YOVMO Posted December 8, 2016 Share Posted December 8, 2016 2 hours ago, King Merrett I Frey said: The Daynes are too cloudy for me to tap into, but my preliminary impression was that Dawn is a champion's sword. Since it is not hereditary, it isn't neither a sword that passes necessarily from a living Dayne to another nor a sword that needs to be constantly attached to a bearer. The text is very clear about this, only a dude who is awesome enough can wield it. Chances are that before Arthur Dayne, the sword rested quietly in Starfall, awaiting an awesome Dayne dude. I used the word champion trying to cover the pre-andal and andal time. This being said, until we get more information about the Daynes internal mechanics, I'm inclined to think Dawn is just a sword. An awesome, Tentetsutou kind of sword, but a sword only fit for a champion. Your description is absolutely right. But putting aside the issue of the daynes being an incredibly old house and is having only three named swords of the morning, there is the issue of who the champion is. we are told clearly that Dawn is left in starfall until there comes a Dayne that is worthy of wielding it. i think that the two obvious choices for who is worthy to wield it seem insufficient. The first is that a lord of house Dayne (or some counsel) decides whether a knight is worthy to wield it and the second is that there is some objective standard of knighthood that must be met (so a test being taken) i am beginning to wonder if, like your connection between blood and an item, if certain Daynes are simply born with a connection to the sword, something that becomes apparent the moment they grasp its hilt. Some starks are born wargs. Some Targaryens are born dragon masters and some Daynes are born with a simbiotic relationship to Dawn. this is interesting to me because it could give a clue as to when the walkers started returning (and with them magic) to the realm. The natural assumption is that magic has returned with Dany and her dragons, but Craster has been sacrificing his sons for three generations which leads me to believe that magic came back into the world, at least slowly, around that time. That would match up with the destruction of summerhall and, roughly, the time that arthur Dayne was born. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted December 8, 2016 Share Posted December 8, 2016 I'm still not sure how the whole king's blood thing works. What actually makes someone a king? I doubt you can just call yourself king to make your blood automatically qualify as king's blood. Do others have to see you as kings? How many are enough? Or do you have to descent from people who were kings back in the day this magic was setup (I presume sometime in ancient Valyria or even older)`? The Starks haven't been kings for years, would their magic still work as Lord Paramounts? Or did Robb's crowning give their blood magic abilities again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fossoway Posted December 8, 2016 Share Posted December 8, 2016 5 hours ago, John Doe said: I'm still not sure how the whole king's blood thing works. What actually makes someone a king? I doubt you can just call yourself king to make your blood automatically qualify as king's blood. Do others have to see you as kings? How many are enough? Or do you have to descent from people who were kings back in the day this magic was setup (I presume sometime in ancient Valyria or even older)`? The Starks haven't been kings for years, would their magic still work as Lord Paramounts? Or did Robb's crowning give their blood magic abilities again? The Starks defeated the winter (Winterfell); Durrandons defeated the storm god (Storm's End). Both families then started a royal line. It appears that westerosi myths serve as a magical transfer between gods and men. If a transfer can be interpreted as a ritual, and ritual requires some elements to be effective, well, a crown bestowed with magic for instance doesn't sound so far fetched and that royal line blood neither. The first men used to do blood rituals on their trees so I don't think rituals were alien to them. If Robb is crowned King in the North, he being an active, warging Stark, in the middle of a bloody war and with people all around him surrendering their swords to him (sounds like a ritual at least) as westerosi kings did in the past to Aegon -who then in turn merged into the Iron Throne-, I think he's good to be called a short-lived magical king too. But this only speculation. I ain't no theorist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bironic Posted December 8, 2016 Share Posted December 8, 2016 10 hours ago, John Doe said: I'm still not sure how the whole king's blood thing works. What actually makes someone a king? I doubt you can just call yourself king to make your blood automatically qualify as king's blood. Do others have to see you as kings? How many are enough? Or do you have to descent from people who were kings back in the day this magic was setup (I presume sometime in ancient Valyria or even older)`? The Starks haven't been kings for years, would their magic still work as Lord Paramounts? Or did Robb's crowning give their blood magic abilities again? That's what I ask myself as well. Melisandre uses Edric Storm, a bastard son of a King. OTOH she saves Mance Rayder, a self proclaimed king. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferocious Veldt Roarer Posted December 8, 2016 Share Posted December 8, 2016 16 minutes ago, Bironic said: That's what I ask myself as well. Melisandre uses Edric Storm, a bastard son of a King. OTOH she saves Mance Rayder, a self proclaimed king. (Correction: Melisandre intents to use Edric Storm. He slips through her fingers, though). As I said above, what Melisandre thinks how the magic of king's blood works, and how it actually does work, might be two different things. And maybe Edric Storm slipped through her fingers so the author could continue keeping us in the dark, and Mance is still alive for the same reasons (one of the reasons, at least - Mance has many uses). It's not as if Melisandre could have tons of practice with burning kings (preferably in double-blind tests). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bironic Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 21 hours ago, Ferocious Veldt Roarer said: (Correction: Melisandre intents to use Edric Storm. He slips through her fingers, though). As I said above, what Melisandre thinks how the magic of king's blood works, and how it actually does work, might be two different things. And maybe Edric Storm slipped through her fingers so the author could continue keeping us in the dark, and Mance is still alive for the same reasons (one of the reasons, at least - Mance has many uses). It's not as if Melisandre could have tons of practice with burning kings (preferably in double-blind tests). Weren't the leeches filled with Edric's Blood? Yes I agree that Melisandre might be wrong about the whole king's blood thing. *lol* about the double blind tests, but hey how old is melisandre, she might have conductec some long term experiments about the matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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