A Horse Named Stranger Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 5 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: If only this EO had been passed in time to save the victims of the Bowling Green Massacre. Don'T worry about them, they received a very classy and dignified service, before they were buried underneath Comet Ping Pong Pizzeria in DC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThinkerX Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 Apologies if this has already been posted (didn't see it), but it appears the LGBT crowd may have Trump to thank (or at least his family) for saving them from conservative republicans. He also appeared to have showed no interest in approving the 'religious freedom' bill. Pence must be super ticked off along about now. http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/ivanka-trump-and-jared-kushner-helped-thwart-lgbt-rights-rollback/ar-AAmBrmU?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=msnclassic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 46 minutes ago, Samantha Stark said: At least with the new EO Antifa members won't have any trouble getting their hands on weapons for their glorious armed resistance. Are you saying this un-ironically? As though speaking out and opposing fascism isn't a good thing to do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altherion Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 4 hours ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: You feel bad for her? At least she has some integrity. Maybe, but what comes across more in that article is naivete. Everyone else is very transparently trying to attract as much attention as possible whereas she portrays herself as genuinely concerned with her cause despite it being quite similar in nature (if opposite in polarity) as the other causes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 Just now, Altherion said: Maybe, but what comes across more in that article is naivete. Everyone else is very transparently trying to attract as much attention as possible whereas she portrays herself as genuinely concerned with her cause despite it being quite similar in nature (if opposite in polarity) as the other causes. Eh, she more or less says that she accepted this invitation reluctantly, knowing full well the sorts of people she was likely to run into. Seems to me the only similarity she has to the folks she's writing about is that they are essentially internet personalities or commenters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samantha Stark Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 5 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: Are you saying this un-ironically? As though speaking out and opposing fascism isn't a good thing to do? It's a good thing to do, certainly...if only fascism existed as anything more than a buzzword in the 21st century. What DOES exist is a bunch of wannabe Cheka/Red Guard/Red Front type thugs that routinely initiate violence. You know, antifa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The guy from the Vale Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 34 minutes ago, Samantha Stark said: It's a good thing to do, certainly...if only fascism existed as anything more than a buzzword in the 21st century. What DOES exist is a bunch of wannabe Cheka/Red Guard/Red Front type thugs that routinely initiate violence. You know, antifa. Your bias is showing. Indeed, what doesn't exist in any meaningful way any longer is communism, not fascism. After 1990, the former was utterly discredited. Fascism used to be discredited after 1945, too - but almost nobody is alive to remember what it was like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samantha Stark Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 1 minute ago, theguyfromtheVale said: Your bias is showing. Indeed, what doesn't exist in any meaningful way any longer is communism, not fascism. After 1990, the former was utterly discredited. Nah, they just rebranded themselves as socialists in the west. Socialism and Communism are inherently related and inseparable ideologies. It was the Union of Soviet SOCIALIST Republics, after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martell Spy Posted February 4, 2017 Author Share Posted February 4, 2017 Sweden’s deputy prime minister trolled Trump with a feminist photo op "We are a feminist government, which shows in this photo.” http://www.vox.com/world/2017/2/3/14498680/sweden-deputy-pm-trolls-trump-all-women-photo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The guy from the Vale Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 4 minutes ago, Samantha Stark said: Nah, they just rebranded themselves as socialists in the west. Socialism and Communism are inherently related and inseparable ideologies. It was the Union of Soviet SOCIALIST Republics, after all. Eh... no. Never trust the branding of any given nation. Or do you think North Korea is a democracy? More to the point, there are various kinds of socialism. There's revolutionary socialism, which is indeed linked with communism to some extent (but not necessarily, anarchosyndicalism and the like aren't communism while still revolutionary socialism). Those are however utterly irrelevant today. The socialism that still has some relevance is social democracy - but that one has been a staunch opponent of communism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samantha Stark Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 14 minutes ago, theguyfromtheVale said: Eh... no. Never trust the branding of any given nation. Or do you think North Korea is a democracy? More to the point, there are various kinds of socialism. There's revolutionary socialism, which is indeed linked with communism to some extent (but not necessarily, anarchosyndicalism and the like aren't communism while still revolutionary socialism). Those are however utterly irrelevant today. The socialism that still has some relevance is social democracy - but that one has been a staunch opponent of communism. I find this is an interesting conversation in its own right, but back the point. Do you deny Antifa is a violent left wing organization? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The guy from the Vale Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 No, I don't. I think their numbers, influence and threat are all vastly overstated though. I do deny that fascism is irrelevant as a political force in the West today. Indeed, it is far more relevant than communism, seeing how fascist and fascistoid movements like the French Front National are thriving in the current political climate, while communist parties are the absolute fringe and even most social democratic parties like British Labour have embraced full-fledged capitalism in the lat 30 years. In the context of American politics, this is even more pronounced: Even social democratic positions like Bernie Sanders' are considered left-wing fringe, while the sitting president is being advised by fascists, white nationalists and the like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samantha Stark Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 1 hour ago, Martell Spy said: Sweden’s deputy prime minister trolled Trump with a feminist photo op "We are a feminist government, which shows in this photo.” http://www.vox.com/world/2017/2/3/14498680/sweden-deputy-pm-trolls-trump-all-women-photo So Nikki Haley doesn't count as a woman in Trump's cabinent? Linda McMahon? Elaine Chao? Betsy DeVos? I mean, I know there is a "Trump hates wimmins!" narrative to keep going here and we can't let facts get in the way, but come on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butterbumps! Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 10 hours ago, Altherion said: That is an interesting article. I feel a bit sorry for the writer -- she appears to believe her own propaganda whereas practically all of the other people in the article know that they're playing a game and don't take it to heart. 3 hours ago, Altherion said: Maybe, but what comes across more in that article is naivete. Everyone else is very transparently trying to attract as much attention as possible whereas she portrays herself as genuinely concerned with her cause despite it being quite similar in nature (if opposite in polarity) as the other causes. I'm struggling to understand your view with this. Laurie is decidedly not the only "true believer" of a cause in that piece (see Roosh V, and he also seems significantly less self aware, as well as less aware of how anything works). I don't get the condescension toward Laurie, nor do I get why you're painting her as naive. She points out that unlike Milo, she actually cares about her cause, which means that if they ever went head to head, she'd lose before it even starts (paraphrased). She's extremely aware that there's a "game," as well as the limits of earnestness in combatting toxic trolling. I also don't get why you're equating her work with those of the self-described "provocateurs" (trolls). Feminist writers are basically trolls in your view, or is Laurie a troll specifically? Is this your way of trying to erase distinction between those writing for civil rights causes and those trolling toxic ideas by calling them both "provocateurs?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mormont Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 4 hours ago, Samantha Stark said: At least with the new EO Antifa members won't have any trouble getting their hands on weapons for their glorious armed resistance. Trump supporters appear to have no trouble with that already. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/25/shooting-milo-yiannopoulos-speech-seattle-charges I believe this incident has been pointed out to you before, and you just blew right past it. Hypothetical shootings of Trump supporters by anti-fascist protestors appear to be a concern, but actual shootings of protestors by Trump supporters aren't. As long as you take that stance, your repeated interjections are clearly shown as insincere and should be ignored. 3 hours ago, ThinkerX said: Apologies if this has already been posted (didn't see it), but it appears the LGBT crowd may have Trump to thank (or at least his family) for saving them from conservative republicans. He also appeared to have showed no interest in approving the 'religious freedom' bill. Pence must be super ticked off along about now. http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/ivanka-trump-and-jared-kushner-helped-thwart-lgbt-rights-rollback/ar-AAmBrmU?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=msnclassic Again, Trump has promised, publicly, to sign that religious freedom bill into law when it crosses his desk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rippounet Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 3 hours ago, Samantha Stark said: It's a good thing to do, certainly...if only fascism existed as anything more than a buzzword in the 21st century. What DOES exist is a bunch of wannabe Cheka/Red Guard/Red Front type thugs that routinely initiate violence. You know, antifa. Fascism is alive and well today. Wikipedia has a compilation of organizations by countries. It's quite long:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fascist_movements_by_country_A–F And of course, that's just looking at rather small openly fascist organizations, without getting into the influence that fascist thought has on some right-wing political parties (National Front in France) or figures (Steve Bannon, Geerte Wilders... ). Also, communism as a political movement is quite dead in the West. There is a comeback of some versions of left-wing anarchism though. I think whatever you want to say you should be careful to use the terms correctly. No doubt there is some exageration and hyperbole whenever it comes to fascism. But equating socialism with communism isn't going to help you make your case about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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