Legion (FX's Marvel tv series) [SPOILERS]

[dbunting]

Well it was definitely the most interesting show this season for me. Oliver coming back and conveniently being there for SK was a bit much, especially given how David and Oliver were compared to each other.

Love the team of Aubrey and Oliver though, I'd love to road trip with that duo!

Not sure on the orb at the end. It seemed out of place tech wise. I know D3 sent something in but if they had something that advanced why wouldn't they have used it the whole time instead of sending in the cannon fodder generic soldiers?  

[HexMachina]

It seems a bit early to be jumping to conclusions about season 2 already...

[Rhom]

For a bit there when David was discussing phantom pain with the Shadow King and immediately following all his talk of peace and bringing an end to war; I really thought we were coming to some sort of resolution where David and SK came to a truce and he was going to find a way to live with him in his head.  Then SK starts to strangle him and that potentially cool outcome went out the window.

Agree with everyone that Lenny/Oliver roadtripping has great potential.

I loved this season.  I hope the second can be just as entertaining.

[polishgenius]

8 hours ago, PetyrPunkinhead said:

 

One of the things that made David the most interesting character on TV for 7 episodes is gone now? Oh. Okay. Guess you painted yourself into that corner, Noah Hawley. Moving on to a more traditional focus on external conflicts for season two, I see.

Think you're being extremely uncharitable there: that's not what he says at all. You've seemingly made the least generous possible interpretating of that article, the possibilities, and Hawley's thoughts.


Anyway, there were some awkward and contrived bits in the finale (especially Oliver just happening to be in exactly the right place) but I think it satisifed enough. Also, he seems a much more aware and willing host so I wonder if, despite the violence of the seeming takeover, he hadn't already made some deal with SK.

[PetyrPunkinhead]

3 hours ago, polishgenius said:

Think you're being extremely uncharitable there: that's not what he says at all. You've seemingly made the least generous possible interpretating of that article, the possibilities, and Hawley's thoughts...

Eh, base don the evidence in S1E8, I don't think that's uncharitable or overly critical at all. In the first seven episodes I was taken on a wild and crazy ride--something bordering on genius. The eighth episode felt like a really good, slightly quirky episode of a CW DCEU show. :/

[The BlackBear]

On 30/03/2017 at 4:09 PM, Iskaral Pust said:

I was pretty satisfied with the final ep.  It was too forced that Syd would break discipline like that, and Kerry run into the room, and why was Ptolemy shooting his Tommy gun and risking everyone?

They did kind of build up his distrust of David a few episodes earlier, him thinking him dangerous etc, and he's the most keen to leap to violence when dealing with D3.

I thought it was a great finale, to an excellent show. Oliver remembering Melanie, then almost immedieatly hosting SK was great. I'm a total sucker for Pink Floyd, and that T-Rex song was the best choice.

I think that Legion works best when it used it's cast, and less so when it narrows in on Legion specifically. I think Syd has been shown to have enough emotional weakness to make her decision believable, her power has left her somewhat emotionally stunted and as a result she makes more adolescent decisions.

Slight niggle: where's Amy?

Left field suggestion for the device at the end: Forge?

[williamjm]

13 hours ago, The BlackBear said:

Slight niggle: where's Amy?

I can see why she would maybe be excluded from the attempts to negotiate with D3 or remove the SK from David's body because they probably wouldn't want a 'civillian' around for that. They could have had a scene with her reuniting with David at the end.

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

Yeah it felt like a slightly underwhelming ending to the season, felt a bit padded out.

However if this means that there is more Jemaine Clement (Oliver) next season then I am happy. Him being a supervillain would make the show close to perfect.

[red snow]

3 hours ago, Channel4s-JonSnow said:

Yeah it felt like a slightly underwhelming ending to the season, felt a bit padded out.

However if this means that there is more Jemaine Clement (Oliver) next season then I am happy. Him being a supervillain would make the show close to perfect.

Yeah, Clement channeling Shadow King should be a lot of fun although I noticed they left room to keep Plaza on board too. That said, the brief glimpse we got of Syd as Shadow King was a joy. I think the actress could have a lot of fun with that although there's maybe potential if King leaves traces. The impression I got was that King was part of Syd from the initial kiss in ep1. It neatly explains how she was seeing the angriest boy while in the real world.

I agree with the person who said they thought Oliver was maybe working with Shadow King. The fact that "lenny" was alongside him in the car suggests more of a partnership than Oliver simply being possessed by Shadow king.

I was wondering if Shadow is maybe looking for Xavier? I mean he has beef with the guy.

The post credits scene was a mighty WTF! Viewers will have missed out if they switched off as the credits rolled. No idea what that was - maybe they were trying to appease people who thought the shadow king was Mojo as that tech seemed alien. Unless they are going to have someone like Forge turn up.

I enjoyed the ending but agree that it felt like this was a front ended season and peaked at the point just prior to being stuck in the astral plane. But it was an excellent debut season. I thought I was tired of the unreliable narrator fad/craze - especially after season 2 of Mr Robot (and elements of Westworld) but this show rekindled it for me. I guess it's because I can buy into the narrative twists and turns of that technique when there's an explanation for it. So even though it invokes super powers to do so it makes more "sense" as I can buy into telepathic parasites and battles on the astral plane.

The show did a great job of humanizing the "villain" from division 3. That was a nice segment and thinking about things from his point I could see why he'd be invested in the job as a way of protecting his family. Hopefully we get more of the character in season 2. The music in the episode was great from well placed samples to the almost blade runner esque digital pieces. But it's one of Hawley's strengths as the same was seen throughout Fargo seasons 1 and 2.

Speaking of Fargo I can't wait for it to return. I know there was a big gap between seasons but it does mean we're getting two Hawley shows in the space of 6 months. I hope Hawley can continue to do both shows although i guess Fargo is one he does when he has the time/ideas and can potentially end whenever. I wonder when we'll get Hawley's "passion project"? He must have ideas for his own show from the ground up? Although I guess he might be a creator who's cool with taking existing properties and running wild with them. It's not like Legion really bares much resemblance to the comic or the X-men films (although there are elements that resemble First class but that's more the weird 60s vibe)

22 hours ago, PetyrPunkinhead said:

Eh, base don the evidence in S1E8, I don't think that's uncharitable or overly critical at all. In the first seven episodes I was taken on a wild and crazy ride--something bordering on genius. The eighth episode felt like a really good, slightly quirky episode of a CW DCEU show. :/

It's probably the reason why I didn't think it was as good when you make that observation. It did feel like a bridge to a second season. I wonder if there was originally a more contained ending? To be fair there weren't any scenes with characters keeping uneccessary secrets (closest they got to that was melanie not telling her husband who she was but that made sense in a "it might be better for him to remember of his own accord"

I'd put the show up there with Daredevil season 1 and JJ. It's certainly the most trippy and I'd still say it's the best horror show I've seen on tv in a while.

I think it might be wise in season 2 to do something slightly different from David's warped mind. I think there's plenty of mileage to get from his brain but in non shadow king ways. I'd definitely like to see "rational" David to turn up and I'd be surprised if we don't get astral plane meet-ups between him and Shadow King. But there's lots of external things to play with eg all of his external powers. I'd also like to see more of all the mutants who are supposed to be present at the camp. Although I get the feeling the next season may be more of a roadtrip with them tracking Shadow King down.

[williamjm]

2 hours ago, red snow said:

I agree with the person who said they thought Oliver was maybe working with Shadow King. The fact that "lenny" was alongside him in the car suggests more of a partnership than Oliver simply being possessed by Shadow king.

I suppose it is possible but it isn't as if they had much time to negotiate an arrangement and we know that Oliver is quite confused and probably not in the best mental state to resist. We have seen Lenny alongside David even at times when David isn't consciously working with the Shadow King.

The show did a great job of humanizing the "villain" from division 3. That was a nice segment and thinking about things from his point I could see why he'd be invested in the job as a way of protecting his family.

I liked that scene because it was such an unexpected way to start the final episode, and the show has always been keen to do the unexpected.

[red snow]

58 minutes ago, williamjm said:

I suppose it is possible but it isn't as if they had much time to negotiate an arrangement and we know that Oliver is quite confused and probably not in the best mental state to resist. We have seen Lenny alongside David even at times when David isn't consciously working with the Shadow King.

 

 

 

But they were having a conversation so it wasn't like Lenny and Oliver were unaware of each other. I think the two have known each other for some time though as Oliver was aware of the Shadow King on the astral plane when David first met him in his ice-cube. Something may have happened when the Shadow King woke Oliver up too. I guess the conversation in the car could still be one where Oliver didn't have much choice. I think he simply asked where they were going so there's a possibility he's being co-erced by the Shadow King.

What was Oliver's power? I thought he was psychic as well or was he just able to do psychic Jazz magic. Sometimes it's hard to tell if the show's being deliverately vague or accidentally vague. I still don't know Oliver or Melanie's powers.

[PetyrPunkinhead]

21 hours ago, red snow said:

Yeah, Clement channeling Shadow King should be a lot of fun although I noticed they left room to keep Plaza on board too. That said, the brief glimpse we got of Syd as Shadow King was a joy. I think the actress could have a lot of fun with that although there's maybe potential if King leaves traces. The impression I got was that King was part of Syd from the initial kiss in ep1. It neatly explains how she was seeing the angriest boy while in the real world....

...I think it might be wise in season 2 to do something slightly different from David's warped mind. I think there's plenty of mileage to get from his brain but in non shadow king ways. I'd definitely like to see "rational" David to turn up and I'd be surprised if we don't get astral plane meet-ups between him and Shadow King. But there's lots of external things to play with eg all of his external powers. I'd also like to see more of all the mutants who are supposed to be present at the camp. Although I get the feeling the next season may be more of a roadtrip with them tracking Shadow King down.

It seems that Shadow King as a mental parasite can take abilities from the hosts it inhabits, which is why I think Melanie got knocked out when Kerry did that gun-shot gesture and was able to hurl Division 3 Purple Suit Guy down the hallway in S1E8. Now, is any bit of SK left inside the hosts it has inhabited? That remains to be seen in S2. My guess is yes. Based on SK's interaction with Syd SK will be able to influence or at least communicate with David, Syd, and Kerry in S2. It's probably why David sensed Oliver/SK was headed south.

I really liked how for most of S1, David was the center around which all the others revolved. It makes sense since he's the most powerful mutant in this universe, possibly even more powerful than his pops, Charles Xavier--if indeed it is going to turn out to be Prof. X as his dad. (Noah Hawley said in THR interview he wants to skew even further away form the comics in S2. I'm not so cool with that if it means altering David's origin and powers.) So if it becomes the "Oliver & Lenny Show," I don't know how well that'd fly. 

I know Hawley mentioned in the interview the show would be moving production from Vancouver to Los Angeles, so it's a safe bet we'll be seeing less action at Summerland in S2. Not sure if that means a road-trip, especially since PREACHER S2 will be taking that premise as well. 

18 hours ago, red snow said:

...What was Oliver's power? I thought he was psychic as well or was he just able to do psychic Jazz magic. Sometimes it's hard to tell if the show's being deliverately vague or accidentally vague. I still don't know Oliver or Melanie's powers.

Melanie's power is still a mystery to me, too. My guess is some degree of mental ability. Oliver is a powerful telepath. One of the things I like about Legion is it deals with different degrees of mental abilities like they do in the comics. In the films we only really saw Prof. X and Jean Grey, who are two of the most powerful mutants ever. So Legion seems to be showing us different degrees of mental abilities with David as the apex.

[The BlackBear]

Does Melanie have to be a Mutant? She could simply be there because she was married to a mutant and cares about the cause.

[red snow]

15 minutes ago, The BlackBear said:

Does Melanie have to be a Mutant? She could simply be there because she was married to a mutant and cares about the cause.

I was wondering about that but I thought they'd make a point of that if that was the case.

1 hour ago, PetyrPunkinhead said:

 

I really liked how for most of S1, David was the center around which all the others revolved. It makes sense since he's the most powerful mutant in this universe, possibly even more powerful than his pops, Charles Xavier--if indeed it is going to turn out to be Prof. X as his dad. (Noah Hawley said in THR interview he wants to skew even further away form the comics in S2. I'm not so cool with that if it means altering David's origin and powers.) So if it becomes the "Oliver & Lenny Show," I don't know how well that'd fly. 

 

I thought the cartoon on the chalk board made it hard for it not to be Xavier. Although I'm not sure how David would know what his dad might look like except for some memories stolen from SK.

It seemed like the only reluctance is due to whether or not they can have Stewart or McAvoy guest star.

[Iskaral Pust]

Melanie is a telepath, and possibly more.  She spoke telepathically to David in the early eps after he was first brought to Summerland. 

[The BlackBear]

9 minutes ago, Iskaral Pust said:

Melanie is a telepath, and possibly more.  She spoke telepathically to David in the early eps after he was first brought to Summerland. 

But that was Davids telepathy, she was just thinking his name. All the other voices he was hearing were other people's thoughts as well.

[Iskaral Pust]

42 minutes ago, The BlackBear said:

But that was Davids telepathy, she was just thinking his name. All the other voices he was hearing were other people's thoughts as well.

I knew the other voices was him hearing thoughts but I thought she had more specific projection. 

[The BlackBear]

I just figured it was something she knew from Oliver, presuming he had similar powers. I also get the feeling if she had telepathy she'd be with his mind in the astral plane. She'd have gone looking for him sooner or later, and become lost in turn.

I'm thinking she's either human, or something really nasty that she doesn't like using.

[PetyrPunkinhead]

Patrick Stewart has already said he'd "100%" be willing to portray Prof. X on Legion. Whether that actually happens or not remains to be seen.

 

[red snow]

I get cost is a factor. That and whether the films want to fully embrace the show. At the moment they have the nice situation of deniability. Given how they are with the X-films I'd be surprised whether they care if having Stewart or McAvoy turn up could cause any continuity issues.