np1234

Just how important is Mance?

37 posts in this topic

It appears to me that Mance is often overlooked when predicting what will happen in the WOW. I believe that Mance is one of the most important characters in the entire story and will be vital in the war to come against the Others. Mance was one of the first characters that we were officially introduced to in AGOT and we later find out that he was actually present in the story from the very beginning even though we were not aware of it. He has been the only one who has been able to unite a large group of people under a single purpose against the Others, even if that is just to run from them. So what role will Mance have to play in the war against the Others? I believe he will be the first person to actually gain a true victory against them.

We can assume that the North is in for a bad time in the WOW. Most of the North will be involved in the battle of Winterfell and it appears there will be a major battle at Castle Black between the wildings, Nights Watch and the remaining Knights loyal to the red women. I dont believe its long before the Others march against the wall and bring it down, or partially down at least. With Jon dead (I dont think he will be back for a long time in the WOW) who is left to stand against the Others? That would be Mance. 

Currently Mance is in Winterfell. When the battle for Winterfell I believe Mance will hide down in the Crypts and wait for the fighting to stop. We all something is in the crypts be that knowledge or something physical like the horn of winter. Either way thats not important for Mance. The crypts are deep and old and contain some strong magic. When Mance is down there Melisndres spell over Mance will be broken. When he emerges he will not have to hide and he will lead the free folk once more. This is likely when the Wall will come down and the Nights watch will have no way to stop the Others. The armies of the North will be bloodied and broken but the free folk will rally behind Mance once more. After the Wall is breached Mance will see he cannot simply run anymore, he has the fight the Others. This is his role. He will lead the attack and push the Others back for the entire north to see. When the see that the Wights and the Others can be hurt the north will join him. But Mance will not survive long. The north will be forced to retreat and Mance will die but they he will begin the unification that needs to happen if the Others are to be stopped. 

Can the Others be stopped? Well thats probably a question for another time but either way Mance is going to be very important. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe in Lyanna + Mance = Jon Snow.  Yeah, Mance is important.  He's playing the long game and he could beat out Stannis and Roose to lay claim to the north.  With snows several feet deep, the ruler on the iron throne won't be so keen to march soldiers to retake a frozen wasteland.  In effect, Mance will become the new King of Winter.  He won't live through the long night.  Jon will inherit the icey north from Mance and rule as the King of Winter for a while until the return of spring.  A pact will be made between Jon Snow and the Others.  The Starks, led by Jon, will bring back human sacrifices like the NK and the NQ did in the past.  In return the Others will help them maintain control of the north.  The south and the dragons will retake the north in spring.  Jon and his army of ice will be melted down to moisture at the trident.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Transporter said:

I believe in Lyanna + Mance = Jon Snow.  

Do you think Mance is rhaegar?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Transporter said:

I believe in Lyanna + Mance = Jon Snow.  Yeah, Mance is important.  He's playing the long game and he could beat out Stannis and Roose to lay claim to the north.  With snows several feet deep, the ruler on the iron throne won't be so keen to march soldiers to retake a frozen wasteland.  In effect, Mance will become the new King of Winter.  He won't live through the long night.  Jon will inherit the icey north from Mance and rule as the King of Winter for a while until the return of spring.  A pact will be made between Jon Snow and the Others.  The Starks, led by Jon, will bring back human sacrifices like the NK and the NQ did in the past.  In return the Others will help them maintain control of the north.  The south and the dragons will retake the north in spring.  Jon and his army of ice will be melted down to moisture at the trident.

wait king of winter? you mean king of the north right. And what does NK and NQ stand for

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mance did what he was suppose to do . He unified most of the wildling tribes and now that it is done ,he must depart the scene leaving Jon as the new king beyond the wall .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, BRANDON GREYSTARK said:

Mance did what he was suppose to do . He unified most of the wildling tribes and now that it is done ,he must depart the scene leaving Jon as the new king beyond the wall .

I doubt he will simply just depart. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First of all, yes Mance is important. Second, he's probably not one of the most important. He's a second-tier character. The most important ones are first-tier.

Second, Mance is not Jon's father unless he is Rhaegar, and he is probably not Rhaegar. I'm having a fabulous discussion via PM with a fellow-poster who has made the best case ever for M=R and even he says it's extremely unlikely. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Mance's backstory of being a crow and leaving over the cloak is interesting enough, why does he need to be Rhaegar or Arthur Dayne to be important? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it is entirely possible that his role in the story is over.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As the OP noted, Mance is of preliminary mention in the stories, and obviously we open with Bran.  I think good writing technique dictates that these two are going to wrap the story as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Makk said:

I think it is entirely possible that his role in the story is over.

Yeah, I didn't see the purpose in saving his life. Maybe to help Bran later on?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He unified the wildlings and he was the perfect bridge between them and Jon Snow. The wildlings pre Mance would have found it nearly impossible to trust a crow. 

Thanks to Mance (including his possible horrible death) JS will probably have an army

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, Ralphis Baratheon said:

I think Mance's backstory of being a crow and leaving over the cloak is interesting enough, why does he need to be Rhaegar or Arthur Dayne to be important? 

He doesn't. People just want more hidden identities. We get bored between books.

8 hours ago, aventador577 said:

Yeah, I didn't see the purpose in saving his life. Maybe to help Bran later on?

Well someone has to open the Tomb of Requirement. :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/19/2017 at 10:53 AM, np1234 said:

It appears to me that Mance is often overlooked when predicting what will happen in the WOW. I believe that Mance is one of the most important characters in the entire story and will be vital in the war to come against the Others. Mance was one of the first characters that we were officially introduced to in AGOT and we later find out that he was actually present in the story from the very beginning even though we were not aware of it. He has been the only one who has been able to unite a large group of people under a single purpose against the Others, even if that is just to run from them. So what role will Mance have to play in the war against the Others? I believe he will be the first person to actually gain a true victory against them.

We can assume that the North is in for a bad time in the WOW. Most of the North will be involved in the battle of Winterfell and it appears there will be a major battle at Castle Black between the wildings, Nights Watch and the remaining Knights loyal to the red women. I dont believe its long before the Others march against the wall and bring it down, or partially down at least. With Jon dead (I dont think he will be back for a long time in the WOW) who is left to stand against the Others? That would be Mance. 

Currently Mance is in Winterfell. When the battle for Winterfell I believe Mance will hide down in the Crypts and wait for the fighting to stop. We all something is in the crypts be that knowledge or something physical like the horn of winter. Either way thats not important for Mance. The crypts are deep and old and contain some strong magic. When Mance is down there Melisndres spell over Mance will be broken. When he emerges he will not have to hide and he will lead the free folk once more. This is likely when the Wall will come down and the Nights watch will have no way to stop the Others. The armies of the North will be bloodied and broken but the free folk will rally behind Mance once more. After the Wall is breached Mance will see he cannot simply run anymore, he has the fight the Others. This is his role. He will lead the attack and push the Others back for the entire north to see. When the see that the Wights and the Others can be hurt the north will join him. But Mance will not survive long. The north will be forced to retreat and Mance will die but they he will begin the unification that needs to happen if the Others are to be stopped. 

Can the Others be stopped? Well thats probably a question for another time but either way Mance is going to be very important. 

He isn't important at all. He is there as a counterpoint to Jon beyond the wall.  All of the women sent with him are dead and so far there is nothing to indicate he managed to escape or hide

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Dorian Martell's son said:

He isn't important at all. He is there as a counterpoint to Jon beyond the wall.  All of the women sent with him are dead and so far there is nothing to indicate he managed to escape or hide

I completely disagree. He is mentioned in the second paragraph of the first chapter of the first book. He is the first character in the series introduced with a title. GRRM is very intentional with his wording, there's a reason were introduced to him first. So far he and Bloodraven have done the absolute most in the fight against the others, which are presented to us at the ultimate threat. He took the most central character in and broadened his horizons, in many ways acting as a father figure to Jon, similar to how Jon is now acting as a father figure to his son Aemon Steelsong. He has united warring nations through politics and force, supposedly killed hundreds of white walkers, and just pulled off a pretty epic Theon and fArya escape.

Plus, I believe the text strongly supports Mance writing the Pink Letter, and that he is most likely fine and dandy. When you consider that Rowan is almost surely an Umber it means that Mance does in fact have a certain ploy in mind that we have not yet been made aware of. The black crow is a tricksy bird. Abel can fend for himself.

Overall, Mance is one of the best men/characters/leaders in the series.

There's a good chance he'll be dying soon in TWOW (possibly at Jon's hand), but that doesn't make him any less important to the story.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

He doesn't. People just want more hidden identities. We get bored between books.

I don't even think it's a desire for more hidden identities or anything like that. I think people just want to be the one to figure something out that no one else did.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Lord Lannister said:

I don't even think it's a desire for more hidden identities or anything like that. I think people just want to be the one to figure something out that no one else did.

I think it's both.  As the time between books grows longer the theories seem to get wilder, Dany isn't who she says/thinks she is, Mance is actually Rhaegar, Tyrion is this and these people are actually that. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

He doesn't. People just want more hidden identities. We get bored between books.

/\ This /\

1 hour ago, Aegon VII said:

I completely disagree. He is mentioned in the second paragraph of the first chapter of the first book. He is the first character in the series introduced with a title. GRRM is very intentional with his wording, there's a reason were introduced to him first. So far he and Bloodraven have done the absolute most in the fight against the others, which are presented to us at the ultimate threat. He took the most central character in and broadened his horizons, in many ways acting as a father figure to Jon, similar to how Jon is now acting as a father figure to his son Aemon Steelsong. He has united warring nations through politics and force, supposedly killed hundreds of white walkers, and just pulled off a pretty epic Theon and fArya escape.

Plus, I believe the text strongly supports Mance writing the Pink Letter, and that he is most likely fine and dandy. When you consider that Rowan is almost surely an Umber it means that Mance does in fact have a certain ploy in mind that we have not yet been made aware of. The black crow is a tricksy bird. Abel can fend for himself.

Overall, Mance is one of the best men/characters/leaders in the series.

There's a good chance he'll be dying soon in TWOW (possibly at Jon's hand), but that doesn't make him any less important to the story.

I am surprised to find someone on this forum think that bloodraven is working against the others. Nice.
As for the timing of introductions, that really has no bearing on anything. Mance is mentioned in the first book, but we do not meet him until the third book. We hear about Marwyn in the first book too, but we don't see him until the end of the fourth. 
I am curious, where did it say that mance had killed hundreds of white walkers? He fights with steel. We never see him mention dragonglass as far as I can remember. 
As for the pink letter? Meh. whoever wrote it did it to get Jon to ride south. He tried and got stabbed. Job done. Also, the rowan theory is cute, but it is just that, and unproven theories rarely bolster another unproven theory. Speaking of the pink letter, the text also strongly supports Stannis writing the pink letter. Far more than Mance, and we met Stannis earlier in the story, he has played a larger role in the story and has all the information necessary to compose it.
I completely disagree on your opinion of his greatness. He is written OK, and he does beat Jon in a fight, but his command gets obliterated  pretty easily and he is probably captured and nude in a cell in winterfell
Also, why do you think Jon will kill him? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Aegon VII said:

I completely disagree. He is mentioned in the second paragraph of the first chapter of the first book. He is the first character in the series introduced with a title. GRRM is very intentional with his wording, there's a reason were introduced to him first. So far he and Bloodraven have done the absolute most in the fight against the others, which are presented to us at the ultimate threat. He took the most central character in and broadened his horizons, in many ways acting as a father figure to Jon, similar to how Jon is now acting as a father figure to his son Aemon Steelsong. He has united warring nations through politics and force, supposedly killed hundreds of white walkers, and just pulled off a pretty epic Theon and fArya escape.

Plus, I believe the text strongly supports Mance writing the Pink Letter, and that he is most likely fine and dandy. When you consider that Rowan is almost surely an Umber it means that Mance does in fact have a certain ploy in mind that we have not yet been made aware of. The black crow is a tricksy bird. Abel can fend for himself.

Overall, Mance is one of the best men/characters/leaders in the series.

There's a good chance he'll be dying soon in TWOW (possibly at Jon's hand), but that doesn't make him any less important to the story.

What?  He specifically says he cannot fight the WW's.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, aryagonnakill#2 said:

What?  He specifically says he cannot fight the WW's.

I think he meant wights. He can fight the wights, as evidenced by his ordering Varamyr to put his wolves on the wights' scent and every man to have a torch and flint.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now