Tywin and Valyrian Steel

[TheYellowAppleFossoway]

I always wondered why Tywin didn't try and get the Valyrian steel dagger that Robert won during a tourny bet (the one that was subsequently used in the attempted assassination of Bran). The text mentions Tywin's obsession with obtaining a Valyrian steel weapon, so why wouldn't he pressure Robert (a man in great debt to him) to give him the dagger or offer to buy it from Littlefinger (a man who values money more than legendary steel). The fact that Robert doesn't even care for the blade makes the transaction even easier. 

With the dagger in Lannister possession, Tywin could try and get more small Valyrian blades (surely more exist) and melt them down into a short sword or at least trick up the current blade with some rubies and golden lions on a handle to make it an honorary placeholder. 

What do you think? 

[Kingmonkey]

Given that the Lannister sword Brightroar is said to have cost enough to raise a small army, and that the price of Valyrian steel weapons has gone up significantly since then, we have to wonder why would Baelish casually wager such an insanely valuable blade? Indeed, why didn't the catspaw flee to Essos with it, sell it and live a life of easy luxury?

The only answer that really makes sense is that when GRRM wrote the dagger into the story, he had not yet decided just how rare VS weapons were. 

[Khal Shaggydog]

I agree with KingMonkey. It doesnt make sense at all on its face.

Littlefinger claims it was his (how the F did he get it in the first place), and that he lost it to Tyrion. I'll start by assuming thats a lie, since its coming out of LIttlefinger's mouth. Tyrion then backs that up by claiming, with sound reason, that its not his, he would never bet against Jaime,  besides the fact that he would never have then given the dagger to Robert (knowing it was so valuable).

So we have LF inserting himself into the story to try and pin something on Tyrion, which was an clumsy attempt as it later proved. We're still left with the fact that someone gave Robert a VS dagger, and this person is unkonwn and apparently not worth mentioning. My guess is its from Illryio, given he would be one of the only people in the entire story that would have access to such an item, and the inclination to utilize it as a flattering gift.

[Curled Finger]

11 hours ago, TheYellowAppleFossoway said:

I always wondered why Tywin didn't try and get the Valyrian steel dagger that Robert won during a tourny bet (the one that was subsequently used in the attempted assassination of Bran). The text mentions Tywin's obsession with obtaining a Valyrian steel weapon, so why wouldn't he pressure Robert (a man in great debt to him) to give him the dagger or offer to buy it from Littlefinger (a man who values money more than legendary steel). The fact that Robert doesn't even care for the blade makes the transaction even easier. 

With the dagger in Lannister possession, Tywin could try and get more small Valyrian blades (surely more exist) and melt them down into a short sword or at least trick up the current blade with some rubies and golden lions on a handle to make it an honorary placeholder. 

What do you think? 

Thurgood's inventories states there are 227 VS blades in Westeros.  Of those blades, only 13 were VS swords.  Tywin lusted for a VS sword.  As stated above, Brightroar--a Greatsword--cost the equivalent of the price of an army in gold...400 years or so ago.  It's not that Tywin didn't try--he approached 3 impoverished lesser houses in attempts to purchase their swords.  It had to be a sword.  It had to be a real sword, not a short sword and not a piecemeal sword.  Melting down Ice and utterly mutilating it to make OK & WW was a ghastly thing to do.  Tywin was a man without honor in that act.  He was able to claim a real longsword for his own house and give his jerk grandson the leavings and look great all the way around.   

I think it had to be a real sword above all.  Little Finger's dagger is rare.  I'm not sure Tywin would have been able to collect enough VS to make a new longsword.  I'm no smith but I would imagine a 9 pound 4 - 5' long sword would require 20 smaller blades at least?  

[TheYellowAppleFossoway]

On 2/6/2017 at 10:32 PM, Curled Finger said:

Thurgood's inventories states there are 227 VS blades in Westeros.  Of those blades, only 13 were VS swords.  Tywin lusted for a VS sword.  As stated above, Brightroar--a Greatsword--cost the equivalent of the price of an army in gold...400 years or so ago.  It's not that Tywin didn't try--he approached 3 impoverished lesser houses in attempts to purchase their swords.  It had to be a sword.  It had to be a real sword, not a short sword and not a piecemeal sword.  Melting down Ice and utterly mutilating it to make OK & WW was a ghastly thing to do.  Tywin was a man without honor in that act.  He was able to claim a real longsword for his own house and give his jerk grandson the leavings and look great all the way around.   

I think it had to be a real sword above all.  Little Finger's dagger is rare.  I'm not sure Tywin would have been able to collect enough VS to make a new longsword.  I'm no smith but I would imagine a 9 pound 4 - 5' long sword would require 20 smaller blades at least?  

I get where you're coming from on this. Perhaps it's Tywin's arrogance, but it seems foolish to not attempt to purchase 20 lesser blades in the pursuit of a long sword. The Ice seizure was not at all predictable, so it seems like Tywin's arrogance got in the way of him being proactive about getting what he wants.