Red Hermit Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 I wonder how much Trump is really going to be able to increase oil and coal production when prices are so low. If oil prices get stuck even lower his buddy Putin ain't gonna be happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongRider Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 4 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: I think that unrest among those who raise most of our food is a bad thing. It doesn't matter who owns the farms if the people who do the farming choose to refrain from farming. Farms like any industry have lost workers for many years due to mechanization and other labor saving inputs. Farmers only make up about 2% of the population and there are many college graduates among them. Example, bovine nutrition takes a graduate degree these days. https://www.agcensus.usda.gov/Publications/2012/Online_Resources/Highlights/Farm_Demographics/ I think your farmer unrest is a fantasy and most rural folks don't live on or work farms, and it is the the loss of other industries found in rural areas, for example timber, minerals, food processing and others that the unhappiness is coming from. Clinton got drubbed in the press and by Trump because she said coal wasn't coming back. She's right but she framed it the wrong way and the rest of her thoughts were lost. Here is a good site to learn real rural issues and it seems they are hard hit in their industries to foreign completion and low/slow education of it's workforce. http://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/rural-economy-population/business-industry/ Some rural areas have lost their non-farm industries for various reasons. Trump did address this, with empty promises of course, and his addressing this, promising to bring back the lost jobs and industries, was more than Clinton did. Whether or not the EC is ever replaced, rural issues still need to be addressed some day and they sure won't be for the next four years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squab Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 5 minutes ago, Red Hermit said: I wonder how much Trump is really going to be able to increase oil and coal production when prices are so low. If oil prices get stuck even lower his buddy Putin ain't gonna be happy. Well that's not entirely true. Google seaborne coking coal price. Seaborne hard coking coal was selling at around $303USD a tonne last week which is up from a benchmark of about $85USD 6 months ago, maybe less. A lot of that is to do with demand rather than supply and I see it going back to a bit over $100 Q2 2017. My guess is that thermal coal has a long way to go especially when gas prices are low as well. Some thermal coal futures have gone up recently which is a sign of price growth but who knows. I would have thought as long as Putin controls the gas market into Europe, he would probably be ok with a price a bit higher than the moment but that's about it, right? I would think the pipeline the Qataris were proposing through Syria would have worried him more than the US increasing their output. I don't know how he intends to control Iran's pipeline but maybe someone who knows European gas markets better would know more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGimletEye Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 10 minutes ago, LongRider said: <snip> Thanks for posting this. My sense was that the major problem in many of these rural areas has been in fact the loss of manufacturing jobs whether through free trade or through automation. Maybe Clinton didn't address these issue as well as she could have, but the issues around lost manufacturing jobs in these areas are certainly are on the minds of big city "elitist" liberals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongRider Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 Fake news I'd like to see; on Inauguration Day, Obama rips off his jacket and tie, rolls up his shirt sleeves and put up his dukes and challenges Trump to go a few rounds. LOL, I'd think he'd give the new Dear Leader a black eye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGimletEye Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 Just now, LongRider said: Fake news I'd like to see; on Inauguration Day, Obama rips off his jacket and tie, rolls up his shirt sleeves and put up his dukes and challenges Trump to go a few rounds. LOL, I'd think he'd give the new Dear Leader a black eye. Shouldn't it be John Bolton? He always likes a good fight. Oh, wait, Bolton likes fightin, he just doesn't like takin part in any of the fightin. So, Bolton talks shit, then sends in Trump who promptly gets his butt kicked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongRider Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 3 minutes ago, OldGimletEye said: Thanks for posting this. My sense was that the major problem in many of these rural areas has been in fact the loss of manufacturing jobs whether through free trade or through automation. Maybe Clinton didn't address these issue as well as she could have, but the issues around lost manufacturing jobs in these areas are certainly are on the minds of big city "elitist" liberals. I also think the perception of farmers is that they come straight out of the farm house of their parents and on to the farm. Not so any more as farmers are well educated, many with advanced degrees, because farming isn't just playing in dirt anymore. Farming takes a lot of science now, and there are many disciplines that go into it. The folks in the other rural industries however, are not so well educated and so it's hard to understand why ones town lost the little factory of making public transit and school buses. I think to many city dwellers the term 'lost manufacturing' conjures up an urban landscape, but it's not just urban areas that have lost their manufacturing base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 2 hours ago, Commodore said: other than the protectionism (which is hopefully mostly rhetorical), this is all very encouraging Seems almost wholly discouraging. Seems to be plenty of evidence to suggest that offshore manufacturing will not come back, or if it comes back it will do so on the basis of heavy automation and minimal additional employment. All of these manufacturers are supplying goods to a hundred or more countries, and in some cases markets closer to the place of manufacture are larger than the USA. The net cost of staying offshore for selling in the USA at a higher price vs increased manufacturing costs in the USA for selling in all other markets probably works out in favour of staying off shore. This would especially be the case for manufacturing in Asia with substantial sales in Asia. A 2 billion population area with a middle class that is fast approaching the entire population of the USA. (3 billion if you count India.) WTF is clean coal? From the perspective of the biggest environmental problem facing us (climate change) all coal is dirty. Some coal may be less dirty, but it's all dirty. Besides, I thought Trump was a card carrying denier. All of a sudden draining the swamp is about govt employees and not career politicians? It's not actually possible to impose a lifetime ban on private sector employment, and it is likely not possible to impose a 5-year ban either. For every new regulation eliminate 2 old ones. Such a blunt and ineffective approach to regulatory reform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 Man, but what happens if those walmart greeters revolt? THERE WILL BE CHAOS. Better give them, like, triple the effective vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongRider Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 1 minute ago, Kalbear said: Man, but what happens if those walmart greeters revolt? THERE WILL BE CHAOS. Better give them, like, triple the effective vote. The mind reels at this, oh the huge manatee! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 I also love how anything that is said that's bad by Trump for the Trump supporters is handwaved away as 'simply rhetorical' or whatnot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Scribe of Naath Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 A snapshot of what was said at the white-nationalist gathering in DC: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/11/richard-spencer-speech-npi/508379/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongRider Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 16 minutes ago, OldGimletEye said: Shouldn't it be John Bolton? He always likes a good fight. Oh, wait, Bolton likes fightin, he just doesn't like takin part in any of the fightin. So, Bolton talks shit, then sends in Trump who promptly gets his butt kicked. Bolton better be careful, because I think Uncle Joe is spoiling for a fight an before you know it, right there on the platform we have brawl! Empty the benches! Let's get to it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martell Spy Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 Sanders rips Trump infrastructure plan as 'corporate welfare' http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/bernie-sanders-donald-trump-infrastructure-plan-corportate-welfare-231720 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 20 minutes ago, Martell Spy said: Sanders rips Trump infrastructure plan as 'corporate welfare' http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/bernie-sanders-donald-trump-infrastructure-plan-corportate-welfare-231720 Trump encouraging corporate welfare? Using government to line the pockets of his allies? I'm shocked SHOCKED to find gambling going on here. Trump isn't even trying to hide his avarictic intent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 Why would he? He didn't bother doing it during the election and he got elected on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castel Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 Someone tells you who they are...believe them. Or maybe all of that was just some brilliant 4D chess or leverage or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 Also, Trump literally uses his power as POTUS to advance his business interests in meeting with Scotland. This should be an impeachable offense, I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Walker Texas Ranger Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 52 minutes ago, Kalbear said: I also love how anything that is said that's bad by Trump for the Trump supporters is handwaved away as 'simply rhetorical' or whatnot. That's Trump's talent. He makes people think that they're in on the con and it's those other idiots who are the suckers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 15 minutes ago, Kalbear said: Why would he? He didn't bother doing it during the election and he got elected on it. That's true. His supporters are lapping this shit up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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