James Steller Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 Imagine you're the head of a noble house in the Westerlands (assume it’s been around for as long as the others). You are only seventeen years old, only just knighted a month ago, yet you are already in charge. Your mother died when you were fourteen, and your father has just fallen in a tourney being held at Kayce. You have an older sister who is married to Lord Crakehall, but you and he have always despised each other. There is also your castellan, Ser Jason Hollis, fourth in a generation of landed knights that has served your family faithfully. Things are not good for your house. Your aging father tried his hand for the tourney’s prize money in a bid to rescue the family fortunes. You yourself lasted much longer than your father did, though you ultimately lost to Lord Kyle Reyne in the final tilt. In the process, your suit of armour was too damaged to be salvaged, your war horse was mortally wounded, and you barely escaped serious injury. You’ve returned to your new hall to bury your father, but the smallfolk have come to you with the same concerns which drove your father to his tragic death. One of your gold mines suffered a devastating cave-in. It will cost a great deal of money and will take months of excavation to clear out again. Meanwhile, your only silver mine ran dry two months ago, and searching for another source on your territory will also cost money. Moreover, a number of fishing boats owned by your smallfolk have vanished, most likely raided and attacked by Ironborn reavers. Rebuilding and refitting ships to replace those lost will cost you money. All three of these incidents hinge on your financial aid, but you only have enough to either pay for just one of those crises, or pay for a new suit of armour and war horse so that you can attend another tourney, to be held later this year at Lannisport (the prize money for that tourney would help pay for two of the above crises, if you survive and win). Emerging out of left field, the elderly Lord Pearce of House Hawthorne has come forward with a scheme to pool together resources to open a secure and guarded trade route to both Oldtown and Lannisport, which would allow you to pay for two of the above crises. You would only need to provide the ships which you still have, but you will need to recruit Lord Crakehall to help. You are very reluctant to approach Lord Crakehall with this, as you know that Crakehall would want full control and a majority share of this business venture between the three of you, and that Lord Hawthorne would sooner side with Crakehall in any argument between the two of you. But meanwhile, your own status as a bachelor has been well noted by the nobles of the Westerlands. Lord Reyne has sent an envoy lamenting your father’s passing, and commending you as a noble jouster and promising new lord. He offers you his 16-year old daughter, Celia, in marriage. He also offers to pay a handsome dowry, in the form of a new suit of armour and horse. The offer is given handsomely, though you aren’t quite sure if there isn’t some sort of veiled mockery behind it. Another envoy from Lord Prester has offered his younger sister’s hand in marriage. Prester offers an impressive dowry which would pay for one of the aforementioned crises you now face, though his sister is a homely woman five years older than you. In the meantime, as you ponder these dilemmas, you notice once again how beautiful Jason Hollis’ daughter is, which reminds you of how friendly you two have always been, and how she gave you your first kiss. However, you know that she refuses to bed a man who will not marry her. Your father always insisted you move on from your childish crush on what is basically a servant’s daughter, which you always felt was unfair to a knightly house that had always been loyal to your family. Marrying her would not gain you any advantages or help you run your new lands, but you cannot deny that she is the woman you love. What do you do, and how do your run this household? Note to the administrators: I assure you this is not a game, this is strictly a hypothetical scenario that is entirely subjective and up to each person who answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Wraith Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 I hate Crakehall and Crakehall hates me? Well not working with him then. Shame the plan seemed decent enough otherwise. I can always wait for Lord Crakehall to die and try and get my sister in on the plan. I am a Lord and the head of this House I have to marry for duty not love. So not Jason's daughter also it would be illfitting to not fulfill my dead father wishes. Reyne's are the number two house in the Westerlands so I would take Lord Reyne up on his offer to marry his daughter. Don't care if there is any mockery implied or otherwise. Marrying into House Reyne is a boon for my house and the new armor, horse etc no doubt will be of excellent quality which will allow me to fight in the upcoming tourney. So I would marry Celia Reyne and get the new armor and horse to fight at the Tourney at Lannisport. In the meantime I use the money I have to fix the broken mine for gold. We know the gold is there. Finding the next silver mine takes time and we might not find it quickly. Having more ships seems the worse options due to the Ironborn raiders. If I win the Tourney I would find the next silver mine there and hopefully secure my House's immediate future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renly's Banana Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 First of all I'd stop trying to joust cause it's obvious that, like my idiot father, I suck ass at it. Lord Reyne can go to hell with his new armor. I'd join Lord Pearce's scheme and try my best to bring in Crakehall. Yeah the guy's a douche but it sounds like this plan is gonna go on with or without me no matter what I do, so I better get in on the chance to join while I can. Crakehall can have his majority for now. Lord Pearce is old, so I could probably scoop his percentage when he dies. And if it goes to his heir then maybe some accident will happen to him, I dunno yet. With this money I'd try reopening the gold mine and invest in looking for new ones if I can. I'll marry Lord Prester's ugly sister and take his money. She'll look fine in bed when I'm drunk enough, and with this money I'd build new ships. Poor woman won't ever have my love, but.. eh. She could have a worse life. I'll be too busy trying to seduce lord Crakehall. I've heard some rumors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Yozza Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 I'd start off using the funds I already have to reopen the gold mine. Gold is more valuable than silver or ships and we know the gold is there. I'd marry Lord Reyne's daughter. That suit of armor and horse might well end up being some of the best quality in the Westerlands and it would be in his best interest to ensure my house doesn't fall into ruin. I'd use the armour to fight in the tourney at Lannisport and if I win I'd start the search for the silver mine and getting more ships. In the meantime, I'd agree to join Lord Pearce's little venture. I may not like Crakehall, and he may not like me but I trust he'd be smart enough to look past that in the face of a profitable venture. He can have his majority share, if he can convince Pearce to go for that. I don't mind. The profits I'd get would still be enough to pay for two of the crises my house is in. So I'd bring Crakehall in meaning that even if I lose at Lannisport I'd have the money to find the new silver mine and rebuild the ships, and if I win the tourney then I have extra profits to help strengthen my house in whatever other way I can. Oh and I'd also try and find the best match possible for Jason's daughter. If we were close friends then I'd feel obligated to make sure that my loyal castellan's daughter has a good spouse that will give her great prospects for her future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canon Claude Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 Okay, first of all... 9 hours ago, James Steller said: the elderly Lord Pearce of House Hawthorne That is hysterical! So nice to know someone else on this forum loves Community! Anyway, so I assume this is long before the time of Tytos Lannister, so at this point there's no shame in connecting with the wealthy Reynes. If there's supposed to be some kind of insult in Kyle Reyne's offer of his daughter, new armour, and a new warhorse, then I don't see it. Seems more like one lord seeing promise in another and wanting to forge a bond with him. I'll take that offer. Since I made it all the way to the final round of the tourney, I should have a fairly good chance of winning the next one if I play my cards right. That said though, I won't hedge all my bets on that tourney. For now, the plight of my smallfolk need to be corrected as soon as possible. I'll use my last savings to kickstart reopening the gold mine. Then, because I'm too smart to let a petty feud get in the way of a great idea, I'll swallow my pride and take Lord Hawthorne's trade idea to Lord Crakehall. But I'll only do it after my wedding to Lord Reyne's daughter. Crakehall might take over management and feel like he can boss me around, but with the Reynes in my corner, it'll give me a bit of an edge. And anyway, if all goes well, the trade deal will provide lots of work for my smallfolk and the money I make will go towards upgrading my fleet and finding a new silver mine. I listen to my father's past advice and try to forget Jason Hill's daughter. To make it easier, I offer to pay for her dowry with a small knightly estate. Hopefully a decent man that she likes comes to call, and she'll be looked after properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Steller Posted March 11, 2017 Author Share Posted March 11, 2017 20 minutes ago, Canon Claude said: That is hysterical! So nice to know someone else on this forum loves Community! I'm glad someone else enjoyed that reference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mountain That Flies Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 1. Use the funds I currently have available to fix the gold mine. We know the gold is there (unlike the potential silver mine), and without a strong enough navy to fight off the raiders building more boats is dumb. 2. I suck up my pride and speak to Crakehall about Hawthorne's scheme. The guy is family at this point, and it sounds like a solid plan. If I have to stay on my toes dealing with them so be it, this would be a good oppprtunoty to develop business skills my father clearly lacked. 3. Speaking of my father, a man who gambles his house fortunes on athletic competitions is not someone whose "do what's best for the house argument" carries a lot of weight. The fort two steps in my plan are going to be long and stressful, and having someone I actually love to come home to will me make better at dealing with them. I marry Jason's Hollis' daughter, and try to foster any children of mine with the Reynes and Presters so as to still develop those alliances. Also, at a pragmatic level all he preceding events have probably made my smallfolk a bit testy, so marrying someone of a lower station (and showing them I'm not a snob like most Westerland lords) could improve their mood a bit. 4. Keep practicing my jousting wen though I won't be able to compete for a long time. It's obvious I have potential and should participate again when it's feasible, but I just nearly died at the same time as my dad pursuing this dream and that would have destroyed my house. So it can wait until I have some kids and spare money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floki of the Ironborn Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 This is a really tricky one. Each one of those three crises spell life or death to my smallfolk. But in any case, I doubt there's going to be a miraculous new supply of silver on my land, but there is still plenty of gold, and there are months' worth of work to be done just digging out the tunnels again. So I'll put my money on restoring the gold mine. Also, a lord needs armour, but if I'm the last surviving member of my house, I have no intention of throwing my life away on a tourney like my father. And I certainly won't accept armour from a future opponent, much less the guy who nearly killed me. In the meantime, if Lord Hawthorne's plan is successful, it would restore my fishing communities and then some. I have to deal with Lord Crakehall anyway so I'll deal with him for the sake of my folk. I'll even spend some of the money I make on the new trade deal to re-educate the silver miners on gold mining or work on the docks, and relocating their families to these places of business. With all that hard work for my people said and done, I think I'll do something for myself and also for my faithful castellan. I'll give Jason Hill's family a knightly estate on my land to manage (assuming he has at least one son). And I give him the chance to make a surname and sigil for himself. This will elevate his family enough that marrying his daughter won't be as risible to the rest of the westermen. And it's also the gratitude of my family to those who are loyal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floki of the Ironborn Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 Also, 2 hours ago, The Mountain That Flies said: I marry Jason's Hollis' daughter, and try to foster any children of mine with the Reynes and Presters so as to still develop those alliances. How do you expect to foster your children to those Lords after rejecting their offers to marriage for the daughter of a knight with a bastard's name? At least I'm giving Jason's family a proper family surname and sigil, but even then I wouldn't expect to hear from the Reynes or Presters again. I'd go for someone like the Leffords or Baneforts, or the Hawthornes for that matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mountain That Flies Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 1 hour ago, Floki of the Ironborn said: Also, How do you expect to foster your children to those Lords after rejecting their offers to marriage for the daughter of a knight with a bastard's name? At least I'm giving Jason's family a proper family surname and sigil, but even then I wouldn't expect to hear from the Reynes or Presters again. I'd go for someone like the Leffords or Baneforts, or the Hawthornes for that matter. You're probably right, but if my plan is successful then the value of my house will ultimately be higher, which raises the value of my kids a bit. Though your group of houses would likely be a more successful route to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sambo Shaw Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 If my house's challenges are: 1. Gold mine cave in 2. Dry silver mine 3. Lost fishing boats (most likely due to Ironborn) 4. Armor and Warhorse it seems the best choices I could make would immediately take care of 3 of these problems. First, I snap-accept Lord Reyne's marriage offer. The Reynes, at that time, were a strong house. So, this should be an attractive pairing for my house.I take care of one of my problems and have the opportunity to enter the Lannisport tournament later in the year. If I can win there it will be a huge bonus for my house, but if I take the next step it won't be necessary. Next, I accept Lord Pearce's offer on the trade route. I'm guessing Lord Crakehall, in spite of his mutual disdain for me, will not be a problem to recruit to a profitable business venture. I can use my profits to re-open my gold mine and replace lost fishing boats (which I'm guessing will now have more protection from Ironborn, with our protected trade routes in the area. The trade route should offer incomes to enough small-folk to offset at least a big part of the silver mine loss. Once we are solidly recovered from the crisis, I can look to the future. Since we are in the Westerlands, I'd spend money to search for new mines in my lands. Assuming we find new mines, we now have our gold mine, a new silver mine (possibly a new gold mine), our fishing boats, and the trade route to bring incomes. By this point, I'd probably want to use politics or subterfuge to strengthen my standing among Pearce and Crakehall on the trade route power structure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Protagoras Posted March 12, 2017 Share Posted March 12, 2017 Ok, I am impoverished and need money to fix disasters, yet the trend is clear. My house is going down and we need a new source of income. I need to 1. Fix the gold mine, 2. Find another silver mine, 3. Rebuild fishing boats, 4. New suit & horse to continue my reputation as a badass tourney knight. First, one of these goals are an illusion. The fishing boats are not only my smallfolks boats and not mine (and hence nothing that should invested by me) but more importantly, it is a literal sinkhole. The Ironborn will always be back and always plundering and even if my liege can´t defend against it, then how should I? So, what we need to do here is to rethink our strategy. The old way doesn´t work anymore and we need to improve. Lets start with marriages, since I can´t have the girl I want anyway (protip to everyone - a girl who want a marriage to even consider consensual sex should be avoided like the plague. If I can´t find out sexual compatibility, then there is little reason to except said marriage to work well) I can just get someone of the other two candidates. Of those options, I think I prefer the Reyne girl - both offers are good, but it comes with the added favor of the Reyne name. And of course Reyne was slightly mocking - he was the one defeating me last time. As for my priorities, I restore my gold mine since I know there exist gold in it. Prospecting for new mines is indeed important, but could yield nothing. And replacing boats in order to get them raided again in 2-3 years is pure stupidity. My long-term game plan is rather to put less money in boats and more in mines, doing far more than one inspection of my territory. Not only do I except to find gold and silver, but tin, coal, iron, amber and other minerals I can trade. The future is in the mountains, not in the water. And I am willing (if the smallfolk are willing that is) to create and hand out fishing charters on my water in order to give the smallfolk the ability to earn some money for themselves (as well as earning me a percentage for doing nothing). It is in this mode I give Lord Hawthorne an invitation to my hall. Because, he is quite frankly a piece of work. He has a good idea, but need Lord Crakehall and not only do he seem to expect that I should contact him, but is also going to submit to any and all demands said man demand, a man I don´t like, and put any deal we do into question since Lord Crakehall can just change it (with his support!). So I make it perfectly clear to him that since he seem to have a contact with Lord Crakehall himself (since he is going to take his side) then he can recruit the man himself. I am willing to submit my boats for a high minority share, but that share is going to be specified so either we make the deal now (and he need to give Lord Crakehall from the percentage he has left) or he can deal with Lord Crakehall first and give me an offer later when he knows how much that are left (and of course I inform him that if it is too little share per risk & boats, I will decline his offer). I also make it clear what my opinions on Lord Crakehall are. I despise him and want as little to do with him as possible, money be damned. I have honor! So, now I have suit, warhorse and a repaired gold mine. I enter the tournament (since I am pretty good - and Lannisport might pay for more than first place). I use eventual winning, gold mine income and an eventual deal with Hawthorne to prospect my land after silver mines and all other useful minerals and spend less focus on the sea (apart from that charter idea, of course). Maybe, when my new wife die/lose interest and Jason Hollis’ daughter do some necessary maturation about sex, marriage and our different stations, I can get some fun on the private side as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1000th Lord Commander Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 On 3/11/2017 at 3:38 PM, James Steller said: Imagine you're the head of a noble house in the Westerlands (assume it’s been around for as long as the others). You are only seventeen years old, only just knighted a month ago, yet you are already in charge. Your mother died when you were fourteen, and your father has just fallen in a tourney being held at Kayce. You have an older sister who is married to Lord Crakehall, but you and he have always despised each other. There is also your castellan, Ser Jason Hollis, fourth in a generation of landed knights that has served your family faithfully. Things are not good for your house. Your aging father tried his hand for the tourney’s prize money in a bid to rescue the family fortunes. You yourself lasted much longer than your father did, though you ultimately lost to Lord Kyle Reyne in the final tilt. In the process, your suit of armour was too damaged to be salvaged, your war horse was mortally wounded, and you barely escaped serious injury. You’ve returned to your new hall to bury your father, but the smallfolk have come to you with the same concerns which drove your father to his tragic death. One of your gold mines suffered a devastating cave-in. It will cost a great deal of money and will take months of excavation to clear out again. Meanwhile, your only silver mine ran dry two months ago, and searching for another source on your territory will also cost money. Moreover, a number of fishing boats owned by your smallfolk have vanished, most likely raided and attacked by Ironborn reavers. Rebuilding and refitting ships to replace those lost will cost you money. All three of these incidents hinge on your financial aid, but you only have enough to either pay for just one of those crises, or pay for a new suit of armour and war horse so that you can attend another tourney, to be held later this year at Lannisport (the prize money for that tourney would help pay for two of the above crises, if you survive and win). Emerging out of left field, the elderly Lord Pearce of House Hawthorne has come forward with a scheme to pool together resources to open a secure and guarded trade route to both Oldtown and Lannisport, which would allow you to pay for two of the above crises. You would only need to provide the ships which you still have, but you will need to recruit Lord Crakehall to help. You are very reluctant to approach Lord Crakehall with this, as you know that Crakehall would want full control and a majority share of this business venture between the three of you, and that Lord Hawthorne would sooner side with Crakehall in any argument between the two of you. But meanwhile, your own status as a bachelor has been well noted by the nobles of the Westerlands. Lord Reyne has sent an envoy lamenting your father’s passing, and commending you as a noble jouster and promising new lord. He offers you his 16-year old daughter, Celia, in marriage. He also offers to pay a handsome dowry, in the form of a new suit of armour and horse. The offer is given handsomely, though you aren’t quite sure if there isn’t some sort of veiled mockery behind it. Another envoy from Lord Prester has offered his younger sister’s hand in marriage. Prester offers an impressive dowry which would pay for one of the aforementioned crises you now face, though his sister is a homely woman five years older than you. In the meantime, as you ponder these dilemmas, you notice once again how beautiful Jason Hollis’ daughter is, which reminds you of how friendly you two have always been, and how she gave you your first kiss. However, you know that she refuses to bed a man who will not marry her. Your father always insisted you move on from your childish crush on what is basically a servant’s daughter, which you always felt was unfair to a knightly house that had always been loyal to your family. Marrying her would not gain you any advantages or help you run your new lands, but you cannot deny that she is the woman you love. What do you do, and how do your run this household? Note to the administrators: I assure you this is not a game, this is strictly a hypothetical scenario that is entirely subjective and up to each person who answers. Since I came second in the tourney, I'm obviously not that bad. I take Reyne up on his offer of his daughter, as it will only increase my prestige, and give me a new horse and armour. I only need to defeat one knight in the upcoming tourney to stay level, as they will give me thier horse and armour, which I can give as a randsom in place of my own. Any more after that is a bonus. I take Lord Pearce up on his offer to open a trade route, as it will help diversify my wealth and help me weather future crisis. Even though Lord Crakehall will have to be involved, I can grin and bear it for the money involved. I spend the money on the gold mine, as I know there's gold in those hills. If by some chance I win the tourney, I can get a new silver mine and repair the fishing boats then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Frasier of House Crane Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 I don’t think it’s prudent to risk everything just to buy a new suit of armor and a warhorse for a tourney. So the first thing I would do is clear out the gold mine. I would ask the smallfolk who have lost ships or who rely on fishing to come and work clearing out the cave-in, and they will be recompensed once the mine is reopened. I would go to Lord Crakehall and offer my terms, and if he accepts, I would do my best to put aside my differences with him and try and make something happen with the trade route. As for my marital status, I would politely decline the Reyne and the Prester and marry Ser Jason’s daughter. It might seem ludicrous to them, marrying for love and not political gain, but a happy lord makes a happy land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent 326 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 I would take Lord Reyne's daughter as my wife. Use my gold for fixing the gold mine, and take the offer to create a trading route from Oldtown to Lannisport to pay for the other two big problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mediterraneo Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 Hello everybody, I'm with the gold miners. there is money there, we need to put that back in function asap. The silver mine is a bet, and it is best to bet with someone else's resources. Promise a surname and a share to anyone finding new streaks of silver - the Hollis girl will be married to this -now very rich - guy as a premium for her family's faithfulness. Same line with the boats: give anybody licence to build boats for a share of the revenues, if they promise some months a year of use of those boats for my navy. Tipify types of boats (bigger? faster?) as privilege - to pay for. Hopefully the best fisermen will try to improve their situation and pay for the right to build more impressive ships for me. On the trading routes plan: take it, and we will go soving problems as we go. We will have to meet very soon with Crackehall as he and his wife will be present at my father's burial. That's the occasion to show him how much being in charge has already changed me (at least during PR) in a context in which he will hopefully be attentive to his wife's wail. Get a way to talk with my sister regularily, and be frank with her: your family still needs your help, father left a mess, tell me if I can help Crakehall in any way as we could need his friendship a lot. Talk to her about the route thing. If the Hollis girl can't be married to the silver finder, send her as maid to my sister - she will be a good way to talk reliabily to my sister and a backup source of information there. The sister side must be the leverage with Crakehall, we NEED the deal, and I as a new lord cannot have a so and so deal with someone "they think" is in bad blood with me or the House will lose face. On the marriage: meet the Reyne, proclaiming your love for the girl in a slightly too public situation to keep this all quiet. Then let also slip -obviously not on purpose but in public- that the Preston offered a much higher dowry for an older, less beautiful woman. I would NEVER allow a Reyne girl to be so shamed as to be married with a lower dowry than a Preston almost-too-old maid. Or to be refused due to the Reyne's inability to offer a dowry worthy their name to their daughters. It can go wrong, but there would be leverage to force the Reyne to maintain their prestige by at least equalling the dowry. If the Reyne don't up the odds, be quite vocal on the matter and prefer to marry a woman "that her family doesn't despise" with the Preston woman - it will be prstige for them to be preferred on the Reyne, even if the girl is "clearly worse". Instead of meeting the Reyne the same things could be done at the very same Father's burial, letting the news about it go through the Crakehall into word of wind by quietly telling my sister about it at some mass eating, where everybody hears. That is: we would take shots at everything, hoping more than some will go, at least partially good. If either the silver or the ships pay dividends, we will have more resources than we thought. In the best possible case (Reyne upping the Dowry to Preston levels fearing to lose face, my sister helping brokering a good deal with her husband, the fishermen finding resources to build a fleet for themselves and me, someone finding the silver streak quickly, the golden mine not getting any further problems) I would find myself with resources to double the needed to keep my basis working, and I could start thinking about improving somehow the trading and-or security facilities of my lands. Putting a good tower to difend a couple of natural ports could helpt the fishermen's ships and also make a good place to unload a merchant's ship. Builidng an inn somewhere could help keep the road clean and generate revenues locally, If (hopefully when, but...) things are really ok I could think to start some kind of productive activity (what does lord Hawthorn plan to sell? CAN I be complementary with him in this or will it be competence?) or to build some prestige-generating building (a sept?) as a focus for economical activities. But I have the competitive advantage of knowing that building gothic cathedrals almost more than paid for itself in an economical and population expansive phase of the cycle - and other nobles talking of opening trade routes sounds like expansion to me. Cheers everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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