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US politics 2016: I can see Russia from my White House


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41 minutes ago, Pony Queen Jace said:

The appointment of Goldman Sachs employees to state positions does not alarm you?

To some extent, but keep in mind that in previous eras, many reformers and revolutionaries originated from the aristocracy. Bannon may have worked at Goldman Sachs, but he does not strike me as somebody with the typical views of that institution. I don't know much about the others.

And again, even if Trump ultimately does nothing to reduce the concentration of wealth at the top or even makes it worse, he will still have served his purpose.

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5 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Well, if their decision-making is more or less the same, then why not simply apply the lowest cost and quickest method of appointment?

Sure, I suppose appointment is quicker.  But how is it lower cost, besides for whomever funds the campaigns?  It's not like states are paying extra to conduct the vast majority of judicial contests, it's just another item on the ballot.

5 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

So I would say that, broadly-speaking an appointed judiciary appears to be international best practice, at least for countries not mired in entrenched political corruption and tyrannical rule.

Well, the implication there seems hyperbolic.  And kind of a low blow.  Plus, the notion elected judges are going to be subject to any more political corruption than those chosen by politicians is unfounded.

 

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1 hour ago, Triskan said:

 This 21st Century Cures Act is not getting a ton of attention, but it is a very interesting bill that i'm leaning pretty heavily against.  Like ObamaCare, it's about a lot of things.

One thing is that it pumps billions of dollar back into the National Institutes of Health.  That is good.  But another thing it's about is speeding up drug approvals at the FDA.  This is a potential disaster. 

For one, there are already mechanisms to help people get experimental drugs that are still in trial.  For another, the scenario where a person dies because the cruel b'crats at the FDA didn't approve the life-saving medicine fast enough is comparable to the 24 nuclear bomb scenario:  exceedingly rare and a terrible justification for sweeping legislation.

And lastly, drugs are dangerous as shit.  In the status quo we do and will continue to see people harmed by unforseen consequences of approved drugs.  That will just happen more now if this passes.  This is complicated as it takes a while for drugs to be tested enough to know if they treat their indications.

ETA:   I didn't explain my point very well.  The problem is the fast-tracking of drug-approval which will undoubtedly lead to harm from adverse events not being well-enough understood before things get approved. 

IIRC, the fast-track approval works only for medication that has already been approved for other uses before, so the side-effects are already well-known.

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4 hours ago, Altherion said:

 It would be nice if somebody found Teddy's Big Stick and beat them with it, but, lacking that, we'll have to make do with Trump's bullying.

This is like saying that lacking a really effective judicial system, we'll have to make do with beating up random people on the street.

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4 hours ago, Ormond said:

However, this might lead Congress to pass an amendment that would get rid of the Electoral College WITHOUT getting rid of "electoral votes." 

It wouldn't take any action by (the U.S.) Congress (and I wouldn't hold my breath on Congress agreeing to pass, nor the states ratifying, any amendment in the foreseeable future).  Just an agreement by states constituting 105 more electoral votes to adopt the National Popular Vote plan.

3 hours ago, Dr. Pepper said:

I assume Republican congress would either desire to keep the EC or keep the votes as you described above as it's the only way they will continue to hold the white house in the years and decades to come.    

Yes, considering the GOP has lost 6 out of the last 7 popular votes, it is clearly in their interest to maintain the EC status quo.

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56 minutes ago, Altherion said:

To some extent, but keep in mind that in previous eras, many reformers and revolutionaries originated from the aristocracy. Bannon may have worked at Goldman Sachs, but he does not strike me as somebody with the typical views of that institution. I don't know much about the others.

And again, even if Trump ultimately does nothing to reduce the concentration of wealth at the top or even makes it worse, he will still have served his purpose.

I don't understand. I'm really trying, but I don't understand. You say you hate the neoliberalism that caters to the rich and disagree with the social rights focus (which do not have to be exclusive of economic focus), the elites/establishment and you want to see an end to the absurd income inequality. But your champion is a fraudulent billionaire and his billionaire friends and the elites of the republican establishment he is appointing to every level of his new administration. I seriously do not understand.

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29 minutes ago, Inigima said:

Trump has fired the younger Michael Flynn (the son of the other one, his national security advisor) for spreading fake news, e.g. Pizzagate: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/06/us/politics/michael-flynn-son-trump.html

Good news.

It's a bullshit story. The head of the transition team, Pence, was saying that he wasn't involved in the transition prior to Jason Miller saying he had been involved but now is "no longer" involved. It makes it sound like he was fired but I read days ago he was involved in the early stages to help with some scheduling, hence the transition gov email but hasn't been involved in months.

It's the same kind of crap that we're seeing every day.

"Trump saves 1100 jobs by convincing Carrier not to move their plant". Well, actually, Trump saved ~700 jobs with ~1400 jobs still moving to Mexico, got Indiana (through Pence) to give a $7m tax break and invest $16m into the plant so someone is paying for it and it ain't Carrier. Carrier union rep blasted Trump for lying on stage and Trump hosted negotiations with Carrier's parent company without even including the people he was supposed to be saving. Oh and Carrier is raising their prices by more than 5% to compete. 

"Trump gets head of SoftBank to commit to investing $50bn into the US, creating 50k new jobs!" Well, actually, SoftBank announced they were investing $50bn into the US along with 50bn from Saudi Arabia in October, before Trump even got involved. 

Every day there is a new story, based on one of Trump's tweets or surrogates flat out lying and then every day there are more stories talking about how the original stories were incorrect. Each of the original stories has flattering Trump headlines where he gets a lot of credit for doing something that actually is false and these are the only thing that people actually read. This is only going to get worse. 

ETA: The worst part is that Trump hasn't hosted a press conference, which is unheard of, in half a year and isn't giving the press an opportunity to pepper him with questions directly. All that happens is he gets a surrogate to get on TV to lie and that then becomes the basis for these news stories. I'm not sure Trump will ever have one again. 

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/12/07/why-conservatives-might-be-more-likely-to-fall-for-fake-news/?utm_term=.59b25f5d8e22

Quote

Numerous reports have highlighted how fake news creators began targeting conservative readers after finding them receptive to stories that reinforced their existing worldview. Asone fake news creator told NPR, "We've tried to do [fake news with] liberals. It just has never worked, it never takes off. You'll get debunked within the first two comments and then the whole thing just kind of fizzles out."

 

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19 minutes ago, OldGimletEye said:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/12/07/why-conservatives-might-be-more-likely-to-fall-for-fake-news/?utm_term=.59b25f5d8e22

Quote

Numerous reports have highlighted how fake news creators began targeting conservative readers after finding them receptive to stories that reinforced their existing worldview. Asone fake news creator told NPR, "We've tried to do [fake news with] liberals. It just has never worked, it never takes off. You'll get debunked within the first two comments and then the whole thing just kind of fizzles out."

Hot damn!  All those time I debunked some r/w crap on FB, who knew, I was fightin' the good fight!  :smug:

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Just now, LongRider said:

Hot damn!  All those time I debunked some r/w crap on FB, who knew, I was fightin' the good fight!  :smug:

I definitely appreciate you standing up for the reality based community.

Although I got to say, by standing up for the reality based community you might have engaged in some "identity politics".

You gotta fight for your right to not be a dummy.

Conservatives tried to throw away my best real news mag.

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10 minutes ago, OldGimletEye said:

I wonder if being a "fake news creator" pays well and gets good benefits. I might have to make a career change.

Hi, and what do you do:

Well, I'm a fake news creator.

LOL.

Not gonna lie.  I took a moment to very seriously consider setting up my very own fake news website and ad revenue. I would have called myself a writer, a fiction writer, when asked what I do for a living.

 Unfortunately my morals got in the way.  

 

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16 minutes ago, OldGimletEye said:

I wonder if being a "fake news creator" pays well and gets good benefits. I might have to make a career change.

Hi, and what do you do:

Well, I'm a fake news creator.

LOL.

 

4 minutes ago, Dr. Pepper said:

Not gonna lie.  I took a moment to very seriously consider setting up my very own fake news website and ad revenue. I would have called myself a writer, a fiction writer, when asked what I do for a living.

 Unfortunately my morals got in the way.  

 

:idea:

We could all work together!  Think of the bogus economic news OGE could bring to the table, add in Dr. Pepper and her outrage!  Not gonna lie, need some outrage to keep things lively.  I'll write the bad jokes and goofy limericks and poems.  I tell ya, we'll make millions in no time!

 

 

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Just now, Dr. Pepper said:

Not gonna lie.  I took a moment to very seriously consider setting up my very own fake news website and ad revenue. I would have called myself a writer, a fiction writer, when asked what I do for a living.

 Unfortunately my morals got in the way.  

 

I hear ya. I just can't quite bring myself to peddle get rich quick schemes and penis enhancement pills to conservatives either.

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1 minute ago, LongRider said:

 

:idea:

We could all work together!  Think of the bogus economic news OGE could bring to the table, add in Dr. Pepper and her outrage!  Not gonna lie, need some outrage to keep things lively.  I'll write the bad jokes and goofy limericks and poems.  I tell ya, we'll make millions in no time!

 

 

You make it sound so enticing that these morals of mine seem almost pesky.  

Oh god, it actually sounds like a reasonable idea now.  We'd probably do well to pull in someone who is extremely well versed in political history.  @Kalbear perhaps.

Just now, OldGimletEye said:

I hear ya. I just can't quite bring myself to peddle get rich quick schemes and penis enhancement pills to conservatives either.

I think my biggest issue is that I wouldn't want to be the cause of some idiot conservative going into a pizza joint firing a gun because he can't figure out what is real or not.  Or worse, helping milllions of dumb conservatives vote for an Orange Shitstain.

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6 minutes ago, OldGimletEye said:

I hear ya. I just can't quite bring myself to peddle get rich quick schemes and penis enhancement pills to conservatives either.

ALL THE NEWS THAT AIN'T

Hi! I'm a fake news creator
Yup, a real mover and shaker
click that link and read my lie
don't give a shit if people die
just keep the coins rolling on in
it's just fake news baby! that's no sin......

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10 hours ago, Kalbear said:

The lack of choice is due to the restrictions on the type of care - things like being forced to offer pre-existing condition coverage and being forced to cover certain things like...arthritis. Another question I have is what is stopping you from getting a plan from these other insurers? I realize they aren't part of the ACA, but if they're offering coverage in state, you can get that, right?

You would think so... but I called three different health insurance agents and all told me the same thing.  In 53 Kentucky counties there is literally only one option for health insurance on the open market.  Its bizarre.  One is a former co-worker of my dad's who works with the local (county owned hospital) and said he had pushed for them to expand some of their provider networks so Anthem would offer a PPO here.  I'm not sure what all the provider relations issues are that are leading to the restriction, but if you want to purchase a private policy where I live the only option is the Anthem HMO which has three different tiers of deductible/premiums.

Ironically... the next county over does have an Anthem PPO, but somehow the eligibility is based on your county of residence.

I'm not an expert in insurance sales, so I don't fully understand the particulars; I just know that's what we've gotten.

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Just now, Dr. Pepper said:

You make it sound so enticing that these morals of mine seem almost pesky.  

Oh god, it actually sounds like a reasonable idea now.  We'd probably do well to pull in someone who is extremely well versed in political history.  @Kalbear perhaps.

You're making me rethink the marginal utility I'm getting from morals.

Just now, Dr. Pepper said:

I think my biggest issue is that I wouldn't want to be the cause of some idiot conservative going into a pizza joint firing a gun because he can't figure out what is real or not.  Or worse, helping milllions of dumb conservatives vote for an Orange Shitstain.

Good point. I do have bigger issues with people dying or being threatened than committing a little ol act of fraud.

Just now, LongRider said:

ALL THE NEWS THAT AIN'T

Hi! I'm a fake news creator
Yup, a real mover and shaker
click that link and read my lie
don't give a shit if people die
just keep the coins rolling on in
if just fake news baby! that's no sin......

LOL. :lol:

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