Jadakiss Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 Anyone else agree? Just put it all together Nobody actually saw the cut that he supposedly did. Then Arianna gets separated from her little click. Next Doran claims Darkstar did it and he is one of the biggest liars in the book, right up there with Aurane Waters (tons of lies on his part but off topic) for biggest liar award Sand snakes hear what was said and they all laugh and take it as a joke. (as if they know darkstar at least a little) Doran could have wanted her cut and planned the whole thing.....look at the other 2 characters left that it could possibly be and then that should be enough to scream cover up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Edd of House Tollet Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 Maybe, but who else then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadakiss Posted December 9, 2016 Author Share Posted December 9, 2016 6 minutes ago, King Edd of House Tollet said: Maybe, but who else then? the only other 2 there is..... think about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Universal Sword Donor Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 We have a POV from a guy who saw it and it never crosses his mind, so I'm gonna stick with DArkstar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 20 minutes ago, Universal Sword Donor said: We have a POV from a guy who saw it and it never crosses his mind, so I'm gonna stick with DArkstar. Hotah's attention was not on Darkstar. He was busy with Arys Oakheart. And Arianne was watching them. The most we get is that it appears to have been Darkstar. Could have been someone else, and Darkstar's blade merely kept theirs from connecting and cutting her pretty little head off. I've suggested before that Darkstar may actually have saved Myrcella's life at the cost of her ear. I disagree entirely about the OP's suggestion of Doran wanting Myrcella dead. That would only bring the entire Lannister army down on him, not to mention making his daughter and heir look REALLY bad. The reason he sent Hotah was because he knew Hotah would keep it quiet if anyone could. Doran is nowhere near even the top ten of dishonest characters in the series, and he's working a long game. The great ear caper was too spontaneous, and the work of someone who is NOT thinking long term. The most likely person from whom Darkstar might (just might, not a definite) have saved Myrcella would be Tyene or someone working for her with poison on his/her blade. Oberyn was immensely popular and it wouldn't take much persuading by one of his daughters to get someone to try and off Myrcella, or to convince the rest of the group to say Darkstar was responsible. After scuttling the plan he was odd man out and easily sacrificed. Also I hope it was Rosamund who lost an ear, not Myrcella. Can't think of a better reason for GRRM to write in a Myrcella stunt-double in the form of a lookalike cousin than for just such an occasion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beautiful Bloody Sword Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 Dude, you just summarized the most recent The Deeper Dorne series video by PJ that was released today. Stop fronting. And I don't even agree with the opinion in the video about Darkstar's innocence in the cutting Myrcella. I think he did it, but what he is innocent of, is the killing of Arys Oakhart, that was clearly Hotah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Universal Sword Donor Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 3 hours ago, Lady Blizzardborn said: Hotah's attention was not on Darkstar. He was busy with Arys Oakheart. And Arianne was watching them. The most we get is that it appears to have been Darkstar. Could have been someone else, and Darkstar's blade merely kept theirs from connecting and cutting her pretty little head off. I've suggested before that Darkstar may actually have saved Myrcella's life at the cost of her ear. I disagree entirely about the OP's suggestion of Doran wanting Myrcella dead. That would only bring the entire Lannister army down on him, not to mention making his daughter and heir look REALLY bad. The reason he sent Hotah was because he knew Hotah would keep it quiet if anyone could. Doran is nowhere near even the top ten of dishonest characters in the series, and he's working a long game. The great ear caper was too spontaneous, and the work of someone who is NOT thinking long term. The most likely person from whom Darkstar might (just might, not a definite) have saved Myrcella would be Tyene or someone working for her with poison on his/her blade. Oberyn was immensely popular and it wouldn't take much persuading by one of his daughters to get someone to try and off Myrcella, or to convince the rest of the group to say Darkstar was responsible. After scuttling the plan he was odd man out and easily sacrificed. Also I hope it was Rosamund who lost an ear, not Myrcella. Can't think of a better reason for GRRM to write in a Myrcella stunt-double in the form of a lookalike cousin than for just such an occasion. If there is no smoke, it's impossible (afaik) for there to be a traditional oxygen driven fire. And yes Doran might trust Areo to keep his mouth shut. That's irrelevant as we have access to his internal monologue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macgregor of the North Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 @Jadakiss I have to agree with @Beautiful Bloody Sword. I think you have been doing this with every post you have made since you recently joined us. Is that the way of it? Be truthful. If that's your style fair do's, but if there's any advice I'd give, I'd say read the books thoroughly, then do it again, analyse all the details, take your notes etc. and hit us with "your" take on things. Not what you see on a Youtubers theory site or whatever it is. I garauntee you will feel a better sense of involvement if you birthed your own thoughts. Yes, you may find that others have thought them before, this is a long game and others have been at it longer than us, but surely that is a better approach than watching someone's YouTube theory, then diving on here to proclaim your eternal belief in it. See it from our point of view, where's the mental stimulation for us if we can't even believe you came to these conclusions yourself. This is all directed in a friendly manner by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Weirwoods Eyes Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 Due to the SSM in which he says that if not for her horse shying, Myrcella would surely be dead. And that this is in response to being asked about Darkstars swordsmanship, in relation to him only slicing off her ear. I would say, yes he did it. Not to mention that earlier in the chapter, he urges Arrianne to kill the girl, as a surer method to war. I think he did it, and I think he wants war with the Lannister/Tyrell alliance. I think the mystery is why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadakiss Posted December 9, 2016 Author Share Posted December 9, 2016 5 hours ago, Macgregor of the North said: @Jadakiss I have to agree with @Beautiful Bloody Sword. I think you have been doing this with every post you have made since you recently joined us. Is that the way of it? Be truthful. If that's your style fair do's, but if there's any advice I'd give, I'd say read the books thoroughly, then do it again, analyse all the details, take your notes etc. and hit us with "your" take on things. Not what you see on a Youtubers theory site or whatever it is. I garauntee you will feel a better sense of involvement if you birthed your own thoughts. Yes, you may find that others have thought them before, this is a long game and others have been at it longer than us, but surely that is a better approach than watching someone's YouTube theory, then diving on here to proclaim your eternal belief in it. See it from our point of view, where's the mental stimulation for us if we can't even believe you came to these conclusions yourself. This is all directed in a friendly manner by the way. Im the one who writes all this material idiot. we work together lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadakiss Posted December 9, 2016 Author Share Posted December 9, 2016 9 hours ago, Beautiful Bloody Sword said: Dude, you just summarized the most recent The Deeper Dorne series video by PJ that was released today. Stop fronting. And I don't even agree with the opinion in the video about Darkstar's innocence in the cutting Myrcella. I think he did it, but what he is innocent of, is the killing of Arys Oakhart, that was clearly Hotah. hey dude guess what. I work together with him and that latest vid was my writing. Message me and I will show you an old post from months ago of me saying the same thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Protagoras Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 Darkstar is indeed the only one apart from Arianne herself that simply can´t be the traitor. Because his actions speak of war - and there is no way Doran want a war at this point. Darkstar is smart enough to realize that there is a sure way of creating the war he thinks Arianne wants. Crowning the Lannister girl is a hollow gesture. She will never sit the Iron Throne. Nor will you get the war you want. The lion is not so easily provoked.” “The lion’s dead. Who knows which cub the lioness prefers?” “The one in her own den.” Ser Gerold drew his sword. It glimmered in the starlight, sharp as lies. “This is how you start a war. Not with a crown of gold, but with a blade of steel.” The possible spy to Doran would after all act upon his command and not willfully work against his master, right? Yet if Darkstar has his way it will be hard for Dorne to talk themselves out of it. And if he had told Doran of the plan beforehand and somehow got it OKed, why make himself a fugitive? Once he tried to kill Myrcella, he had to have known that they would have come after him, to dispense justice/retribution. Why ruin his own life? It's possible that he was ordered to, as part of some secret plot to "do the dirty work" and lure more of the crown's people into Dorne to kill before actually starting the fighting, but considering Doran's other plans involving Targaryens, this seems highly unlikely. When speaking about possible traitors, Arys Oakheart is not particulary likely either. He is clearly seduced by Arianne and is willing to die to protect her. He doesn´t strike me as the person ratting behind her back, but rather a solied knight who wants to keep the little honor he have left. And if he is working for Doran then why is Hotah killing him? Why doesn´t he stop this coup earlier? And his death do seem to be out of duty and/or love and not guilt. In addition, we have the scene where Doran tricks Arys and tells him that he intends to take Myrcella to the Water gardens - and he reacts hard and tells Arianne, which Doran expected he would. Doran clearly knew who he worked for (otherwise, if Arys had been Dorans man there would have been no need to play games with him). Out of the three who are left (and all of them are likely), my money is on Drey. His punisment is by far the easiest, only 3 years in Norvos (and giving a traitor a position to serve Dorans wife sound very strange) where Sylvia get a forced marriage - maybe even legal raping included and Garins orphans was punished with gold and hostages, something that seems strange if there is an "understanding" between Garin and Doran (note that Doran is most likely not lying about these punisments, since it would be too easy for Arianne to check up on). In addition, he wanted a larger party (which makes it easier to discover) and is one of the first to surrender. He is not taken by shock like Garin (who is running towards the boats, which he certainly wouldn´t do if he were the traitor or a great actor) and he is most certainly not condemmed to a marriage with a possible Walder Frey. Edit: Oh, you mean that he is innocent of the maiming. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA...no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 13 minutes ago, Jadakiss said: hey dude guess what. I work together with him and that latest vid was my writing. Message me and I will show you an old post from months ago of me saying the same thing I was about to write an answer based on text but then I saw this. There is no point of a serious discussion or even a serious answer after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadakiss Posted December 9, 2016 Author Share Posted December 9, 2016 1 minute ago, Jon's Queen Consort said: I was about to write an answer based on text but then I saw this. There is no point of a serious discussion or even a serious answer after that. I love you to, its been a real long time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 21 minutes ago, Jadakiss said: Im the one who writes all this material idiot. we work together lol Personal attacks and insults how original... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadakiss Posted December 9, 2016 Author Share Posted December 9, 2016 1 minute ago, Jon's Queen Consort said: Personal attacks and insults how original... I was accused of something that he was totally wrong about, he was the dick not me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 8 minutes ago, Jadakiss said: I was accused of something that he was totally wrong about, he was the dick not me I am not sure if English is your first language but there are other ways of expressing your vexation with another poster without attacking and insulting him. As a great philosopher once said; Reverting to namecalling suggests that you are defensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadakiss Posted December 9, 2016 Author Share Posted December 9, 2016 3 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said: I am not sure if English is your first language but there are other ways of expressing your vexation with another poster without attacking and insulting him. As a great philosopher once said; Reverting to namecalling suggests that you are defensive. You must be a great teacher for your kindergarden class Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferocious Veldt Roarer Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 Your case is flawed. If the foundation of the argument is, we didn't actually see Darkstar mutilate Myrcella, which makes him def innocent, then, by the same token, since we didn't see Areo Hotah do that, Hotah is def innocent as well. Logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted December 9, 2016 Share Posted December 9, 2016 13 minutes ago, Jadakiss said: You must be a great teacher for your kindergarden class Is that supposed to be offensive, sarcastic or smart? Because it failed in all those categories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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