The Anti-Targ Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 53 minutes ago, Altherion said: Why in the world would anyone want to be the Democratic version of McConnell? The obstruction strategy is fundamentally flawed: it damages both parties and it's not clear which one was damaged more. The Democrats lost bigly, but the Republicans had half of their platform or more torn up by opportunistic populists. Although... I suppose McConnell's behavior did ultimately get his wife appointed to a Cabinet position so it's not all bad, but I don't think Sanders would be interesting in harming his cause even if he personally came out ahead. Surely the obstruction strategy has worked very well for the Republicans. Within the span of 8 years they went from not running any of the branches (losing ground in both the Senate and House in 2008) of government to running them all. Seems like a complete vindication of the strategy to me. Obstruct the ruling party to a standstill, and then beat them up about being a do nothing government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altherion Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 53 minutes ago, Kalbear said: McConnell's strategy paid off. I don't know how it damaged anyone. The Republicans got almost every single thing they possibly wanted save Romney elected in 2012. They got campaign reform destroyed, they got to repeal the ACA, they got a Republican majority everywhere for the first time in, like, a billion years and they got all this at a time when executive action was at its highest power ever. This is a case of gaining the world in exchange for one's soul. The Republican party is in power now, yes... but it is not McConnell's Republican party anymore -- it's Trump's party now. As people have noted above, they've turned 180 degrees on issues both serious and trivial. 53 minutes ago, Kalbear said: No, the value for Sanders (or really, any Democrat, but Sanders as outsider especially) is acting as an actual opposition point to Trump in everything. Again, why? The one thing Sanders has that is quite rare among politicians is that he has stuck to many important and unpopular (within the elite, at least) views for decades. I don't see any benefit to abandoning them now simply because Trump happens to be on the same side on some of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThinkerX Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 1 hour ago, Kalbear said: Did you see that on a message board? Nope. Just logic and guesswork. The names bandied about as Democratic POTUS candidates for 2020 are all either too old, have tainted pasts, or have the charisma of a dead duck. Hence, chuck the whole lot of them and find somebody competent and charismatic. Zuckerberg is the name that leaps to mind. Of course, this does mean accepting the US will become a corporate state in everything but name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 wait... when did zuckerberg become charismatic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThinkerX Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 12 minutes ago, chairman lmao said: wait... when did zuckerberg become charismatic? You're saying he's not? I submit that he is more charismatic than Hillary, and possibly Warren. Maybe not Biden. But he's also decades younger than any of those three, making him potentially more likable to the youth vote, the group the DNC threw away when they railroaded Sanders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 I guess he's preparing for the job already. He's now claiming to no longer be atheist, iirc. First order of business in being a politician in a secular government - find some sort of sky fairy to refer to during speeches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongRider Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 3 minutes ago, Dr. Pepper said: I guess he's preparing for the job already. He's now claiming to no longer be atheist, iirc. First order of business in being a politician in a secular government - find some sort of sky fairy to refer to during speeches. He claims to be a Republican, so yeah, sky fairies and false piety req'd. At least during the campaign we didn't have to listen to Cruz and Trump yap about both being Jesus's pick for the White House. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGimletEye Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Just now, ThinkerX said: I submit that he is more charismatic than Hillary, and possibly Warren. Maybe not Biden. But he's also decades younger than any of those three, making him potentially more likable to the youth vote, the group the DNC threw away when they railroaded Sanders. I don't just don't know about these "celebrity" candidates. I'm just not real confident they can go down in places like Detroit and Pittsburgh and in rural counties and get the Democratic base back. I'm just not real confident they can really connect with lots of these people. Obama could do that. Zuckerburg could probably win California. But, we need Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania back. And probably Ohio too. Also, I think at this point it also extremely important for the Democratic Party to start recruiting good candidates, to include a lot of women and minority candidates, and start grooming them for leadership. Which also means concentrating on local elections too. And then of course, the Democratic Party needs to figure out just what in the hell it wants to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fallen Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 On 1/22/2017 at 7:40 PM, Rippounet said: It most likely wouldn't. Military cooperation between France and Germany right now is unprecedented and keeps improving, with many joint projects for the future. I'm pretty sure if Germany wanted nukes France'd give it the technology, no questions asked. The greatest opposition to Germany getting nukes is, and will remain, the Germans themselves. Thanks for response. On 1/22/2017 at 7:41 PM, James Arryn said: Again, we're revisiting the agonistic assumptions of Cold War nostalgia/stratification, and the CW was always a WWII hangover deal. I mean, I guess it makes sense if you're a Reagan type, where you can retrograde to a time when things seemed* black and white, good guys R Us, etc. So given that so many internet Machiavellis were introduced to the world under that dynamic, it makes sense that they want to go home. But, further, EVERY new nuke player was an unwelcome member of the club. Every time it signalled the tipping point to those on the up side of the status quo. U.S. wanted to be the only one...bit more elbow room for your odd Hiroshima I guess...and each new nuclear power was a betrayal from their POV. So possessors not wanting ______ to possess isn't really a surprise. That makes sense. On 1/22/2017 at 7:42 PM, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Ermm... That's pretty funny. On 1/22/2017 at 7:59 PM, chairman lmao said: yeah, when I worry about a modern day nuclear power inexplicably falling under th spell of a burgeoning neo-nazi movement... probably worth keeping close tabs on Germany On 1/22/2017 at 8:40 PM, Ser Scot A Ellison said: Yes. Both. Didn't a French Politician say after the Berlin wall fell "I love Germany so much I hope there will always be two." I'd be shocked if France were blasee about Germany developing Nuclear Weapons. I don't know, Germany seems to have made a complete turnaround, from being too martial to being almost pacifist. Haven't they earned our trust after 70 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 3 minutes ago, The Fallen said: That's pretty funny. Norm Macdonald is kind of a master. I love his Hitler bits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davos Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Time to put this thread to bed. Seek ye the new US politics thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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