainly know some people here in the UK who dislike her, but following the elections this time around, the whole thing has utterly bemused me. I really don't get it. 

Blair.

[Ormond]

A few comments after reading most of this thread fairly nonstop:

I think Kalbear's analysis does show that more of the problem in her loss was Clinton's failure to draw out Democratic voters than it was a matter of Trump mobilizing new voters, especially in WI, MI, and PA. However, I do wonder if a county level analysis instead of a statewide analysis might modify that a bit. I don't have time to try to look up data myself (I really shouldn't be taking the time I have today with this  ), but my impression is that Republican turnout did increase in small town and rural areas. For total Republican turnout to be just about the same in Wisconsin and only a bit increased in PA and MI might mean that Trump did turn out blue collar Republicans better than Romney while his turnout among college-educated Republicans was down -- but that the latter, just like all those uninspired Democrats, simply didn't vote for President at all instead of voting for Hillary Clinton.

I also wonder if the difference in Florida was that college educated Republican turnout might have stayed high there because of the fact that a way higher % of them in Florida than elsewhere would be over age 70 -- the elderly are most likely to see it as a civic duty to vote no matter what, and the "Silent Generation" which is now between 70 and 85 are the generation that is most skewed toward the Republicans in their preferences relative to the population as a whole, having their political identifications originally shaped by Eisenhower.

As for the Lena Dunham article that was linked to -- I really don't know what this woman's position in the campaign was, but I am both empathetic and frustrated by the part of her article where she says "it was her job!". Personally I think perhaps a bit too much of the "blaming" about the choices the Democrats made in this election is focused on Wasserman-Shultz, Brazile, and other top leadership at the DNC, because I think they were the tip of the iceberg of tens of thousands of liberal feminists out there (not all of them women) who were chomping at the bit ever since Obama defeated Hillary in 2008 to see her break the glass ceiling, and were just incapable of seeing that all the negatives she had, deserved or not, would make her a poor candidate for 2016. I think a lot of these people (most Baby Boomer age) WERE really inspired by Hillary, and they just couldn't get it how many younger and/or less educated Democrats just couldn't feel their enthusiasm. That plus there was way too much complacency on depending on millions of people to be so scared of Trump that would vote for Hillary just to keep him out of office. Instead a lot of Trump's scariness just made less educated Democratic voters, especially minorities, turned off by the political system as a whole (as mentioned in the article about Hispanic voters linked to previously.)

Personally I am really scared of Trump and think the whole thing is a tragedy. But it's hard for me to see how anybody else except Hillary could have really gotten the Democratic nomination this year, whether or not there was some unfair favoritism toward her by DNC leaders. I think we had a horde of Democratic feminists who just were incapable of seeing how much less inspiring to the electorate as a whole Clinton was compared with Obama.

[maarsen]

I have been reading a lot,  not just here, about why Trump was a winner.  Elites have hurt the US and politicians only look after themselves so the people have decided to reverse the trend. Or to put it simply, smart people have cause all my problems so I will fix everything by electing stupider people. 

Can't wait to see how that works out. 

[Liffguard]

21 minutes ago, Chaircat Meow said:

Blair.

What about him?

[Fez]

Lost in the shuffle of everything else, I just saw that voters in Maine approved a referendum to implement ranked choice voting beginning in 2018. Very cool. And, considering how often there's strong third party challengers in Maine, particularly useful for the state.

[Liver and Onions]

1 minute ago, Fez said:

Lost in the shuffle of everything else, I just saw that voters in Maine approved a referendum to implement ranked choice voting beginning in 2018. Very cool. And, considering how often there's strong third party challengers in Maine, particularly useful for the state.

A friend just explained ranked choice voting to me. She pointed out how it would encourage campaigns to reach across the aisle to voter who, under normal circumstances, would not pick their candidate. "Sure, this person's not your first choice, but what about your second?" 

[Wrl6199]

Just now, Liver and Onions said:

A friend just explained ranked choice voting to me. She pointed out how it would encourage campaigns to reach across the aisle to voter who, under normal circumstances, would not pick their candidate. "Sure, this person's not your first choice, but what about your second?" 

I feel like some people still would not vote for some person if they truly hate them.

[Liver and Onions]

Just now, Wrl6199 said:

I feel like some people still would not vote for some person if they truly hate them.

This is very true, but it would get people talking to each other.

[Wrl6199]

1 minute ago, Liver and Onions said:

This is very true, but it would get people talking to each other.

Maybe.

[felice]

23 minutes ago, Fez said:

Lost in the shuffle of everything else, I just saw that voters in Maine approved a referendum to implement ranked choice voting beginning in 2018.

Ooh, that's excellent news! I hope it spreads to other states.

[Little Scribe of Naath]

3 hours ago, DraculaAD1972 said:

Except the rape charge was withdrawn -and Trump got more votes from African-Americans and Latinos than the previous two republican candidates. Hillary lost because many African-American and Latino voters saw through her facade. Something many Hillary voters were unable to do. Perhaps the black vote heard how Hillary's mentor was a Klansman and decided that Trump was actually the least racist of the two. Or more likely saw her as a white privileged puppet of wall street, Saudi Arabia and god knows who else.

What evidence is there for this? Exit polls? The same ones which predicted a Clinton win? It's a genuine question.

[sToNED_CAT]

26 minutes ago, Little Scribe of Naath said:

What evidence is there for this? Exit polls? The same ones which predicted a Clinton win? It's a genuine question.

 

Yes. So in reality his support from minorities was likely even higher.

[DraculaAD1972]

According to New York Times, national exit polls give Trump 29% of the Latino vote compared with 27 for Romney, with Hillary taking 65% compared with 71 for Obama. Trump got over half of the white female vote. This explodes the myth that Trump relied on racism against Latinos and misogny against women, in order to win the election. 

[Wrl6199]

3 minutes ago, DraculaAD1972 said:

According to New York Times, national exit polls give Trump 29% of the Latino vote compared with 27 for Romney, with Hillary taking 65% compared with 71 for Obama. Trump got over half of the white female vote. This explodes the myth that Trump relied on racism against Latinos and misogny against women, in order to win the election. 

Why of course. I mean we all can see how mitt Romney was so much meaner to Latinos tn Donald trump. Oh and how about how Hillary was worse for women then Obama.

[Little Scribe of Naath]

Umm.....that's kind of the point? NYT predicted using exit polls, that Clinton would win, and they were wrong? How exactly are these polls reliable now?