TTTNE (v.468) AB I - a title of one's own

[RhaenysBee]

3 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

I am already planning to have a huge hung over on Saturday. 

That is not what we deserve that is what people vote for  

Oh god I hate hangover. But good luck to you and prepare all the water for Saturday  

true enough.  

[Jon's Queen Consort]

7 minutes ago, RhaenysB said:

Oh god I hate hangover. But good luck to you and prepare all the water for Saturday  

true enough.  

OH MY GOD!  what? Why? How? Sorry I mean the way I wrote hangover. That is what you get for doing more than three things the same time.

[RhaenysBee]

14 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

OH MY GOD!  what? Why? How? Sorry I mean the way I wrote hangover. That is what you get for doing more than three things the same time.

Why now? Multi tasking is cool.   do you have any news of your job interview? 

[Buckwheat]

12 hours ago, rocksniffer said:

1. ab aeterno and rocksniffer will now act as non-ruling Lords of Anarchy for the year, but all the petty decisions the chief anarchists make, must to be ratified at a special biweekly meeting of at least one sane person. A simple majority is needed in the case of purely internal affairs, but by a two thirds majority in the case of more lewd events, and of course to authorize a group grope, a unanimous vote is required.

This is the Internet. Sane persons are hard to come by.

8 hours ago, RhaenysB said:

Erm... WHY on god's earth would you need a scan of your diploma to apply for a job? It's not like recruiters spend more than 20 seconds looking at your CV. We trust you, if you say you have a degree in this and this, we don't believe you.

After learning that they don't really read anything and only skim your CV, no idea. That was just how we learned in school. But I never heard about it later again, so it is probably not necessary.

5 hours ago, The BlackBear said:

'Cut our nose off to spite our face' ?

Was it not something about putting a foot in one's mouth? Or is that one only for talking?

[Jon's Queen Consort]

2 hours ago, RhaenysB said:

Why now? Multi tasking is cool.  

But making mistakes without being drunk isn't.

2 hours ago, RhaenysB said:

do you have any news of your job interview? 

Not yet and that is one of the reasons why I want have too get drunk.

[First of My Name]

I'm liking the new non-rules.

19 hours ago, Buckwheat said:

 

A regular sleep pattern really is important. When I miss sleep at a time when I usually sleep, I cannot just make up for it at some other hour of the day, I will be tired, but will not be able to fall asleep for long.

Our generation will never reach retirement.

Yep, that's the problem. But it's my own fault, I should just go to bed sooner, and get out sooner.

 

[RhaenysBee]

59 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

But making mistakes without being drunk isn't.

Not yet and that is one of the reasons why I want have too get drunk.

Drunk typos are funny. 

Oh I See. Don't stress too much about it though, these processes are veeeeery slow. 

1 hour ago, Buckwheat said:

This is the Internet. Sane persons are hard to come by.

After learning that they don't really read anything and only skim your CV, no idea. That was just how we learned in school. But I never heard about it later again, so it is probably not necessary.

A friend of mine had some sort of career advice class too. They told her the stupidest things. Don't believe what they tell you at school about job application. 

 

I've been telling myself for weeks not to get my hopes up because I would never get this flat and I could start looking all over again, and I thought I hadn't, but now that it's final that I'm not getting the flat and I can start looking all over again, I am so pissed. So angry and so sad. Yes the flat was almost perfect and my heart is bleeding for it, but what pisses me off the most is that I've been looking for a goddamn flat for 5+ months now and I'm back at the start line again. It's just so so so stressful. 

[ab aeterno]

1 hour ago, Buckwheat said:

After learning that they don't really read anything and only skim your CV, no idea. That was just how we learned in school. But I never heard about it later again, so it is probably not necessary.

For large companies here, increasingly they don't even ask for a CV. Just your degree and grade, some basic employment history, and ask you to answer some questions. Of course, that's just the first stage, followed by online tests, etc.

[HexMachina]

1 hour ago, Buckwheat said:

This is the Internet. Sane persons are hard to come by.

After learning that they don't really read anything and only skim your CV, no idea. That was just how we learned in school. But I never heard about it later again, so it is probably not necessary.

Was it not something about putting a foot in one's mouth? Or is that one only for talking?

Putting your foot in your mouth means having said something you shouldn't. Like if you were with a friend and you had a surprise party planned for them and said are you excited for your party tonight?

Or in the midst of coitus screaming out an ex's name.

21 minutes ago, ab aeterno said:

For large companies here, increasingly they don't even ask for a CV. Just your degree and grade, some basic employment history, and ask you to answer some questions. Of course, that's just the first stage, followed by online tests, etc.

*triggering intensifies*

I hate job applications. But Ab is right, I think I've only had one where I had to attach my CV. Mostly they seem to ask about challenges the firm will face in the current climate, why you are a good fit for the firm/role, etc. I guess the applications aren't so bad really. It's interviews I can't do, I always get too nervous and bumble my answers and forget what I know about the firm.

[Buckwheat]

1 hour ago, ab aeterno said:

For large companies here, increasingly they don't even ask for a CV. Just your degree and grade, some basic employment history, and ask you to answer some questions. Of course, that's just the first stage, followed by online tests, etc.

I cannot imagine they ask for a grade. Not that this is bad news for me, my grades have always been brilliant and I finished uni with two 10s, so ...

53 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Putting your foot in your mouth means having said something you shouldn't. Like if you were with a friend and you had a surprise party planned for them and said are you excited for your party tonight?

Or in the midst of coitus screaming out an ex's name.

Well you can say the British should not have said they want out of the EU ...

53 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said:

I hate job applications. But Ab is right, I think I've only had one where I had to attach my CV. Mostly they seem to ask about challenges the firm will face in the current climate, why you are a good fit for the firm/role, etc. I guess the applications aren't so bad really. It's interviews I can't do, I always get too nervous and bumble my answers and forget what I know about the firm.

I have only had two some-kind-of-a-job-interviews. Oh wait, three. I imagined it would be way way too stressful, but then they were more like chats. So probably those two that got me jobs really needed somebody. The third one, I do not remember what happened, I think it was sait I might get called, but I didn't, and then I ended up getting the other teaching job anyway.

I once had a skype interview for a dorm room.That was ridiculous. I did not pass it. That city be crazy.

[ab aeterno]

1 hour ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Putting your foot in your mouth means having said something you shouldn't. Like if you were with a friend and you had a surprise party planned for them and said are you excited for your party tonight?

Or in the midst of coitus screaming out an ex's name.

*triggering intensifies*

I hate job applications. But Ab is right, I think I've only had one where I had to attach my CV. Mostly they seem to ask about challenges the firm will face in the current climate, why you are a good fit for the firm/role, etc. I guess the applications aren't so bad really. It's interviews I can't do, I always get too nervous and bumble my answers and forget what I know about the firm.

[ab aeterno]

7 minutes ago, Buckwheat said:

I cannot imagine they ask for a grade. Not that this is bad news for me, my grades have always been brilliant and I finished uni with two 10s, so ...

Basically it's so they can instantly reject anyone below the top three grades. 

[Buckwheat]

1 minute ago, ab aeterno said:

Basically it's so they can instantly reject anyone below the top three grades. 

Maybe that is important for your first job out of college, but a few years later? How important are those grades once you have already had a real job?

[ab aeterno]

4 minutes ago, Buckwheat said:

Maybe that is important for your first job out of college, but a few years later? How important are those grades once you have already had a real job?

Less so... but it depends on the job. At the moment, a large segment of the workforce doesn't have degrees, but going forward, most people will have degrees. So the competition will be for experience and top grades.

[First of My Name]

The new title  

[RhaenysBee]

2 hours ago, ab aeterno said:

For large companies here, increasingly they don't even ask for a CV. Just your degree and grade, some basic employment history, and ask you to answer some questions. Of course, that's just the first stage, followed by online tests, etc.

That sounds like a very stupid way to make a hiring choice. (Asking for the degree and a grade) 

1 hour ago, ab aeterno said:

Basically it's so they can instantly reject anyone below the top three grades. 

Again, this is stupid of them. 

58 minutes ago, Buckwheat said:

Maybe that is important for your first job out of college, but a few years later? How important are those grades once you have already had a real job?

Absolutely unimportant and irrelevant. Even for your first job out of college your internships and extracurricular activities and language skills and personality counts. Nobody gives a rat's ass about grades, at least not here. Top grade students don't necessarily perform better in a working environment, in fact, it's often C students who prove to be more successful. 

54 minutes ago, ab aeterno said:

Less so... but it depends on the job. At the moment, a large segment of the workforce doesn't have degrees, but going forward, most people will have degrees. So the competition will be for experience and top grades.

Once again, associating school grades with work performance is stupid. Work expectations and school expectations are wastly different, top grades don't reflect the skill sets most valuable to enterprises. Big companies look for confident, agile people who are good at representing interests, communicating, negotiating, making decisions, selling themselves and finding shortcuts and making most of limited resources. That's not what getting straight As teach you. 

Again, this may be slightly different in the UK, but international studies seem to confirm these things as a global trend. 

What employers use CVs or job application forms for is to compare it to their checklist. What we check off to actually give someone a call: degree, English, position filled, years of experience, industry. This is about those five lines of the CV one can read in 10-20 seconds.

Here we really don't care about anybody's grades or hobbies and interests, we never ever even open motivation letter or recommendation letter files. People only ever include the grade of their degree if it's a B or an A. And including the grade draws attention as it's not customary, so people will say who gives a shit about that for a B degree and ooooh look at that conceited little nerd for an A degree. Yes, that's very mean. I don't think anybody should include their grades unless specifically asked for in the application form. 

[ab aeterno]

Just now, RhaenysB said:

That sounds like a very stupid way to make a hiring choice. (Asking for the degree and a grade) 

Again, this is stupid of them. 

Absolutely unimportant and irrelevant. Even for your first job out of college your internships and extracurricular activities and language skills and personality counts. Nobody gives a rat's ass about grades, at least not here. Top grade students don't necessarily perform better in a working environment, in fact, it's often C students who prove to be more successful. 

Once again, associating school grades with work performance is stupid. Work expectations and school expectations are wastly different, top grades don't reflect the skill sets most valuable to enterprises. Big companies look for confident, agile people who are good at representing interests, communicating, negotiating, making decisions, selling themselves and finding shortcuts and making most of limited resources. That's not what getting straight As teach you. 

Again, this may be slightly different in the UK, but international studies seem to confirm these things as a global trend. 

What employers use CVs or job application forms is to compare it to their checklist. What we check off to actually give someone a call: degree, English, position filled, years of experience, industry. This is about those five lines of the CV one can read in 10-20 seconds.

Here we really don't care about anybody's grades or hobbies and interests, we never ever even open motivation letter or recommendation letter files. People only ever include the grade of their degree if it's a B or an A. And including the grade draws attention as it's not customary, so people will say who gives a shit about that for a B degree and ooooh look at that conceited little nerd for an A degree. Yes, that's very mean. I don't think anybody should include their grades unless specifically asked for in the application form. 

It's probably not an exhaustively good way of hiring, but it's a cheap way of filtering large numbers of applicants down to a more easonable number - you can't really sort 50,000 applicants individually, for example.

There are far better ways to profile people, although having said that, I'd always favour graduates over non-graduates. Primarily it's about world view. 

[RhaenysBee]

Just now, ab aeterno said:

It's probably not an exhaustively good way of hiring, but it's a cheap way of filtering large numbers of applicants down to a more easonable number - you can't really sort 50,000 applicants individually, for example.

There are far better ways to profile people, although having said that, I'd always favour graduates over non-graduates. Primarily it's about world view. 

It really depends on the position and the location of the job. There aren't ever 50,000 applications for a job here, even the most popular jobs with the most generic requirements top at a few hundred applicants. That's understandable with just London having more residents than my entire country. 

And I work in a rather candidate driven market which is again a big difference, applicants don't come to us, we go to them. 

As for degrees, we have a rather unfair distinction between young candidates and older ones. As a junior candidate, we don't really talk to anybody without a degree, however with senior or management level candidates a degree gets less important as there's the 10+ years of work experience vouching for the person and whether or not s/he got a degree over a decade ago is not all that relevant. He was given a chance to prove himself back then and he did. Today however young people aren't really give a chance to prove themselves in a white collar job, a degree is the basic entry ticket everybody needs to have. Whether or not that's good is a question for the philosopher. 

[Buckwheat]

29 minutes ago, First of My Name said:

The new title  

I only noticed it now.

A degree is necessary by now for almost anything.

I am pretty sure 50 000 was a vast exaggerration.

So you are not supposed to include anything like proof of your language skills or shit? Huh. That makes things easier.

[ab aeterno]

12 minutes ago, RhaenysB said:

It really depends on the position and the location of the job. There aren't ever 50,000 applications for a job here, even the most popular jobs with the most generic requirements top at a few hundred applicants. That's understandable with just London having more residents than my entire country. 

And I work in a rather candidate driven market which is again a big difference, applicants don't come to us, we go to them. 

As for degrees, we have a rather unfair distinction between young candidates and older ones. As a junior candidate, we don't really talk to anybody without a degree, however with senior or management level candidates a degree gets less important as there's the 10+ years of work experience vouching for the person and whether or not s/he got a degree over a decade ago is not all that relevant. He was given a chance to prove himself back then and he did. Today however young people aren't really give a chance to prove themselves in a white collar job, a degree is the basic entry ticket everybody needs to have. Whether or not that's good is a question for the philosopher. 

All true.

5 minutes ago, Buckwheat said:

I only noticed it now.

A degree is necessary by now for almost anything.

I am pretty sure 50 000 was a vast exaggerration.

So you are not supposed to include anything like proof of your language skills or shit? Huh. That makes things easier.

For once I actually wasn't exaggerating. It's not unusual for City firms to have 50,000 applicants for some of their training programmes. Although that's worldwide to be fair. The same rules apply though, and they use the degree and grade to cut those numbers down sharply.

ETA: Should say that's probably for like 500 positions. So roughly 100/1 ratio.

For non-native English speakers you usually need a CPE or equivalent.