Rant and Rave without Repercussions [S7 Leaks Edition]

[Meera of Tarth]

7 minutes ago, Liver and Onions said:

And the Jon/Dany thing reminds me of how, when my mom read the first book years ago, she told me she hoped Jon and Dany would eventually get together (close in age, both major characters, etc.) But then later I told her about the Theory, and she was all, "well, now I don't want them together anymore." Is the audience supposed to forget they are aunt and nephew? Is it oh so romantic like Jaime and Cersei? 

I need a clip of Futurama Richard Nixon saying, "I don't like where this is heading..."

I think that the audience will dislike it after knowing this. And they are doing this bc of further drama. 

[Liver and Onions]

Just now, Meera of Tarth said:

I think that the audience will dislike it after knowing this. And they are doing this bc of further drama. 

It's like a giant troll move- get the audience to be behind the love story- Jon and Dany are in bed the morning after, all blissful and gazing into each others' eyes,  and then Tyrion, drink in hand, walks by the (open?) door and says, "way to nail your aunt, Jon." He continues on his way, still drinking and knowing things. Then Pod leans in the doorway with a trombone to play a loud, "WAH WAHHHH." 

[divica]

30 minutes ago, Meera of Tarth said:

I think that the audience will dislike it after knowing this. And they are doing this bc of further drama. 

How many people are really bothered by them being aunt and nephew? We are talking about 2 people that never met each other, have sex and then find out they are related. In grrm world a relation between aunt and nephew doesn t seem weird... (don t know how it will play out in the show)

And don t forget that a lot of people like the pairing jon/sansa which should be even more disturbing. They grew up as siblings and after sudenly learning they are cousins it is ok to have sex? jon/sansa is more similar to cercei/Jaime than jon/danny.

[WolfOfWinter]

Have we ever seen any other aunt/nephew or uncle/niece couple on this show? The only incestuous pairings I can think of are Craster and his daughters (depicted as depraved for various reasons) and Jaime and Cersei (eliciting disgust in everyone except Myrcella and the Dornish, apparently), but who else? Tywin and Joanna were cousins in the books but there is no mention of it in the show and cousins getting together isn't even considered incest in most parts of the real world anyway. D&D can't even get behind polyamory (since Rhaegar divorces Elia in the show) or the bedding ceremony (Cat reminiscing), so what are the chances they're actually gonna portray an aunt and her nephew banging in a positive light?

It's so obvious they're setting up future drama between Jon and Dany since neither will learn about R+L=J until season 8. No way they're dragging the reveal out for two seasons for no reason. Factor in that new spoilers say Varys flat out tells Dany his loyalty is to whoever cares about the people and not Dany specifically, Varys doubting Dany's sanity and being turned off by her actions and the spoilers that Jon's real name is Aegon and that Varys might end up supporting an Aegon in the show as well, and it's glaringly obvious what they're doing. 

[Davros Seaworth]

1 hour ago, Liver and Onions said:

So... if the spoiler of Dany and Jon GIVING the Night's King a dragon is true... (have I got that right?)... um... WHY? Does it die somewhere else and they don't want to waste it? Are they pals with the White Walkers now? So confused... (should I spoiler tag this?) Maybe the polled audience liked the idea of a dragon going evil... less so the "how" of the situation. 

Also, does anyone else snort with laughter at the possibility of Gilly finding an annulment for Rhaegar's marriage? Um... so he's not allowed to take a second wife? Makes it all neat and tidy! 

And the Jon/Dany thing reminds me of how, when my mom read the first book years ago, she told me she hoped Jon and Dany would eventually get together (close in age, both major characters, etc.) But then later I told her about the Theory, and she was all, "well, now I don't want them together anymore." Is the audience supposed to forget they are aunt and nephew? Is it oh so romantic like Jaime and Cersei? 

I need a clip of Futurama Richard Nixon saying, "I don't like where this is heading..."

The plot is so thin you'd struggle to spread it over half a piece of toast.

[Meera of Tarth]

1 hour ago, Liver and Onions said:

It's like a giant troll move- get the audience to be behind the love story- Jon and Dany are in bed the morning after, all blissful and gazing into each others' eyes,  and then Tyrion, drink in hand, walks by the (open?) door and says, "way to nail your aunt, Jon." He continues on his way, still drinking and knowing things. Then Pod leans in the doorway with a trombone to play a loud, "WAH WAHHHH." 

ahahahaha I can totally picture it!

[Meera of Tarth]

1 hour ago, divica said:

How many people are really bothered by them being aunt and nephew? We are talking about 2 people that never met each other, have sex and then find out they are related. In grrm world a relation between aunt and nephew doesn t seem weird... (don t know how it will play out in the show)

And don t forget that a lot of people like the pairing jon/sansa which should be even more disturbing. They grew up as siblings and after sudenly learning they are cousins it is ok to have sex? jon/sansa is more similar to cercei/Jaime than jon/danny.

people will be disturbed bc people are bored of nasty incest dyring years (having twincest and Craster as examples of how this is bad). Actually avunculate incest is gross even in Asoiaf world, it's worse than marriage between cousins which is accepted if it happens. So investing in a love story that some people will lile (others won't because they just have nothing in common but some only watchers might like thrm together bc they are protagonists and it's cool and these things...) and thrn turn it into another incest drama won't be something to like. People won't like the revlation after the boatsex.

as for Jonsa, yes it's more disturbing but I don't think it has more fans than, other pairings like, let's say Jaime and Brienne. They make lots of fan arts but the general viewer is not invested in Jonsa bc it's ridiculous. They are a minority even if they make a lot of noise. if we look up in the internet we can find very odd 'ships', like Sam and Jon. That doesn't mean these ships need attention, or that they are not ridiculous so as to even discuss them further or compare them to other pairings from the leaks.

[SecretWeapon]

6 hours ago, Horse of Kent said:

Well there are pretty major protests in Venezuela currently, right? And Cersei blew up the Westerosi Vatican.

Yes, and it took 14 years of Chavez government + 4 years of Maduro governement to get to this point. If she's keeping the military paid and fed she'll be fine enough for a while.

I remember reading Cersei will blame Tommen on the Sept attack but idk if it was confirmed.

[Le Cygne]

6 hours ago, Horse of Kent said:

Well there are pretty major protests in Venezuela currently, right? And Cersei blew up the Westerosi Vatican.

Yeah, they never actually showed why she was in power.

So since this is the rants thread and all... That's a big problem with the show, that they leave a lot of stuff up to the viewers to come up with reasons on their own.

[Christi84]

_{D&D are probably counting on viewers not even realizing theyre related TBH. Like people wont remember Rhaegar is Dany's brother, that viewers will think Jon is a Targaryen, but not put two and two together. D&D are simply dumb enough to do it like that}

[Davros Seaworth]

21 minutes ago, Christi84 said:

_{D&D are probably counting on viewers not even realizing theyre related TBH. Like people wont remember Rhaegar is Dany's brother, that viewers will think Jon is a Targaryen, but not put two and two together. D&D are simply dumb enough to do it like that}

To be fair to them, most of their viewers probably won't realise that, but that is D&D's fault for making the show in such a ridiculous way. Most viewers don't realise that the characters are all empty shells.

[Le Cygne]

Allegedly in the end, there's a montage, they bang, the audience (via Bran) finds out they are related, the wall comes down.

[Meera of Tarth]

5 minutes ago, Le Cygne said:

Allegedly in the end, there's a montage, they bang, the audience (via Bran) finds out they are related, the wall comes down.

Yes, if that comes true, Jonerys is doomed from the start (the wall falling down, revealing who is Jon while they bang...)

But it's something we all knew since this show has always represented incest as a Bad thing. And we know the show is not a complex thing to suddenly twist that concept . Actually, the show does this to create drama and shocking moments, as usual. And with drama incest, they are experts.

[Le Cygne]

The author just came out and said Jon is a fire wight, too.

[Meera of Tarth]

35 minutes ago, Christi84 said:

_{D&D are probably counting on viewers not even realizing theyre related TBH. Like people wont remember Rhaegar is Dany's brother, that viewers will think Jon is a Targaryen, but not put two and two together. D&D are simply dumb enough to do it like that}

No, people are just not dumb. People know they are related. And those who don't know are casual viewers. The show will make it clear that they are related if the leaks of boatsex are true. And that's for a reason.

[jorywea]

https://www.thedradonandthewolf.com/single-post/2017/07/16/Episode-2-Stormborn

 

 

[divica]

1 hour ago, Meera of Tarth said:

people will be disturbed bc people are bored of nasty incest dyring years (having twincest and Craster as examples of how this is bad). Actually avunculate incest is gross even in Asoiaf world, it's worse than marriage between cousins which is accepted if it happens. So investing in a love story that some people will lile (others won't because they just have nothing in common but some only watchers might like thrm together bc they are protagonists and it's cool and these things...) and thrn turn it into another incest drama won't be something to like. People won't like the revlation after the boatsex.

as for Jonsa, yes it's more disturbing but I don't think it has more fans than, other pairings like, let's say Jaime and Brienne. They make lots of fan arts but the general viewer is not invested in Jonsa bc it's ridiculous. They are a minority even if they make a lot of noise. if we look up in the internet we can find very odd 'ships', like Sam and Jon. That doesn't mean these ships need attention, or that they are not ridiculous so as to even discuss them further or compare them to other pairings from the leaks.

In the show we simply don t know what people think of aunt/nephew relations. I think that people's opinion will depend on what the people of planetos feel about that relationship in the  show...

If it turns into an incest drama I will think it is stupid. I expect them to just say "so we are related... funny" and go on with their relationship and have people like varys trying to put jon on the IT because he thinks he is more sane or trying to convence danny to kill jon because he is a threat for her claim or looking for reasons to break them up in order to further their agenda ... I sincerally don t want to see them going on about how they love each other but can t be together because they are familly...

 

And come on, you can t compare craster with danny/jon... he was shown in a way to disgust people and over the years the people bothered by Jaime/cercei are the ones that want him to move on to brienne... It isn t really about incest, it is more about disliking cercei... In addition we have seen both highgarden and dorne having pretty loose morals about who you can have sex with.

[The Bear Who Knocks]

Incest is stupid.

[The Bard of Banefort]

The juxtaposition of boatsex with the parentage reveal and the Wall coming down implies that this relationship isn't necessarily supposed to be seen as a good thing. As far as the incest goes, it's been my experience that only book fans and some hardcore show fans ship relatives. Most casual fans that I've encountered saw the parentage revelation from last season as a confirmation that JonXDany would not be happening. I think the show is going for an Oedipus Rex feeling here.                                          

[Le Cygne]

Yeah, I don't think they are going for a "whatever" vibe there.