Hypothesis about the origins of the Stark : looking for the true story !

[GloubieBoulga]

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The small square keep was half a ruin, and so too the great grey knight who lived there. He was so old he did not understand their questions. No matter what was said to him, he would only smile and mutter, "I held the bridge against Ser Maynard. Red hair and a black temper, he had, but he could not move me. Six wounds I took before I killed him. Six!"

The maester who cared for him was a young man, thankfully. After the old knight had drifted to sleep in his chair, he took them aside and said, "I fear you seek a ghost. We had a bird, ages ago, half a year at least. The Lannisters caught Lord Beric near the Gods Eye. He was hanged."

(...)

The next morning, as they crossed the little stone bridge behind the keep, Gendry wondered if this was the bridge the old man had fought over. No one knew. "Most like it is," said Jack-Be-Lucky. "Don't see no other bridges."

"You'd know for certain if there was a song," said Tom Sevenstrings. "One good song, and we'd know who Ser Maynard used to be and why he wanted to cross this bridge so bad. Poor old Lychester might be as far famed as the Dragonknight if he'd only had sense enough to keep a singer." (Arya IV, ASOS)

 

 

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"I've always known that Robb would be Lord of Winterfell."

Mormont gave a whistle, and the bird flew to him again and settled on his arm. "A lord's one thing, a king's another." He offered the raven a handful of corn from his pocket. "They will garb your brother Robb in silks, satins, and velvets of a hundred different colors, while you live and die in black ringmail. He will wed some beautiful princess and father sons on her. You'll have no wife, nor will you ever hold a child of your own blood in your arms. Robb will rule, you will serve. Men will call you a crow. Him they'll call Your Grace. Singers will praise every little thing he does, while your greatest deeds all go unsung. Tell me that none of this troubles you, Jon . . . and I'll name you a liar, and know I have the truth of it."

Jon drew himself up, taut as a bowstring. "And if it did trouble me, what might I do, bastard as I am?"(Jon I, ACOK)

 

 

 

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His words made Tyrion feel absurdly grateful, and helped to mollify him as Galyeon sang endless verses about the valor of the boy king and his mother, the golden queen.

"She never did that," Sansa blurted out suddenly.

"Never believe anything you hear in a song, my lady." Tyrion summoned a serving man to refill their wine cups.(Tyrion VIII, ASOS)

 

 

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"Oldstones, all the smallfolk called it when I was a girl, but no doubt it had some other name when it was still a hall of kings." She had camped here once with her father, on their way to Seagard. Petyr was with us too . . .

"There's a song," he remembered. "'Jenny of Oldstones, with the flowers in her hair.'"

"We're all just songs in the end. If we are lucky."(Catelyn V, ASOS)

 

 

 

Hi everyone ! The quotes I choosed to open this thread are all talking about the songs and the memories, about lies and truth. Forgotten memories, created memories, or falsified memories, and some other little things, I suppose... 

Before I begin the following synthesis, all my thanks to the participants of this forum, who helped my hypothesis growing up and maturing. Sometimes, it was a great analysis that gave me a new perspective, sometimes it was more modestly two quotes of the text linked one with the other throw a similar theme, sometime it was a contradiction of my own thoughts, sometime a little question, always usefull. So if I had already some strong ideas (discussed with french fans) from my first read, some theories here permitted to go far further, infirming some ideas I had, nuancing others, and giving news. Actually, I think I have many pieces of the puzzle, and many have found their place, but there are also some dusken places. 

Why the origins of the Stark could be significant ? Because the saga tells us their doom (Ned killed in first book, Winterfell burnt in second, the heir killed in the third and the other children lost everywhere, all loosing their name Stark, except Brandon): this is in litterature the end of a "cycle", so as we have here a story ending (even if at the end some of the children might survive as Stark and even if Winterfell might be rebuilt) this story/cycle must have once started, with a character or more, and some determinant acting. GRRM gives us Brandon the Builder as the legendary ancestor, the man who "built" Winterfell and the Wall. Ho...Things are well done, because the saga just starts beyond the Wall with the prologue, and after that continues at Winterfell for many chapters before we quit the North. Stark have a central position, and they are linked to the Wall and to the Others and the Long Night and the eternal Winter menacing the human world. 

So, why are the Starks linked to that stuff ? Why does it always need a Stark at Winterfell ? What is the signification of "wolf's blood" ? What is their secret ? What is the true story that they can't tell ? 

My method : I will follow the most I can the litteral sense of the text, the concret echoes and the structure. The symbollic can help, obviously, but it won't be essential : let's considering it as a bonus who reinforce the first sense (just as advise : I like very much the symbollic interpretations, but if I began with here, I'll never end telling this f*** story, and loose myself in the labyrinth of my thoughts!). I also will take the legends for what they are : legends, and not real story a priori.

GRRM uses a special process : the analogy : one situation is played in quite the same way by differents characters in different places. I like to use a musical metaphor for that : the theme, and the variations on this theme. 

I take as an example the story of Lyanna and Rhaegar : 

- there is a castle/a tower

- a singer/warrior is seducing some maiden

- a maiden is promised to a man she don't love

- there is a challenge and the singer/warrior wins

- the maid is robed by the singer/winner of the challenge

This structure appears in many differents occasions on the saga : the story of Bael the Bard, Sansa robed by Petyr Baelish the mocking bird (ASOS), Arya robed by Sandor Clegane (ASOS), Brienne challenging Shagwell and the 2 others Mummers at the Whispers and robing Hyle Hunt (who quit Tarly's service)(AFFC), aso... I just can't mention all the variations, because there are so much. 

What was strange for me in this example, and what forced me to question, was that the story of Bael seemed to be a variation on the "theme Lyanna and Rhaegar". That was logically impossible, because this story of Bael robing a Stark girl is unknown in the south of the Wall, and the chronology make Bael very very anterior to Lyanna and Rhaegar. So... Lyanna and Rhaegar couldn't play the theme as I first believed, but a variation. But how the hell could they play a variation about a theme that nobody knows in the south of the Wall ? Hey It's magic ! Indeed, surely greenseerly and weirwoodly magic, I would say, weirwood are retaining memories and greenseers can inspire dreams and visions as we can see with Bran, Jaime, Jojen or the woman of Nobleheart. After these considerations, I began to suspect that Bael wasn't the only untold story at Winterfell : perhaps she was entirely false, but perhaps also that all the variations in the saga were here to show us that there was some truth in it. Like maester Aemon says to Sam : 

 

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"Maester, it was only a story. A sailor's story." Dareon was to blame for this as well. The singer had been bringing back all manner of queer tales from the alehouses and brothels. Unfortunately, he had been in his cups when he heard the one about the dragons and could not recall the details. "Dareon may have made up the whole story. Singers do that. They make things up."

"They do," said Maester Aemon, "but even the most fanciful song may hold a kernel of truth. Find that truth for me, Sam." (Sam III, AFFC)

 

 

 

Ok, let's do the same, and look for the true story of the Stark, or if you prefer the hidden theme of the song. I hope we will discover the true name of their grand grand grand(...) mother (the woman with white hair in last Bran's vision, Bran III ADWD), and... little consequences 

But let's start with our first and more obsviously clue !  

 

1.THE KIN(G)SLAYING

This theme is very recurrent in the saga. Sometimes it's a kingslaying (Jaime killing king Aerys II...), sometime it is a kinslaying (Tyrion killing his father, Sandor and Gregor ready to fight each other to death...), and other times, the both are reunited and the goal is to take a crown : 

- Stannis killing Renly

- Euron killing Balon 

- the (legendary) Night King

- Brynden Rivers killing Daemon Blackfyre (I know, Daemon wasn't officially king of Westeros, but he would have been, if he had won; and BR didn't take the crow, he was fighting for his brother. We will keep it in mind^^)

(the list is non exhaustive)

Renly's death is very important, because Catelyn Stark's visit to Renly takes 3 chapters (Red Wedding has 4 chapters but 2 PoV, Arya and Catelyn). The link between the Stark and the Baratheon brothers can be directly established with the text : 

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Across rain-sodden fields and stony ridges, she could see the great castle of Storm's End rearing up against the sky, its back to the unseen sea. Beneath that mass of pale grey stone, the encircling army of Lord Stannis Baratheon looked as small and insignificant as mice with banners. (Catelyn III, ACOK)

 

The grey is the color of the Starks, often associated with mists and ghosts. Just after that quote, Catelyn remember the story of Storm's End who was built by the legendary Durran helped by Brandon the Builder. Storm's End, also, is associated to a fist : 

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Of towers, there was but one, a colossal drum tower, windowless where it faced the sea, so large that it was granary and barracks and feast hall and lord's dwelling all in one, crowned by massive battlements that made it look from afar like a spiked fist atop an upthrust arm.(Catelyn III, ACOK)

After Renly's death, turning back to Riverrun, Catelyn have a last look on it : 

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The nightfires had burned low, and as the east began to lighten the immense mass of Storm's End emerged like a dream of stone while wisps of pale mist raced across the field, flying from the sun on wings of wind. Morning ghosts, she had heard Old Nan call them once, spirits returning to their graves.(Catelyn IV, ACOK)

Here, a mass of stone, like Winterfell, and instead of the crows of Winterfell, we have the flying mists/ghosts/spirits. The cold mists beyond the Wall are one of the form of the Others (and it seems that Tormund knows only this form, as it is suggested in ADWD, when he says to Jon that his son was killed by the cold mists). 

The chapter following Renly's death is the arrival of the Night Watch to the Fist, at the end of the day, when Catelyn was leaving Storm's End at dawn. 

Before Renly's death, Catelyn come back from a ruined an empty septuary, and passes throw Renly's army : 

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The long ranks of man and horse were armored in darkness, as black as if the Smith had hammered night itself into steel. There were banners to her right, banners to her left, and rank on rank of banners before her, but in the predawn gloom, neither colors nor sigils could be discerned. A grey army, Catelyn thought. Grey men on grey horses beneath grey banners. As they sat their horses waiting, Renly's shadow knights pointed their lances upward, so she rode through a forest of tall naked trees, bereft of leaves and life. Where Storm's End stood was only a deeper darkness, a wall of black through which no stars could shine, but she could see torches moving across the fields where Lord Stannis had made his camp. (Catelyn IV, ACOK)

Renly's army is transform as a Stark army (grey), and strongly linked in the same time to the Others, as they are "shadows" and they form a "forest of tall naked trees", that reminds us the first appear of the Other (AGOT, prologue), throw the trees, confounding with them. Behind this "forest", the "wall". 

There were same image (the grey and the shadows) also for the battle of Whispering Wood, this time a battle of Stark against Lannister armies. 

There are much more details to study in these chapters (the coming of the dawn, for example), I choosed only a few to show how in that particular situation, Renly's death was reliated to the Stark's imagery, and can make us deduce that there is a king- and kinslaying at the origins of the Stark. 

This hypothesis find a confirmation with one version of the Night's King legend : according to Old Nan, the Night's King (who has officially no name) was a Stark and was killed by his brother Stark. The important thing isn't imo to determine if Old Nan tells the truth or not, but the presence of the kin(g)slaying theme, associated with a true name forbidden = it's significates that there is really a taboo on the Starks, and that the kin(g)slaying was strongly hidden... by a wall.

After the fact, the following question is "who ?", I mean "who were the brothers ? what are their characteristics ?"

I will explore the hypothetic protagonists of the kingslaying in another post, and I will do it exploring the case Euron-Balon (as english isn't my language, it takes me time to write something clear enough^^)

 

[Lady Blizzardborn]

The Wall was in production (possibly finished) before Night's King arose. I don't think it hides anything related to NK and his brother. Besides which we don't even know if NK was killed or not, and if he was killed it could have been by Joramun because Joramun was King-beyond-the-Wall at the time and teamed up with the King in the North to help take down NK.

Kinslaying affects only the one who does it, not the descendants for all time. So I don't think there's a curse on the Starks as a whole.

But you are making some really interesting points with the rest. I know the Littlefinger isn't Bael but he is Bael-ish has been mentioned before. Pretty good wordplay by Martin there.

[GloubieBoulga]

19 minutes ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

The Wall was in production (possibly finished) before Night's King arose. I don't think it hides anything related to NK and his brother. Besides which we don't even know if NK was killed or not, and if he was killed it could have been by Joramun because Joramun was King-beyond-the-Wall at the time and teamed up with the King in the North to help take down NK.

Kinslaying affects only the one who does it, not the descendants for all time. So I don't think there's a curse on the Starks as a whole.

In fact, the "curse" will be one of the points I will study further, and I agree with you about the kin(g)slaying : the fact doesn't curse in se, as Euron can demonstrate (for the moment), or even Daenerys if we considere that she indirectly caused Viserys's death by humiliating him in Dothraki's Sea; nor Stannis if we are pragmatic and retain that "Renly's ghost" was Garlan disguised and that the arrival of Tywin and Tyrell's armies were decisive for his defeat. 

But I think there is also something subtile with the blood, like volontary or not "magic blood" that can link two bloods together and create an influence (I think the link can be conserved in some manner, for example like the Targaryen having children together to keep the "purity" of their blood - in fact the link with the blood of dragon : I suppose that if they have known how to bind physically their blood with the blood of a dragon, they would have no need to marry their sisters or brothers)

For the NK, only the theme interests me here for the purpose, because for the moment, it is only a legend, so we have no idea and no proof of his existence, nor the existence of Joramun. I wanted to show that there is a part of untold memory concerning the Stark, and this "shadow side" come sometimes to the light with legends and tales, and probably transformed, like the singers are transforming the reality during Joffrey's wedding when they sing the Battle of the Blackwater.. Per chance, for the present story, GRRM offers us the possibility to contemplate the reality of what the characters are living (their thoughts and their acts) and to see how this reality is changed by the singers. As "human nature is the same", the idea is to find the ancien acts repeating in the present. 

The kin(g)slaying is only the very first step of the reflexion, or the top of the iceberg, if you prefer, and yes, Bael-ish will reappear in the thread, he is very central 

 

58 minutes ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

But you are making some really interesting points with the rest. I know the Littlefinger isn't Bael but he is Bael-ish has been mentioned before. Pretty good wordplay by Martin there.

Thanks 

[Lady Blizzardborn]

2 minutes ago, GloubieBoulga said:

In fact, the "curse" will be one of the points I will study further, and I agree with you about the kin(g)slaying : the fact doesn't curse in se, as Euron can demonstrate (for the moment), or even Daenerys if we considere that she indirectly caused Viserys's death by humiliating him in Dothraki's Sea; nor Stannis if we are pragmatic and retain that "Renly's ghost" was Garlan disguised and that the arrival of Tywin and Tyrell's armies were decisive for his defeat. 

But I think there is also something subtile with the blood, like volontary or not "magic blood" that can link two bloods together and create an influence (I think the link can be conserved in some manner, for example like the Targaryen having children together to keep the "purity" of their blood - in fact the link with the blood of dragon : I suppose that if they have known how to bind physically their blood with the blood of a dragon, they would have no need to marry their sisters or brothers)

For the NK, only the theme interests me here for the purpose, because for the moment, it is only a legend, so we have no idea and no proof of his existence, nor the existence of Joramun. I wanted to show that there is a part of untold memory concerning the Stark, and this "shadow side" come sometimes to the light with legends and tales, and probably transformed, like the singers are transforming the reality during Joffrey's wedding when they sing the Battle of the Blackwater.. Per chance, for the present story, GRRM offers us the possibility to contemplate the reality of what the characters are living (their thoughts and their acts) and to see how this reality is changed by the singers. As "human nature is the same", the idea is to find the ancien acts repeating in the present. 

The kin(g)slaying is only the very first step of the reflexion, or the top of the iceberg, if you prefer, and yes, Bael-ish will reappear in the thread, he is very central 

 

Thanks 

Eh, Viserys caused his own death. He humiliated himself by being an unreasonable jerk. He refused to learn, follow, or even respect the Dothraki customs and suffered as a result. Then he drunkenly threatened the life of Drogo's unborn child. Not smart considering what Drogo does for a living. But I do see your point there.

Actually the dragon bonding with blood may be the whole reason for the Valyrian incest. If a particular dragon bloodline is bound to a particular house, they'll want to keep the descendants marrying in-house as often as possible to decrease the likelihood of another dragonlord family claiming their dragons for riding.

Well for that matter we don't know that NK, if he did exist, actually was a Stark either. But again, I see your point and it's a very good one. The dark side to the "good guy" family in the series. The hidden past. If you've ever heard the expression that "every family has a skeleton in their closet" that really applies well here. For the Starks the "skeleton" or secret they don't want anyone to learn would be something to do with NK or the Others probably. And the odd thing is that the current Starks don't even know about the secret. You can't protect a secret you don't know about.

An excellent point. Like how a lot of people think Richard III of England was a hunchbacked monster because Shakespeare portrayed him that way, but Shakespeare was writing for an audience that lived under Tudor rule so of course Richard had to be as awful as possible in the play. It would be fun to get an epilogue that gives us the blatantly wrong information that gets passed down by singers and historians after the end of the story.

I'm really looking forward to seeing you develop this. 

[GloubieBoulga]

On 16/03/2017 at 7:33 PM, Lady Blizzardborn said:

The dark side to the "good guy" family in the series. The hidden past. If you've ever heard the expression that "every family has a skeleton in their closet" that really applies well here. For the Starks the "skeleton" or secret they don't want anyone to learn would be something to do with NK or the Others probably. And the odd thing is that the current Starks don't even know about the secret. You can't protect a secret you don't know about.

In french, we say "le cadavre dans le placard" (= the corpse in the cupboard), yes, this is exactly my basical idea, but with more than one corpse concerning the Starks ^^. And yes, I think that they ignore this fact, and they probably never knew the real secret, except their first greenseer which I will call Brandon Stark the Builder for commodity (I mean the Brandon Stark who "built" the Wall and Winterfell). When Daenerys is at the HOTU, she is called "slayer of lies", and for me the ultimate lie is obviously this lie of the Starks (=the stonebeast taken wings and breathing shadow fire, in a smoking tower). 

But let's go to the second point of our exploration. We have seen how a kin(g)slaying was reliated to the Starks, and we will now looking at the kin(g)slayer(s), beginning with Euron Greyjoy.

2.THE KIN(G)SLAYER 

So, I have chosen Euron because his imagery is the most obvious, but I'll first establish his responsability in Balon Greyjoy's death (who was his brother and his king), just for recall.

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I dreamt I saw a shadow with a burning heart butchering a golden stag, aye. I dreamt of a man without a face, waiting on a bridge that swayed and swung. On his shoulder perched a drowned crow with seaweed hanging from his wings. (Arya IV, ASOS)

 This is the first mention of what will happen with Balon : the woman at Highheart has green dreams, and as we can recognize in the "shadow with a burning heart butchering a golden stag" Stannis's shadow killing Renly, we can say that the visions are very concretes : so, the "man without a face" represent a faceless man; the "drowned crow with seaweed..." perched on the shoulder oft the faceless man is Euron, as his sigill is a crow, his nickname is "Crow's Eye". "drowned" and "seawed hanging from his wings" alludes to the Drowned God, the religion of Ironborn (it isn't an identification to the Drowned God, but an element to confirm that the "crow" is an Ironborn), and perhaps also the fact that Euron is on the sea when Balon dies, so he can have an alibi. Confirmation of the alibi in AFFC : 

 

 

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Asha slid her dirk out of its sheath and began to clean the dirt from beneath her fingernails. "Three years away, and the Crow's Eye returns the very day my father dies."

"The day after, we had heard. Silence was still out to sea when Balon died, or so it is claimed. Even so, I will agree that Euron's return was . . . timely, shall we say?" (The Kraken's daughter, AFFC)

"There you have it, from the mouths of three brave men," Euron said. "The Silence was at sea when Balon died. If you doubt an uncle's word, I give you leave to ask my crew."

"A crew of mutes? Aye, that would serve me well."(The Iron Captain, AFFC)

 

 

Spoiler

Euron himself confirms in the Forsaken's chapter (a preview chapter from TWOW) that he was responsible of Balon's death, and also for the death of other brothers, and the rape of Aeron and Urrigon

Euron make also an allusion to the price he gave to Faceless men for Balon's death : 

 

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"Grapes are real. A man can gorge himself on grapes. Their juice is sweet, and they make wine. What do dragons make?"

"Woe." The Crow's Eye sipped from his silver cup. "I once held a dragon's egg in this hand, brother. This Myrish wizard swore he could hatch it if I gave him a year and all the gold that he required. When I grew bored with his excuses, I slew him. As he watched his entrails sliding through his fingers he said, 'But it has not been a year.'" He laughed. "Cragorn's died, you know."

"Who?"

"The man who blew my dragon horn. When the maester cut him open, his lungs were charred as black as soot."

Victarion shuddered. "Show me this dragon's egg."(The Reaver, AFFC)

"I threw it in the sea during one of my dark moods."

 

 

 In this dialogue, we learn that he tried to wake a dragon in his egg but failed : he had heard the tales about Daenerys and her dragons from the warlocks he captured near Qarth. So if Euron doesn't mind jewell or other treasure, he wants very hardly what can give him great power. And dragons represent for him Targaryen, but almost Valyria's empire and the power of the dragonlords. Giving a dragon's egg (=renouncing to a "valyrian crown") to obtain the death of a king brother (and his crown) seems the kind of deal that Facelessmen practice : when Arya in ACOK saves 3 lives (Jaqen, Rorge and Biter), Jaqen says her that she must give 3 death in exchange (Chiswyck, Weese and Jaqen). The presence of a Faceless man at the Citadell under Pate's identity, in Marwyn's entourage (and having access to forbiden part of the library) could be a confirmation that FM are interested by dragons. After all, their religious order was born throw Valyria's slaves and they can "fear" a return of dragons and dragonlords. 

But back to Euron. What is the link with the Starks ? First the "Crow's Eye". 

Far before the baby direwolves were found, Bran was linked to the crows at Winterfell : 

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The best way was to start from the godswood, shinny up the tall sentinel, and cross over the armory and the guards hall, leaping roof to roof, barefoot so the guards wouldn't hear you overhead. That brought you up to the blind side of the First Keep, the oldest part of the castle, a squat round fortress that was taller than it looked. Only rats and spiders lived there now but the old stones still made for good climbing. You could go straight up to where the gargoyles leaned out blindly over empty space, and swing from gargoyle to gargoyle, hand over hand, around to the north side. From there, if you really stretched, you could reach out and pull yourself over to the broken tower where it leaned close. The last part was the scramble up the blackened stones to the eyrie, no more than ten feet, and then the crows would come round to see if you'd brought any corn. (Bran II, AGOT)

"Leap", that the word used by Euron when he says to Victarion that before flying, we leap : 

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Euron turned to face him, his bruised blue lips curled in a half smile. "Perhaps we can fly. All of us. How will we ever know unless we leap from some tall tower?" The wind came gusting through the window and stirred his sable cloak. There was something obscene and disturbing about his nakedness. "No man ever truly knows what he can do unless he dares to leap." (The Reaver, AFFC)

It seems that Euron didn't dare to leap - and fall as Bran - at least physically. But it is possible that he give a metaphoric sense to the word : drinking shade of the evening is a manner to leap in dreams, and sailing to Meereen to conquer the dragonqueen seems another way to leap before flying, as he suggests it to Victarion, sending him to Meereen with the Dragonbinder.

And obviously there is the third eye : 

 

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The captain took the cup Euron had not offered, sniffed at its contents suspiciously. Seen up close, it looked more blue than black. It was thick and oily, with a smell like rotted flesh. He tried a small swallow, and spit it out at once. "Foul stuff. Do you mean to poison me?"

"I mean to open your eyes." Euron drank deep from his own cup, and smiled.(The Reaver, AFFC)

 

 I won't re-write what many people have already writen about the parallelism between shade of the evening and what Bran eat before connecting to the weirwood. I'll just insist on the crow's theme : the red eye on the sigill recalls the eyes of the weirwoods who are yet opened; Euron has one eye hidden, as an echo to BR (and Crowfood Umber, also), but he hadn't lost it : the hidden eye is black as a crow's eye, when the other eye (the "smiling one") is blue - as the Other's eyes, perhaps ? In the first Prologue, we see and ear the Others laughing before Waymar's slaughting. Euron is literaly a mocking crow, and he also appear like a puppeteer in this metaphor :

 

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"I have seen you in the nightfires, Victarion Greyjoy. You come striding through the flames stern and fierce, your great axe dripping blood, blind to the tentacles that grasp you at wrist and neck and ankle, the black strings that make you dance."  (The Iron suitor, ADWD)

 

This time, Euron is compared to a cracken, but with the black color of the crows. I use to see here a foreshadowing for Euron skinchanging his brother Victarion and stealing his body after he has stolen his wife, his victories and his men. 

The link between Euron and the Stark isn't a "global" link, but here, he appears like a variation about a Stark greenseer. The fact that he is a kin(g)slayer let us thinking that a Stark greenseer was also a kin(g)slayer at the origins of the Starks. What I call the "bird character". 

To try this hypothesis, I have looked after other kinslayers and kingslayers in the saga to determine if they had the same characteristics. And the answer is : yes ! But not all. 

- Stannis : he has a thin connection with the birds when he tells this tale to Davos : 

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"When I was a lad I found an injured goshawk and nursed her back to health. Proudwing, I named her. She would perch on my shoulder and flutter from room to room after me and take food from my hand, but she would not soar. Time and again I would take her hawking, but she never flew higher than the treetops. Robert called her Weakwing. He owned a gyrfalcon named Thunderclap who never missed her strike. One day our great-uncle Ser Harbert told me to try a different bird. I was making a fool of myself with Proudwing, he said, and he was right." Stannis Baratheon turned away from the window, and the ghosts who moved upon the southern sea. "The Seven have never brought me so much as a sparrow. It is time I tried another hawk, Davos. A red hawk." (Davos I, ACOK)

We learn that Stannis was in fond of a bird he had nursed. As Bran dreaming to be a knight and being broken, Stannis was dreaming to have a proud and valiant hawk but had only a weak one. And he was jealous of his elder brother for that. Another interesting detail, which connects Stannis to the greenseer, is an allusion he makes after Renly's death, to a possible accusation : 

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" Robert could piss in a cup and men would call it wine, but I offer them pure cold water and they squint in suspicion and mutter to each other about how queer it tastes." Stannis ground his teeth. "If someone said I had magicked myself into a boar to kill Robert, likely they would believe that as well." (Davos II, ACOK)

So Stannis isn't a bird nor a skinchanger or a greenseer, but as a kin(g)slayer, he is connected to this theme. As Euron and Bran, he is a second son. Donal Noye says also about him that he is like iron "black and hard and strong, but brittle", "iron" like Euron, "black" like a crow, "brittle" like was the boy Bran. "Hard and strong" like Stark ? ^^

- And the following winners are Littlefinger - the mocking bird - and Varys - the spider with his little birds. 

I must leave now, so I will synthetize their bird's theme in a following post.