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Taboo: Tom Hardy's historical drama (BBC1/FX) [spoilers]


AncalagonTheBlack

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2 hours ago, Isis said:

So I imagine that

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the whole thing about Zipha's husband complaining that she cannot conceive their child (I love how it doesn't enter his head that it could be HIM who is lacking somehow) is to show that in fact it is her husband that cannot conceive and not her, because we think she already had a child? Unless she is doing a Cersei and somehow contriving to not conceive with her husband even though technically she could. I guess it will help his claim to the money if he has an heir, as he could then off his wife (and BIL, and MIL...).

Anyway, the husband is a massive tool and I can't wait for something bad to happen to him.

I came across Frontier on Netflix at the weekend. Might start watching that too.

 

I think it did enter his head that it could be him actually, even if he dismisses it. At least thats how i interpreted his goose/gander line

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4 hours ago, Isis said:

Anyway, the husband is a massive tool and I can't wait for something bad to happen to him.

 


He's a huge dick, but in this episode he was responsible for what I found to be the first two individually memorable scenes in this series so far- the confrontation with Delany (I think the first time we've seen Delaney arguably lose a face-to-face) and his raging at the end- so I hope he sticks around at least until other people start picking up the slack.

Lorna is also a good addition in terms of upsetting Delaney's apple-carts, so I hope she doesn't buzz off to Paris either.

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On 1/22/2017 at 6:40 PM, Horse of Kent said:
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That is a possibility. Would Zilpha ever have been able to inherit if she was illegitimate? Even if she was able to, the social stigma would surely have been huge, especially as she had an illegitimate child herself. Would Thorne ever have married her in that situation? 

Hardy certainly looks older than Chaplin, but as he is playing a character over ten years younger than himself, it is hard to tell whether that is intentional.

 

Well, one thing is sure - she certainly was not born after the death of James' mother, because that would make her no older than 18 now, and 8 at most when she was involved with her brother.

The simplest explanation would be that old Delaney's "new bride" was not Zilpha's mother, and that Delaney married 4 times and Zilpha was slightly older than James. That would mean that he was widowed when Zilpha was very little and very soon after went and bought himself a new bride.

The other possible explanation would be that, if the "new bride" was Zilpha's mother, she had been Delaney's mistress for years, after Anne was confined, and Zilpha was born out of wedlock. Now, I don't know what the late 18th century British laws were: was it possible to get your illegitimate child legitimized after marrying the child's mother, John of Gaunt style? If it was possible, Delaney seemed rich enough to be able to make it happen.

In any case, old Delaney seems to have had quite a complicated love life. 

Speaking of which, I did not expect Lorna to be such a likable character. Will we see her talk to James about his father? That would be a great opportunity for some flashbacks where we could find out more about the old man - he certainly seems to have been an interesting character - and to finally see Edward Fox on the show playing something other than a corpse.

Lorna also said that he talked to her about James' mother, and there was a strong implication in the previous episode that he remained hung up on James' mother for all his life - he appears to have first become interested in Lorna when he saw her playing the lead in a play called "Native Princess" or something like that.

 

On 1/22/2017 at 0:42 AM, HelenaExMachina said:

Re: the title, I'm not sure if you have seen tonight's episode yet, but something jumped out at me

 

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Zilpha's husband's talk with Delaney, and how he takes such pleasure in this idea of "wickedness" in his wife, that she committed this "Taboo" by having sex with her brother. I guess that is also connected to the title, the idea that this forbidden thing can be so enticing. Of course he was also trying to play mind games with Delaney - I know you want her, but she's mine, I'm going to punish her and hurt her and take great pleasure all the while.

Or maybe I read too much into it.

He was definitely playing mind games. His attempt to convince Delaney that he and Zilpha were having super hot sadomasochistic sex and that she was enjoying it seemed to have the desired effect, but definitely seems like bullshit when you look at the subsequent scene between him and Zilpha. Those two definitely don't look like people who are having a great sex life, or great anything. She doesn't look like a woman who's enjoying sex with her husband, or her married life in any way, and he is clearly extremely bitter and resentful. His pride must be really hurt, in addition to him being frustrated that she has neither brought him the inheritance he was hoping for, nor provided him with a child and heir - and on top of that, she's "soiled" and sexually "wicked", something an average 19th century gentleman would probably love in a mistress or prostitute, but not in his wife. 

And god, yes, he has become even more hateful, now even more than the EIC people. At first his and Zilpha's relationship just seemed cold and unhappy, but now he is downright abusive.

On another note, the only problem I've had with the show so far is that Mark Gatiss is so obviously wearing a fat suit and has paint on his face. It takes me out of the show every time he's on screen, although that's not that often.

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5 hours ago, AncalagonTheBlack said:

Guys,i made this into a 'Spoilers' thread cause some of you asked me to.Some of you are using spoiler tags.Should i edit/remove 'Spoilers' from thread title?

I'm good not using spoiler tags. Didn't notice you had changed the thread title.

Might be helpful for US viewers, if the rest of us remember, to either spoiler tag or make some mention of the fact we're starting to discuss the next week's episode once it airs in the U.K. and elsewhere. 

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On 21/01/2017 at 11:35 PM, HelenaExMachina said:

Enjoyed tonight's episode. It's a dialogue heavy show but I don't feel it's moving too slowly. And once again the atmosphere was brilliant throughout. I do have minor quibbles but nothing that ruins the show for me. And I watched for the first time without subtitles this week. Still no trouble understanding Hardy. *shrug*

Don't have too much to comment on at the moment, I want to save that for when I rewatch later in the week. One quick comment:

 

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Well done to whoever it was said Godfrey may end up being a spy. Not exactly right, but close

:cheers: 

Ha, I was ahead of the curve with that one given the show hadn't even reached the point where he'd be a spy! I also suspected they knew each other from earlier in their lives. In contrast, my suspicion that Delaney's servant was a ghost turned out to be wrong. Can't get them all and I'm pleased they aren't doing the "one of the characters is a ghost" trick.

 

As for the incest I keep thinking there's something we don't know. Maybe they both know they aren't blood relatives but for some reason they have their lack of relation secret? Maybe Hardy isn't actually a Delaney the implications of which would be disastrous if he inherited on the basis he was a son. Or the sister isn't - although the reason for that being a secret is trickier. At least we can be confident that Hardy Delaney is Hardy Delaney (because of the ghost mum) as one possibility with him leaving at such a young age is that the person who came back isn't the same person (like that richard gere film where the guy who returns is actually the friend of the real person).

 

Shame to hear Frontier is bad. It did seem like it could run as a parallel show. From what I've heard Momoa is great but the rest is lacking. Then again I've been burned before by negative reviews of netflix shows where the reviewer has only seen the first three episodes (sense8). It'll be good to hear if anyone makes it through the entire season and has thoughts on it.

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I'm embracing the no-spoiler-tag-required.  Good episode but still a slow burn, it needs some momentum soon.  All the drama came from the BIL. 

If Lorna is hung for assaulting the duke, does her estate revert to the crown?  I was wondering if that was the point of her entrapment. 

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55 minutes ago, Iskaral Pust said:

 

If Lorna is hung for assaulting the duke, does her estate revert to the crown?  I was wondering if that was the point of her entrapment. 

EPISODE 3 SPOILERS

 

I was wondering about that too - a lot of the plot seems to derive from multi-layered legal entanglements. I guess the fact that Lorna is willing to exchange Nootka for the house is a problem for the crown/EIC as they'd lose her as a means to an end. Not sure why they didn't just offer her a substantial sum for pursuing the Nootka claim? Delaney kept saying she was a "weakness" which suggests he feels they are exploiting her to get at him. I'm not clear why he cares though - if she were to hang it feels like it would remove a problem. Unless the plan is to spare her in exchange for her her claim on the island?

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More intrigue. Nice to see Delaney's plan slowly revealed, but I would prefer a little more each episode. Some more interesting developments with Lorna and Goddard, but I find it a bit of a stretch that the EIC wouldn't know about Godfrey's moonlighting seeing as it employs close to 200 spies. That and Delaney boarding up his house in fear of assassins but having no problem walking around London at all hours of the day.

I'm now curious as to who Carlsbad is.

Really want to get more of Delaney's backstory regarding his mother, "Anna", and his past with the EIC and the events in Africa.

 

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7 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said:

I'm embracing the no-spoiler-tag-required.  Good episode but still a slow burn, it needs some momentum soon.  All the drama came from the BIL. 

If Lorna is hung for assaulting the duke, does her estate revert to the crown?  I was wondering if that was the point of her entrapment. 

That would make sense... otherwise Delaney would have no motive to keep her alive

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1 hour ago, Horse of Kent said:

Unless they are going to introduce a character we have not met yet to be Carlsbad, by process of elimination it surely has to be Helga.

Nah, it's totally Winter :) Interesting info on the Sankofa http://www.radiotimes.com.edgesuite.net/news/2017-01-21/what-does-the-bird-symbol-in-taboo-mean

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Episode 4 spoilers

Another solid episode - still not moving fast but pieces are falling into place. A very welcome addition to the cast in Tom Hollander as a decadent drug addled chemist. Lorna is also gowing on me as she's not afraid to chart her own path it seems.

I also like how Delaney says he doesn't put anyone at risk who doesn't deserve it and is unapolgetic about it. It does feel like things are going too according to his own plan and the show needs to show him caught off-guard at some stage because at this point it seems like when he's attacked it's almost part of some plan eg getting stabbed allowed him to have more contact with the americans. I'm a bit dubious about his healing powers but as this episode had the strongest suggestion yet of him actually having powers (in his tele-sex) it maybe does fit.

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SPOILERS FOR EP. 4

 

This for me was the best episode so far.So we now know that the 'Countess' is Carlsbad.Wonder how the Americans found out about James and the half-sister.Could it be that the butler is working for them? Surely he could be one of the very few people who would know.Not good for James since the Americans will clearly use this for leverage against him.

The James/half-sister/husband triangle needs to come to a head/resolution quickly as it's getting a bit boring.Hopefully next episode's duel will help speed this along.The husband is a goner for sure,especially after what James did to the assasin the Americans sent after him,that was a brutal way to go.

What did you guys think about the 'dream sex' scene? :P:D That for me confirmed the supernatural plot of the show.

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17 minutes ago, AncalagonTheBlack said:

This for me was the best episode so far.So we now know that the 'Countess' is Carlsbad.Wonder how the Americans found out about James and the half-sister.Could it be that the butler is working for them?

Do you mean Brace, or Zilpha's butler?

17 minutes ago, AncalagonTheBlack said:

The James/half-sister/husband triangle needs to come to a head/resolution quickly as it's getting a bit boring.Hopefully next episode's duel will help speed this along.The husband is a goner for sure,especially after what James did to the assasin the Americans sent after him,that was a brutal way to go.

If there is a duel. I may be misremembering, but I'm fairly sure duelling is technically illegal in Britain at this time. The law was usually ignored, particularly if the duellists were well connected, but of course it's the kind of thing that would give the Crown a pretext to arrest James even if he won. So he might duck out. It's not as if he's bothered about his honour.

 

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