nadabutso

Sansa knew about Jeynes faith

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As the title reads i believe Sansa knew that Jeyne was forced into prostitution, maybe not from the get go but i think she had it figured out pretty quickly. This is from when Queen Cersei asks the Lords what to do with Jeyne

Queen Cersei looked at each of the other councillors in turn. "I won't have Sansa fretting needlessly. What  Shall we do with this little friend of hers, my lords?"

   Lord Petyr leaned forward. "I'll find a place for her."

  "Not in the city", said the queen

  "Do you take me for a fool?"

The Queen ignored that. "Ser Boros, escort this girl to Lord Petyr's apartments and instruct his people to keep her there until he comes for her. Tell her that Littlefinger will be taking her to se her father, that ought to calm her down. I want her gone before Sansa returns to her chamber"

"As you command, Your Grace" Ser Boros said. He bowered deeply spun on his heel and took his leave, his long white cloak stirring the air behind him.

Sansa was confused, "I don't understand" she said. "Where is Jeyne's father? Why can't Ser Boros take her to him instead of Lord Petyr having to do it? - A game of thrones p. 527

The chapter goes on with Sansa asking where Vayon poole is and reassures Cersei that Jeyne hasn't done anything wrong/bad and Cersei reassures Sansa there is nothing to worry about.Sansa was quite young at this stage so it might be that she is ignorant to what happens to young girls in the game of thrones universe but I believe she atleast suspected something bad is going to happen, Littlefinger is a whoremonger after all that's no secret.

Even as times goes by Sansa never once asked Baelish about Jeyne even though she was given hundreds of oportunities when she have had private conversations with Littlefinger outside of Kings Landing. If someone separated me from my "truest friend" I would for sure try and figure out where she is in the world or what she might be doing, atleast ask you know...

 

Thank you for reading and please drop a reply :)

 

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Posted (edited)

Sansa doesn't know Baelish owns brothels - who on earth would tell her such a thing?

I bet she thinks - everyone in my family is dead, and Jeyne must be dead too.

(And I should have said: welcome to the forum! and stick with your ideas ;).)

Edited by Springwatch

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You're giving a prime example of why so many people loathed Sansa's character for the first few books. She does get some kind pass for how hard of a situation she's in (and frankly we don't see every single thought she has) but she's a thoroughly unlikable for most of the first books. Her redemption arc and character growth are pretty awesome.

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2 hours ago, Springwatch said:

Sansa doesn't know Baelish owns brothels - who on earth would tell her such a thing?

I bet she thinks - everyone in my family is dead, and Jeyne must be dead too.

(And I should have said: welcome to the forum! and stick with your ideas ;).)

The OP is probably confused because of the TV series where owning brothels is LF's main source of fame by far and main economic activity.

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Sansa is pretty powerless and naive for the first few books and even now.

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We're never given any direct information on Jayne's faith, but I assume Sansa would have known about it. The girls would've visited the sept together and septa Mordane probably instructed Jeyne alongside Sansa.

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Do you mean fate? because I do not see what Jeyne's faith has to do with her situation. 

I guess if you mean fate then I think this reveal will come to Sansa in the next book and she will add that to her collection of hate against Baelish. I don't know really, but it is a good question. 

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Did she gets forced into prostitution? I thought she was just hidden a way for awhile and trained to become (f)Arya 

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2 minutes ago, Magnar of the Dreadfort said:

Did she gets forced into prostitution? I thought she was just hidden a way for awhile and trained to become (f)Arya 

Yes, iirc Petyr did put her in one of his brothels and Jeyne mentions something about being trained when she was (f)Arya and that was sex training. I do remember that lots of people like Jaime, and Cersei, and Tywin, Lady Barbrey also know she is fake Arya. 

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2 minutes ago, Sea Dragon said:

Yes, iirc Petyr did put her in one of his brothels and Jeyne mentions something about being trained when she was (f)Arya and that was sex training. I do remember that lots of people like Jaime, and Cersei, and Tywin, Lady Barbrey also know she is fake Arya. 

Are you sure the training wasn't so she would seem more believable to Roose and Ramsay? 

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2 minutes ago, Magnar of the Dreadfort said:

Are you sure the training wasn't so she would seem more believable to Roose and Ramsay? 

They knew she was a fake too. They did not care because they just want her name. It was during a sex scene that Ramsay asks her about a sex act and she says she was trained. 

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1 minute ago, Sea Dragon said:

They knew she was a fake too. They did not care because they just want her name. It was during a sex scene that Ramsay asks her about a sex act and she says she was trained. 

Ofcourse , sorry Sea Dragon completely flew out my mind , think it might be time for a re-read lol

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1 minute ago, Magnar of the Dreadfort said:

Ofcourse , sorry Sea Dragon completely flew out my mind , think it might be time for a re-read lol

That is no problem. How funny that I just said the same thing to another poster here. I need a reread too for some information! I guess we all just remember our own little details? 

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Posted (edited)

Anyway i don't think Sansa knew of her Jeynes fate , shes alone , confused and naive. Shes probably genuinely wondering why Boros himself can't take Jeyne to her father.

Edited by Magnar of the Dreadfort

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I think Sansa assumed Jeyne actually WAS being taken to her father, and wrote her off thereafter. She never (or rarely?) thinks of Jeyne again. Note that it was days before she thought again of her own sister, Arya. Sansa concentrates on Sansa. You may argue that Sansa had so much to worry about, as Sansa, that everyone else in the world pretty much slipped her mind. Maybe that's a virtue.

But I remember at the Hand's Tourney when the young knight died right in front of her, gasping out his last bloody breaths, while Sansa watched, observed that she felt nothing, absolutely nothing, for him and his young death, and congratulated herself as a future Great Lady. While Jeyne cried hysterically and was taken away. Sansa's reaction to that was essentially "good riddance."

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So far I see nothing to really redeem Sansa as a "good" character. She has taken no risks for another person and has turned a blind eye to many very wrong actions - Lyssa's murder, Marillon, Dontos's murder, possibly Sweet Robin, Joffrey's lies.

She rarely thinks about her family, although we begin to see some awakening in the Snow Castle scene. She does not ask about Jeyne Poole or even if Arya has been found.

I hope Sansa is on a redemption arc, but so far I have seen nothing to show that she is one of the good guys.

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Just because we don't see Sansa ask Petyr about Jeyne, doesn't mean she hasn't. 

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I remember when I first read GOT, I assumed she would be found a place as a servant, child's companion, or something along those lines.  I was a bit shocked and dismayed to find out she had been in a brothel and apparently whipped repeatedly there as well.  I see no reason Sansa would expect anything bad happening to her friend.  I expect she won't be happy if and when she finds out. 

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3 hours ago, Makk said:

Just because we don't see Sansa ask Petyr about Jeyne, doesn't mean she hasn't. 

Are you being sarcastic?:huh:  

A. Sansa does not know that Jeyne is alive.

B. Sansa does not know that Petyr owns brothels.

C. It would be counterproductive for Petyr to tell Sansa that her best friend is a sex slave that was forcibly married to a sadist and he had a major role in it.

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Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, zandru said:

I think Sansa assumed Jeyne actually WAS being taken to her father, and wrote her off thereafter. She never (or rarely?) thinks of Jeyne again. Note that it was days before she thought again of her own sister, Arya. Sansa concentrates on Sansa. You may argue that Sansa had so much to worry about, as Sansa, that everyone else in the world pretty much slipped her mind. Maybe that's a virtue.

Her lack of second thought of what happend to her best friend (and Arya) always bothered me. But like you say, Sansa might have assumed Jeyne was being taken to her father. But I wonder if her lack of thought about Jeyne is intentional on Grrm's part, or that he simply didn't think it was necessary to write it on paper. But on the other hand, he did make a point about Sansa forgetting to care what happened to her sister. It is supposed to be part of her characterisation. So from that conclusion I agree with you that Sansa pretty much concentrates on Sansa in the earlier books.

4 hours ago, Makk said:

Just because we don't see Sansa ask Petyr about Jeyne, doesn't mean she hasn't. 

That's debatable, because if that's the case then you could also assume anything could have happened to any POV "off page". If Grrm wanted to have Sansa show concern for Jeyne I think he would have put it on page. Since Grrm choose to point out that Sansa forgot to ask what happend to her sister, I think having Sansa not sharing a second though about Jeyne is supposed to be part of that characterisation as well. 

Edited by GhostNymeria

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