Johnimus Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 9 hours ago, Lady Blizzardborn said: Again, which comments? None of the interviews I've read have let on about any characters' ultimate fates, but if you've got one I haven't read yet, I'd be pleased to get some new info. Bittersweet ending. GRRM has said the ending will be bittersweet. That means there will be some happy and some tragic things involved. If you think all the major characters are going to survive, you have not been paying attention. The theme it would reinforce is that sometimes great sacrifices are required. Ned's death established early on that every life is at stake in these books. One of GRRM's biggest complaints about Tolkien is that Gandalf came back, which robbed his death of any meaning or lasting consequences. Not me. And again, not me. Third time's a charm I guess because...not me. I was not talking about readers thinking a character has to go, I'm talking about writers finding themselves killing off a character they didn't expect to kill. You write the story the way it needs to be written, and sometimes that involves twists even the author does not see coming. It never ceases to amaze me how many people misunderstand the term bittersweet. It means a happy ending tinged with some sadness or pain. An ending with Jon Snow on the Throne, with his internal monologue remembering his father (I assume Jon will always consider Ned his real father) his brothers, Master Aemon, and all the other good people who have already died would be bittersweet. GRRM doesn't have to kill another major character to have a bittersweet ending - the pieces are already in place. As for Tolkein, he did write about consequences. His ending, the scouring of the shire, and the way Frodo is broken, never again to be truly whole, are clear examples of that. People on this forum have a habit of assuming that Ned's death means "every life is at stake in these books", and that's true. One of the narrative purposes of that death, and the red wedding, was to establish that. That was one of the primary reasons for those deaths, to keep us guessing until the end. What there is not, anywhere in the books, is evidence that Danaerys will perish. Your last line about writing the story the way it needs to be written has merit, but it's literally the only argument that Danaerys will die. "He might have to kill her". And I stand over my point, even if you are not one of those people, that the majority of people who think that have a rooting interest in someone else ending up on the Throne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular John Umber Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 42 minutes ago, Johnimus said: S/He means that you are an uncultured mouth-breather who dares to watch the worst show on television, Game of Thrones. For what it's worth, I think the show is great. Obviously it is different from the books, and that is fine. Some people around here think mentioning the show, which they hate, in the book forum is tantamount to sacrilege. Well,no, it's to do with the fact that the book and show parts of the forum are kept separate, as per the rules, especially now that the show has moved on, and could spoil those who don't wish to be spoiled (non-show watchers). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnimus Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 43 minutes ago, Regular John Umber said: Well,no, it's to do with the fact that the book and show parts of the forum are kept separate, as per the rules, especially now that the show has moved on, and could spoil those who don't wish to be spoiled (non-show watchers). Fair enough. It was the "HBO fanfic" comment that riled me. Call the series bad if you want, express disappointment if you want, but don't go calling it fanfic. It's not. D&D know more about what happens in the story than any of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springwatch Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 44 minutes ago, Johnimus said: Fair enough. It was the "HBO fanfic" comment that riled me. Call the series bad if you want, express disappointment if you want, but don't go calling it fanfic. It's not. D&D know more about what happens in the story than any of us. 'Fanfic' isn't much of an insult. Fanfic can be good or bad. 2 hours ago, Johnimus said: What there is not, anywhere in the books, is evidence that Danaerys will perish. Your last line about writing the story the way it needs to be written has merit, but it's literally the only argument that Danaerys will die. "He might have to kill her". And I stand over my point, even if you are not one of those people, that the majority of people who think that have a rooting interest in someone else ending up on the Throne. I first thought Dany might die when I properly noticed her thought that the dragons would live longer than she would. These dragons probably won't live that long - ice and fire magic will most likely pass out of the world when the seasons come back into balance. I don't want Dany to die though. It's been nice for a change to have a female character in the top spot for power, without having to go mad, go evil, die in childbirth, sacrifice herself for love, or meekly hand over the throne and Drogon. She could stay herself right to the end - the Last Dragon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fattest Leech Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 1 hour ago, Johnimus said: Fair enough. It was the "HBO fanfic" comment that riled me. Call the series bad if you want, express disappointment if you want, but don't go calling it fanfic. It's not. D&D know more about what happens in the story than any of us. Uh, yes it is. GRRM even clarified that it is bought and paid for fan fiction, even though he despises fan fiction. And another reason why fan fiction talk in general isn't allowed around these parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fattest Leech Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Quote What there is not, anywhere in the books, is evidence that Danaerys will perish. Your last line about writing the story the way it needs to be written has merit, but it's literally the only argument that Danaerys will die. "He might have to kill her". And I stand over my point, even if you are not one of those people, that the majority of people who think that have a rooting interest in someone else ending up on the Throne. If George made it obvious anyone was going to die, that would be rather boring, don't ya think? The author doesn't spoon feed any information to the reader, rather he uses his World building and in-world history repeating as clues to what could happen. Speculation about Daenerys, or Arya, Sansa, Jon, Samwell,etc dying is perfectly reasonable because as the author says, "art is not a democracy." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teej6 Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 2 hours ago, Johnimus said: S/He means that you are an uncultured mouth-breather who dares to watch the worst show on television, Game of Thrones. For what it's worth, I think the show is great. Obviously it is different from the books, and that is fine. Some people around here think mentioning the show, which they hate, in the book forum is tantamount to sacrilege. If you've read the rules of the forum, you'd know that it is not permissible to discuss the show or its contents in the Book section of this forum. It's not about what posters think but it is the rules of this Board. And as others have rightly pointed out, the Show has taken a huge detour from the books' storylines so I wouldn't base any of my speculations/theories for future book events on the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 2 hours ago, Johnimus said: S/He means that you are an uncultured mouth-breather who dares to watch the worst show on television, Game of Thrones. For what it's worth, I think the show is great. Obviously it is different from the books, and that is fine. Some people around here think mentioning the show, which they hate, in the book forum is tantamount to sacrilege. You are right. S/he is an arrogant sumbitch. I like the show too. It was really good through the first two or three seasons. But I don't think we can rely on what happens in it to be predictive of what happens in the novels. You have to make an argument as to why, and that argument should be done in the show side of the forums. Those are the rules set down by the mods. Mods are not mocked, girl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 1 hour ago, Johnimus said: Fair enough. It was the "HBO fanfic" comment that riled me. Call the series bad if you want, express disappointment if you want, but don't go calling it fanfic. It's not. D&D know more about what happens in the story than any of us. Yet they choose to do things differently. --and that's ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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