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Why are the Hightowers so friendly to invaders?


LordImp

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When house Gardener took over the Reach the Hightowers married the Gardeners instead of fighting them and keeping their city independent

They opened their gates to the Andals  and married them. 

They opened the gates to Aegon I . They didnt send a single soldier to fight with the Gardeners against Aegon. 

Why dont they fight the invaders ? Are they just after to protect their proud city , or is there something more sinister? Like if the Hightowers perish something terrible will happen .

Will they welcome Euron aswell ? 

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I guess they go ahead of the trends, they 'light the way'. They opened the gates to Aegon, sure, but made sure to claw him into the Faith, securing the Hightower position in the continent at the same time. Same with the Gardeners, when marrying into one of the oldest and most prestigious bloodlines.

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You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. Fighting and war results in destruction and destitution while marriage produces strength and unity. Marriage is the reason the Redwyne-Hightower-Gardner/Tyrell alliance has endured as the hegemon of the realm throughout the ages while the other great houses fought and squabbled amongst themselves.

That has all changed in the past two decades, of course, with Casterly Rock taking the same tack to put Lannisters in charge of the Crownlands, the Stormlands, the Riverlands and, with the Sansa/Tyrion marriage, the North.

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I'd guess because much of their power is derived from Oldtown.  A large city, not a fortress.  They have more to lose and less to gain by obstinately holding out against invaders.  Better to just go with the flow, and continue to reap the rewards of governing the greatest or second greatest city on the continent.

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3 hours ago, LordImp said:

When house Gardener took over the Reach the Hightowers married the Gardeners instead of fighting them and keeping their city independent

They opened their gates to the Andals  and married them. 

They opened the gates to Aegon I . They didnt send a single soldier to fight with the Gardeners against Aegon. 

Why dont they fight the invaders ? Are they just after to protect their proud city , or is there something more sinister? Like if the Hightowers perish something terrible will happen .

Will they welcome Euron aswell ? 

And who still rules oldtown and the surrounding area of the reach unbroken since the dawn age? Yeah, that about sums it up 

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I think it's a combination of two events throughout history:

1) Oldtown was repeatedly sacked, over and over again, by foreign invaders; and

2) the Hightowers sustained heavy losses in the Dance of the Dragons.

 

If you add in 3) their close association with the Citadel and the Faith of the Seven, you have a House whose lowest points came about as a result of fighting invaders and investing heavily in one side of a civil war.  Conversely, their prestige and wealth have come through embracing and supporting neutral protected orders (the Faith and the Maesters) and by marrying as widely as possible (like how they kept a foot in both camps during the Blackfyre Rebellions).  

Viewed in this light its not that surprising that Leyton gave Jorah permission to marry Lynesse.  At that point he'd be father in law to the arguably the finest soldier in the North (as well as the head of a northern house and one of the only knights in the north), the father in law to the lord paramount of the reach (Mace Tyrell), the brother in law of the finest soldier in the Reach (Randyll Tarly), and cousin-by-marriage to the heir to the Iron Throne at the time.  He's pretty much got his bases covered.

 

The Hightowers really are a fascinating house.  If they have as much money as the Lannisters, and three times as many troops as any House in the Reach, as Sam says (and Sam isn't wrong about stuff like that) - that's HUGE, especially considering the Lannister's chief asset is their wealth, and the Tyrell's chief asset at the moment is their military power (and their food, I think, but its the military power that makes such a big difference in the WOTFK).  They're also MYSTERIOUS, as we've never actually met any of them, save Alerie.  Either they'll wind up being hugely important, or they'll just all get murdered by Euron and won't matter.    

It's worth noting that the 5th level of the Hightower is one of the structures said to have been built by Bran the Builder.  So for those who subscribe to the time travelling Bran-is-every-Bran theory, the Hightower will have to come into play sooner than later.

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"War is bad for trade."  - Dorian Hightower

That's the simple answer, but the Hightowers came out ahead every time they "let" the invaders "win".  

When the Hightowers married the Gardeners, they got a pledge of protection from land based attacks.  This let them build up their fleet and sea-based defenses.

When they married into the Andals and the Seven, Oldtown became the seat of the faith.  In a medieval type Society, that's a lot of power.  Not to mention the profits that come from pilgrims, and others trying to show their devotion.

What were the Hightowers supposed to do against Aegon and his sisters?  Aegon and Balerion had already torched Harrenhal.  Aegon and his sisters had roasted their king.  Why should they suffer the same fate?  Instead, they opened the gates and got Aegon to, at least nominally accept the Faith and be crowned at Oldtown.  There's at least some power there.

Somehow, I don't think they see any profit in letting Euron's Ironborn into the city.

As to why the Gardeners and Tyrells have tolerated thei reluctance to fight, I'd guess it comes down to a couple of factors.  If the Hightowers have as many troops as Sam estimates, they're a power in their own right.  What are the Reach lords going to do?  Attack the Hightowers in the middle of a war?  No, it's probably better to let Oldtown stay out and use the taxes Oldtown pays to equip their army.

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 01/12/2016 at 8:23 AM, estermonty python said:

He's pretty much got his bases covered.

So... they're pretty much Frey's but with honour and a good reputation? Haha. 

Actually I joke, but there might be some truth in here from a literary perspective, some nice parallels between the 2.

Hightower: 1 tower on their sigil, they "light the way" as shown buy their ability to think long term. 
Frey: 2 towers and a bridge on their sigil, which are designed to "block the way" of armies and large travelling groups. They are also very petty.

I don't know, maybe I'm reaching but it just came to mind.

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7 hours ago, Mat92 said:

So... they're pretty much Frey's but with honour and a good reputation? Haha. 

Actually I joke, but there might be some truth in here from a literary perspective, some nice parallels between the 2.

Hightower: 1 tower on their sigil, they "light the way" as shown buy their ability to think long term. 
Frey: 2 towers and a bridge on their sigil, which are designed to "block the way" of armies and large travelling groups. They are also very petty.

I don't know, maybe I'm reaching but it just came to mind.

Both rely on trade income and tolls. 

There the similarities end though. Hightowers are an ancient, powerful and very prestigious house with extensive connections. They've been married to kings and Lord Paramounts, held positions of extreme power and led armies.

Freys are a young house, disliked by the majority of their fellow houses due to them being seen as upjumped toll collectors and generally seen as bad people.

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Every so often a ruler of the city builds a wall around Ankh-Morpork, ostensibly to keep enemies out. But Ankh-Morpork doesn’t fear enemies. In fact it welcomes enemies, provided they are enemies with money to spend. In fact the Guild of Merchants' famous publication 'Wellcome to Ankh-Morporke, Citie of One Thousand Surprises' now has an entire section entitled 'Soe you're a Barbaeriean Invader?' which has notes on night life, folklorique bargains in the bazaar and, under the heading 'Steppe-ing Out', a list of restaurants that do a dependable mares' milk and yak pudding. And many a pointedhelmeted vandal has trotted back to his freezing yurt wondering why he seems to be a great deal poorer and the apparent owner of a badly-woven rug, a litre of undrinkable wine and a stuffed purple donkey in a straw hat.

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The Hightowers never lost much to the invaders. They were, and still are, one of the most powerful, wealthiest and envied houses of the whole realm. So they never had much of a reason to put up a potentially much more demaging fight. Of course Euron, and the Ironborn in general, aren't exactly known for such smooths transitions of power. 

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On 12/24/2016 at 0:10 AM, Mat92 said:

So... they're pretty much Frey's but with honour and a good reputation? Haha. 

Actually I joke, but there might be some truth in here from a literary perspective, some nice parallels between the 2.

Hightower: 1 tower on their sigil, they "light the way" as shown buy their ability to think long term. 
Frey: 2 towers and a bridge on their sigil, which are designed to "block the way" of armies and large travelling groups. They are also very petty.

I don't know, maybe I'm reaching but it just came to mind.

Towers also appear in the sigils for House Grafton, House Towers (extinct) and House Vance.  The towers in House Vance is an easter egg to "The Last Castle" by Jack Vance, so I doubt there's any symbolism there.  The five black towers of House Towers is obviously a Harrenhall reference, which has five black towers, so there's no connection there either.

House Grafton is an absolutely fascinating House despite being hardly mentioned.  They control Gulltown, the only city in the Vale, and the story of the House founder is pretty badass - allying with the First Man King against the Royce King, defeating the Royce king, then stabbing the First Man king in the back and taking over Gulltown, and putting down a massive bloody rebellion and controlling Gulltown unchallenged forevermore.  I don't really see how it ties in with the Hightowers or Freys, though.

I don't see the Hightowers and Freys as particularly similar.  The Freys are notoriously duplicitous, grasping, and obsessed with increasing their station.  The Hightowers are precisely the opposite: ancient, conciliatory, honorable, and seemingly uninterested in power for power's sake.  If they have as much money as the Lannisters, three times as many troops as the Tyrells, and generally enjoy the backing of the Citadel and the Faith, they could make a serious play for power, but they don't seem to have ever been interested in that fight.  They just want to trade, make money, defend their walls, and not get dragged into wars that don't directly affect them - basically, they're a model of how the entire realm should behave.

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On 12/23/2016 at 10:02 PM, Aetta said:

Who is Dorian Martell?   You keep using that word.  I do not think it means what you think it means.

He was my dad. A legend in these parts. If you had a mom in the reach, he might be your dad too, or at least the reason your parents aren't married anymore. But he is gone now, killed by a guy from bear island......... 

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  • 7 months later...
On 27/12/2016 at 4:12 PM, estermonty python said:

Towers also appear in the sigils for House Grafton, House Towers (extinct) and House Vance.  The towers in House Vance is an easter egg to "The Last Castle" by Jack Vance, so I doubt there's any symbolism there.  The five black towers of House Towers is obviously a Harrenhall reference, which has five black towers, so there's no connection there either.

House Grafton is an absolutely fascinating House despite being hardly mentioned.  They control Gulltown, the only city in the Vale, and the story of the House founder is pretty badass - allying with the First Man King against the Royce King, defeating the Royce king, then stabbing the First Man king in the back and taking over Gulltown, and putting down a massive bloody rebellion and controlling Gulltown unchallenged forevermore.  I don't really see how it ties in with the Hightowers or Freys, though.

I don't see the Hightowers and Freys as particularly similar.  The Freys are notoriously duplicitous, grasping, and obsessed with increasing their station.  The Hightowers are precisely the opposite: ancient, conciliatory, honorable, and seemingly uninterested in power for power's sake.  If they have as much money as the Lannisters, three times as many troops as the Tyrells, and generally enjoy the backing of the Citadel and the Faith, they could make a serious play for power, but they don't seem to have ever been interested in that fight.  They just want to trade, make money, defend their walls, and not get dragged into wars that don't directly affect them - basically, they're a model of how the entire realm should behave.

Well they where one of the may reason of the dance of dragons and the subsequence loss of dragons all that because they wanted Aegon II on the thrones wich would certainly gave more power to his grandfather. So uninterrested by power no , they just tried and failed and seem like they dont want to take any more chances.

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Look at the base of the high tower. It's ancient. House Hightower is also ancient, predating even the First Men. Oldtown is...well, old; so old in fact that no one can pinpoint how old it is. The area seems to have been an international port before the First Men came to Westeros. The Hightowers are used to foreigners, they know they can learn from them, and sitting at the top of that tower, they know how large their armies or navies are, and what they can afford to lose.

The fact that they've been so flexible about things and willing to accept change is why they're still in their ancestral seat, as opposed to the Gardeners and a few other houses that are now extinct.

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