US Politics: Hindsight on 2020

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

21 minutes ago, The Fallen said:

So Trump is no racist, he just associates himself with racists, retweets racist shit, and his refusal to rent apartments to "the coloreds" was merely business not personal? Got it.

 

Doesn't matter if it was business or personal. It's racist in either instance.

[Kalbear]

1 hour ago, The Killer Snark said:

Re BLM - It's a known fact that white people are far more likely statistically to be attacked or killed by black people than the other way around, and especially in racially motivated attacks. It's a known fact that white people are actually more likely to be on the receiving end of police brutality or a shooting by police than black people. This is supported by all statistics. Black people are far, far more likely to get attacked or killed by other black people than by white people. With a 13 percent population representation, the black communities of America account for 80 percent of all crime. As uncomfortable as it is to admit it, this again is a much verified fact. Every single one of the black people killed in self defense by both white and black cops during the last few years, who's been used as a martyr by BLM in order to justify riots, and attacks on whites, and murders of cops of either colour, has been an armed criminal. BLM is a domestic terrorist organisation, not a civil rights movement, and it is indeed a racist supremacist one into the bargain. But when you have a movement whose main funder and organiser is George Soros, you can't expect it to be good for anything apart from inciting hatred. And white people in America, the same as Europe, are not a status quo.

Like, literally, none of this is actually true. None of it. It is all, 100%, lies and conspiracy theory stuff.

And this got precisely the same amount of attention as reports from the New York Times.

[Altherion]

6 minutes ago, BloodRider said:

It does not matter.  Look at Swordfish, Altherion, Drac, et al.  They are immune to evidence, and think there is a conspiracy to educate people with facts.  As a nation completely run by the right, when we go off the cliff, it will not be their fault, even if it is their fault.  And the same useful idiots will be here regurgitating the propaganda.

I am actually not immune to evidence; I simply have a very high standard for accepting it when in propaganda-heavy environments such as this thread. However, you are not entirely wrong about much of the population and their behavior is a predictable consequence of the failings of academia, the media and politicians. There's an interesting article which partly explains why people have stopped believing "facts": far too many of the important ones come with unstated caveats...

[Kalbear]

Also, this left-leaning treatise on black-on-black crime (which always sounds like some porn subgenre to me) is probably a good place to start for looking for the  "Left" talking about it. As most things that conservatives pundits tend to talk about crappily the issue is really complex and has a lot of different factors. 

One thing that should be considered is that in general, communities that do not feel particularly well-served by police or view police as specifically antagonistic to that community tend to have more crime regardless of racial makeup. 

[Kalbear]

9 minutes ago, Altherion said:

I am actually not immune to evidence; I simply have a very high standard for accepting it when in propaganda-heavy environments such as this thread. However, you are not entirely wrong about much of the population and their behavior is a predictable consequence of the failings of academia, the media and politicians. There's an interesting article which partly explains why people have stopped believing "facts": far too many of the important ones come with unstated caveats...

As evidence of how you can be swayed by facts you link an article that has zero sources and says things like this?

"It has long been an unspoken rule of public engagement for economists that they should champion trade and not dwell too much on the fine print. "

It's incredible that you managed to find a piece that you agree with that miraculously backs up your worldview.

[The Killer Snark]

18 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

Like, literally, none of this is actually true. None of it. It is all, 100%, lies and conspiracy theory stuff.

And this got precisely the same amount of attention as reports from the New York Times.

I suppose you're going to say that these officially documented figures are conspiracy stuff as well?

http://www.amren.com/archives/reports/the-color-of-crime-2016-revised-edition/

[Maithanet]

I remember the economics department as being the most conservative department at my college.  Virtually all of them were quite critical of Clinton's economic policies (particularly minimum wage) and supported Bush to varying degrees.  When we had a campus debate about the impending Iraq invasion, it was two econ professors and the College Republicans debating against two political science professors and the College Democrats.

[Week]

5 minutes ago, The Killer Snark said:

I suppose you're going to say that these officially documented figures are conspiracy stuff as well?

http://www.amren.com/archives/reports/the-color-of-crime-2016-revised-edition/

American Renaissance (AR or AmRen) is a monthly online magazine published by the New Century Foundation which describes itself as a "race-realist, white advocacy organization".^[1][2] It has been described as a white supremacist publication by several sources, including The Washington Post, Fortune, and the Anti-Defamation League.^[3][4][5][6]

You can't make your point without linking to this garbage? Answer: No, you can't or you would have already.

[Kalbear]

8 minutes ago, The Killer Snark said:

I suppose you're going to say that these officially documented figures are conspiracy stuff as well?

(snip to avoid linking)

yes, I am - because those aren't officially documented figures. And they aren't conspiracy stuff - they are complete bullshit made up by white supremacists. 

[The Killer Snark]

Then why not check out Wikipedia? Surely you can't accuse the increasingly Left censored Wikipedia of having any anti black racist bias. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_crime_in_the_United_States

One should note that I am not trying to demonise black people. I blame white liberals for the crime rates. Complete denial of reality makes no problem go away, and the Dems have driven blacks in America into a system of voluntary ghettoisation for the most part with their low expectations of anyone who isn't themselves, and their desire to exploit black people in particular as a voting bloc. You have read the Podesta leaks, and the Dems' own views on black people? Well, they massively bear out everything I've just said.

[Week]

Just now, Kalbear said:

yes, I am - because those aren't officially documented figures. And they aren't conspiracy stuff - they are complete bullshit made up by white supremacists. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Renaissance_(magazine)

 

Quote

 

American Renaissance, the New Century Foundation, or Taylor have had links with organizations such as the Council of Conservative Citizens, the Pioneer Fund, and the British National Party. Don Black and David Duke have attended AR conferences and have been seen talking with Taylor.[10][11] The organization has held bi-annual conferences that are open to the public and that attract 200–300 people. Critics say some who attend are neo-Nazis, white nationalists, white separatists, Holocaust deniers, and eugenicists.[12]

Attendees of AmRen conferences have included: Richard B. Spencer, Joseph Sobran, Michael H. Hart, Paul Gottfried, Glayde Whitney, Frank Borzellieri, Robert Weissberg, Dan Roodt, Guillaume Faye, Drew Fraser, Fred Reed, James Edwards, Alex Kurtagic, Merlin Miller, John Derbyshire, Michael Levin, Nick Griffin, Bruno Gollnisch, J. Philippe Rushton, Glenn Spencer, Lawrence Auster, Richard Lynn, and Samuel T. Francis.[13]

American Renaissance and the New Century Foundation appear on a list of 115 "white nationalist hate groups" published in the Intelligence Report of the Southern Poverty Law Center.^[18]

Mark Potok, editor-in-chief of the Intelligence Report, has said that "Jared Taylor is the cultivated, cosmopolitan face of white supremacy. He is the guy who is providing the intellectual heft, in effect, to modern-day Klansmen." Taylor stated in a radio interview that "I've never been a member of the Klan. I've never known a person who is a member of the Klan," although an article in the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette pointed out that Taylor had at least met former Klansman David Duke at an American Renaissance conference, and sat with Don Black, a former Grand Wizard of the Klan, at Taylor's kitchen table.^[10]

 

 

[Altherion]

8 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

As evidence of how you can be swayed by facts you link an article that has zero sources and says things like this?

"It has long been an unspoken rule of public engagement for economists that they should champion trade and not dwell too much on the fine print. "

It's incredible that you managed to find a piece that you agree with that miraculously backs up your worldview.

While I've made roughly the same arguments before, I thought they'd sound more convincing when coming from a professor of economics at Harvard who has firsthand knowledge of the situation. Also, if you want sources, the article does point you to his books.

[OldGimletEye]

6 minutes ago, The Killer Snark said:

One should note that I am not trying to demonise black people. I blame white liberals for the crime rates. Complete denial of reality makes no problem go away, and the Dems have driven blacks in America into a system of voluntary ghettoisation for the most part with their low expectations of anyone who isn't themselves, and their desire to exploit black people in particular as a voting bloc. You have read the Podesta leaks, and the Dems' own views on black people? Well, they massively bear out everything I've just said.

Yes. Liberals invented discrimination in the South. And then they invented discrimination in Northern Cities during the Great Migration.

Meanwhile, conservatives railed against these things from the begging.

Your logic is stunningly compelling.

[Kalbear]

7 minutes ago, Altherion said:

While I've made roughly the same arguments before, I thought they'd sound more convincing when coming from a professor of economics at Harvard who has firsthand knowledge of the situation. Also, if you want sources, the article does point you to his books.

But the article isn't actually sourced, doesn't reference any facts, and the statement listed above is about as fact-less as you can get. You listing a guy making a shitty argument doesn't make things better. 

Quote

Then why not check out Wikipedia? Surely you can't accuse the increasingly Left censored Wikipedia of having any anti black racist bias. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_crime_in_the_United_States

I've seen many of those reports before, yes. They say almost precisely the opposite thing the white supremacist website you linked to does. As to the rest, I'd love you to point to a Podesta leak that says anything like what you're saying. 

Seriously, why are there so many white supremacists in Scotland?

[Week]

15 minutes ago, The Killer Snark said:

I suppose you're going to say that these officially documented figures are conspiracy stuff as well?

http://www.amren.com/archives/reports/the-color-of-crime-2016-revised-edition/

Would you admit to being a white supremacist? How do you think it should be interpreted when you post links from blatant white supremacist sites without context, acknowledgement, or comment?

I'm genuinely curious. 

It beggars belief that people believe the propaganda on this thread is predominantly from the Left. This shit is propaganda that any decent person on the Right would disavow. Strenuously.

[Kalbear]

6 minutes ago, Week said:

It beggars belief that people believe the propaganda on this thread is predominantly from the Left. This shit is propaganda that any decent person on the Right would disavow. Strenuously.

I'm sure @Bold Barry Whitebeard will be coming along any second to disavow this stuff.

[The Killer Snark]

17 minutes ago, Week said:

Would you admit to being a white supremacist? How do you think it should be interpreted when you post links from blatant white supremacist sites without context, acknowledgement, or comment?

I'm genuinely curious. 

It beggars belief that people believe the propaganda on this thread is predominantly from the Left. This shit is propaganda that any decent person on the Right would disavow. Strenuously.

I am not a white supremacist. I am a cultural preservationist. I believe that the majority of any constitutionally established country in the world deserves to remain a majority, no matter what colour they happen to be. This is the opposite of racism. You would never believe how many people there are among the Left who I have come across on social media alone, never mind in Germany's Green Party or in the Cultural Marxist halls of Swedish government, who openly celebrate the fact that white people are doomed to be a global minority, even in their own countries, well within the next twenty or thirty years.

[Week]

1 minute ago, The Killer Snark said:

I am not a white supremacist. I am a cultural preservationist. I believe that the majority of any comstitutionally established country in the world deserves to remain a majority, no matter what colour they happen to be. This is the opposite of racism. You would never believe how many people there are among the Left who I have come across alone on social media who openly celebrate the fact that white people are doomed to be a global minority even in their own countries well within the next twenty or thirty years.

Re-framing and confirming. Ok. How do you think it should be interpreted when you post links from blatant white supremacist sites without context, acknowledgement, or comment?

Quack, quack, quack ... I call it a duck.

[Kalbear]

3 minutes ago, The Killer Snark said:

I am not a white supremacist. I am a cultural preservationist. I believe that the majority of any comstitutionally established country in the world deserves to remain a majority, no matter what colour they happen to be. This is the opposite of racism. You would never believe how many people there are among the Left who I have come across alone on social media who openly celebrate the fact that white people are doomed to be a global minority even in their own countries well within the next twenty or thirty years.

Is there something wrong about being a global minority?

[Altherion]

11 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

But the article isn't actually sourced, doesn't reference any facts, and the statement listed above is about as fact-less as you can get. You listing a guy making a shitty argument doesn't make things better. 

Most sentences torn out of their context would appear to be fact-less. The article is not an academic paper; it's the view of somebody from academia. If you want a more rigorous argument, read the books. This is not the level at which somebody links to some vaguely related study as a "fact" that proves their argument.