shardofNarsil

Why did Tywin liked Jaime so much?

24 posts in this topic

Tywin wasn't the kind of person who gave his approval easily but still from every POV we can see that Jaime was someone whom  Tywin loved or say prized more than anyone in the world. That's not to say that Jaime being extraordinarily gifted in arms and god-tier handsome was nothing to be proud of ,but I always saw Tywin who valued shrewdness over battle prowess as we can see when he talks of Robert and Jaime does shows a bit hot-headedness time to time ,then why does he loves Jaime exceedingly so as compared to his other children 

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36 minutes ago, shardofNarsil said:

Tywin wasn't the kind of person who gave his approval easily but still from every POV we can see that Jaime was someone whom  Tywin loved or say prized more than anyone in the world. That's not to say that Jaime being extraordinarily gifted in arms and god-tier handsome was nothing to be proud of ,but I always saw Tywin who valued shrewdness over battle prowess as we can see when he talks of Robert and Jaime does shows a bit hot-headedness time to time ,then why does he loves Jaime exceedingly so as compared to his other children 

 

Why did Tywin liked Jaime so much?

Vanity and pride in a handsome son. Tywin could overlook the lack of brains because Jaime made up for it with his combat skills and his good looks.  Jaime looked the part of a lion of the rock, the man who would rule the richest territory and the most luxurious castle in the kingdom. 

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30 minutes ago, The Transporter said:

 

Vanity and pride in a handsome son. Tywin could overlook the lack of brains because Jaime made up for it with his combat skills and his good looks.  Jaime looked the part of a lion of the rock, the man who would rule the richest territory and the most luxurious castle in the kingdom. 

I overall agree with this with one exception. I don't think Jaime has a lack of brains. He's not the shrewd tactician that Tywin and Tyrion but he's not stupid, more impulsive and impatient. And I think Tywin recognizes that, in addition to Jaime's good looks and prowess in battle

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Because he is the first born son. He is good looking,charasmatic,and a great fighter. But in truth he seems to be a great pain in the a$$ to tywin. And I think it is more that he sees jaime as his only real heir. I thought that aftertyrion was sentenced to death tywin slept with shea because he needs another heir and was gonna look for a wife

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I think it's a combination of :

-Tywin seeing what he wants to see. He did think Jaime was rash and hot-headed (he tells Tyrion that at the end of Robert's rebellion he rushed to KL in part because he was afraid of what Jaime might do), but he was blind in many aspects when it came to his firstborn (not seeing the twincest). Jaime was the heir who was meant to be.

-Jaime being different from Tywin. I think deep down Tywin was quite insecure, which is why he hated seeing Tyrion exhibiting similarities to his father, and valued Jaime who was unlike him and had a different set of strengths and weaknesses.

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Because Jaime was the cutest of his sons. Cersei lacked the anatomy for being the favorite, though she did have a daddy's little girl thing going for her when she was little.

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18 hours ago, snow is the man said:

I thought that aftertyrion was sentenced to death tywin slept with shea because he needs another heir and was gonna look for a wife

I sincerely doubt Tywin would have wanted an heir from Shae. Also, I think it's pretty certain that Tywin had had secret trysts with whores for some time. 

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Jaime is his golden son. He looks good, he's a great fighter, he isn't stupid (even though he seems like it sometimes), and men like to follow him, according to Tyrion. Especially if you consider  that Tywin's only other children are a woman and a stunted dwarf as well as the fact that he is very concerned about his reputation it makes sense for him to like Jaime. 

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In the context of Westeros, Jaime is everything you want in a first born son; He's essentially what a man should be. Tall, strong, brave and by all accounts, loyal to his family. The only real gripe Tywin had with Jaime was that he joined the KG. An arrangement Tywin wanted to free him of. 

He's not the tactician that his father is. I think aFfC demonstrates this in a lot of ways. Genna's insight suggests That Tyrion is a better fit for the Tywin role. What's more. Jaime makes some questionable decisions out in the Riverlands. One's that could see the Lannisters power waning in the future. Deep, deep down. Jaime wants to boast honors such as the men of the KG before him. Something Tywin wouldn't give two squirts of piss about. 

Jaime isn't the task master his father is, but this can be mitigated through good counsel.  

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52 minutes ago, Dolorous22 said:

this can be mitigated through good counsel.

Indeed. Were Jaime the Lord of Casterly Rock - or seated on the Iron Throne - with his little brother Tyrion as Hand, they'd have a great ruling combo. That is, if only Cersei were married off to someone who would take her far, far away. Like maybe Qarth.

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Of all Tywin's children, Jaime is the one most capable of love, and related to that, the one least narcissistic, least selfish, and most predisposed to serving others, personality traits which ironically may have had some bearing in Tywin's affection.  Although Tywin was a supreme narcissist himself, and therefore crippled emotionally when it came to loving, in so far as one can speak of Tywin ever 'loving' someone, perhaps he loved Jaime the best simply because Jaime loved him, unlike the others.  And let's not forget Jaime killed Aerys, Tywin's arch-nemesis, on account of Tywin.  I don't really believe Jaime did it to save King's Landing, suddenly seized by the soul of righteousness; that's just a story he tells himself in retrospect, since acknowledging the criminal things he's willing to do for love is difficult for him.  He was willing to kill a seven-year-old child, Bran, because he loved Cersei; he released Tyrion from prison (an act of treason) because he loves Tyrion; and he killed Aerys because he loved Tywin and didn't want to have to face him in combat, knowing full well his father's intentions having entered Kings Landing were not honorable and it might come to that -- forcing Jaime to make a choice between Tywin and Aerys.  And Jaime in that moment made his choice -- for love -- for Tywin.  Just like he made his choice between Bran and Cersei; and then between Cersei and Tyrion.  The last order Aerys ever gave Jaime was to bring him the head of his father, prompting Jaime shortly thereafter to kill him (wouldn't it be great dramatic irony if Aerys not Tywin were really Jaime's biological father...so that when Jaime complies with Aerys's order, we can ponder the arising paradox of whether he is really breaking his oath then..?  But I know most of you are all set on Tyrion not Jaime being the little dragonlet-in-hiding, so at least we're spared these further ethical quandaries when it comes to Jaime !)

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17 minutes ago, ravenous reader said:

Of all Tywin's children, Jaime is the one most capable of love, and related to that, the one least narcissistic, least selfish, and most predisposed to serving others, personality traits which ironically may have had some bearing in Tywin's affection.  Although Tywin was a supreme narcissist himself, and therefore crippled emotionally when it came to loving, in so far as one can speak of Tywin ever 'loving' someone, perhaps he loved Jaime the best simply because Jaime loved him, unlike the others.  And let's not forget Jaime killed Aerys, Tywin's arch-nemesis, on account of Tywin.  I don't really believe Jaime did it to save King's Landing, suddenly seized by the soul of righteousness; that's just a story he tells himself in retrospect, since acknowledging the criminal things he's willing to do for love is difficult for him.  He was willing to kill a seven-year-old child, Bran, because he loved Cersei; he released Tyrion from prison (an act of treason) because he loves Tyrion; and he killed Aerys because he loved Tywin and didn't want to have to face him in combat, knowing full well his father's intentions having entered Kings Landing were not honorable and it might come to that -- forcing Jaime to make a choice between Tywin and Aerys.  And Jaime in that moment made his choice -- for love -- for Tywin.  Just like he made his choice between Bran and Cersei; and then between Cersei and Tyrion.  The last order Aerys ever gave Jaime was to bring him the head of his father, prompting Jaime shortly thereafter to kill him (wouldn't it be great dramatic irony if Aerys not Tywin were really Jaime's biological father...so that when Jaime complies with Aerys's order, we can ponder the arising paradox of whether he is really breaking his oath then..?  But I know most of you are all set on Tyrion not Jaime being the little dragonlet-in-hiding, so at least we're spared these further ethical quandaries when it comes to Jaime !)

I agree. Also, maybe out of three children this loving nature of Jaime kinda reminded Tywin of Joanna? Maybe he resembles his mother the most out of trio? I mean, we don't know that much information about Joanna, but if she was able to melt the heart of the Lion, then she is quite a woman indeed. 

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Posted (edited)

3 hours ago, ravenous reader said:

Of all Tywin's children, Jaime is the one most capable of love, and related to that, the one least narcissistic, least selfish, and most predisposed to serving others, personality traits which ironically may have had some bearing in Tywin's affection.  Although Tywin was a supreme narcissist himself, and therefore crippled emotionally when it came to loving, in so far as one can speak of Tywin ever 'loving' someone, perhaps he loved Jaime the best simply because Jaime loved him, unlike the others.  And let's not forget Jaime killed Aerys, Tywin's arch-nemesis, on account of Tywin.

Great insights, I never thought about it this way before. It is quite telling that Jaime's first memorable line for us is "The things I do for love."

 

The funny thing is the other Lannister kids all harp much more about love. Despite all Cersei's claim to love her children, she is so blinded by her own ego and self-interest that she actively puts them in harm's way. Her love for them is toxic and might as well not be there--the kids would probably fare better. As for Tyrion, his supposed lypure love for Tysha only turns him twisted and dysfunctional (not his fault, for sure, but he certainly does not channelize his trauma into a good course). Despite his supposed love towards Jaime, he certainly hasn't really proven it in action.

Edited by omegaxx

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7 hours ago, ravenous reader said:

Of all Tywin's children, Jaime is the one most capable of love, and related to that, the one least narcissistic, least selfish, and most predisposed to serving others, personality traits which ironically may have had some bearing in Tywin's affection.  Although Tywin was a supreme narcissist himself, and therefore crippled emotionally when it came to loving, in so far as one can speak of Tywin ever 'loving' someone, perhaps he loved Jaime the best simply because Jaime loved him, unlike the others.  And let's not forget Jaime killed Aerys, Tywin's arch-nemesis, on account of Tywin.  I don't really believe Jaime did it to save King's Landing, suddenly seized by the soul of righteousness; that's just a story he tells himself in retrospect, since acknowledging the criminal things he's willing to do for love is difficult for him.  He was willing to kill a seven-year-old child, Bran, because he loved Cersei; he released Tyrion from prison (an act of treason) because he loves Tyrion; and he killed Aerys because he loved Tywin and didn't want to have to face him in combat, knowing full well his father's intentions having entered Kings Landing were not honorable and it might come to that -- forcing Jaime to make a choice between Tywin and Aerys.  And Jaime in that moment made his choice -- for love -- for Tywin.  Just like he made his choice between Bran and Cersei; and then between Cersei and Tyrion.  The last order Aerys ever gave Jaime was to bring him the head of his father, prompting Jaime shortly thereafter to kill him (wouldn't it be great dramatic irony if Aerys not Tywin were really Jaime's biological father...so that when Jaime complies with Aerys's order, we can ponder the arising paradox of whether he is really breaking his oath then..?  But I know most of you are all set on Tyrion not Jaime being the little dragonlet-in-hiding, so at least we're spared these further ethical quandaries when it comes to Jaime !)

Wait how is jaime more caring then tyrion. I agree lately tyrion is a bit bitter but he is still better then jaime. And I think he killed aery's more because he wanted to burn the city down because he was losing it more then bring his fathers head to him. Also tywin was so cruel to tyrion he made it impossible for tyrion to love him

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1 hour ago, snow is the man said:

Wait how is jaime more caring then tyrion. I agree lately tyrion is a bit bitter but he is still better then jaime.

Ah.  One of Tyrion's apologists..!

How is Tyrion 'better than Jaime' in your opinion?

When does Tyrion ever do something for someone else that doesn't immediately benefit himself?

And you're right about Tyrion's cruel childhood.  Tyrion is incapable of love just because he wasn't loved -- big whoop.  

P.S.  Please don't confuse Tyrion as GRRM has written him with Peter Dinklage's interpretation.  Dinklage brings pathos, gravitas, compassion and moral complexity to the role that GRRM never put on the page!

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"Why did tywin like jamie so much"

Hmm idk? Maybe because he was his first born son and heir? He doesn't see tyrion as a successor or an heir. He tried to get jamie to leave the kingsguard so he can be his heir by law. Jamie is everything a man would want in a son. His skill, looks, etc. This question is a little stupid but whatever. Tywin sees jamie as the future of house lannister. That's pretty damn obvious.

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Posted (edited)

I go with Jaime being the only person he could take seriously as a male heir and who was - at one point - very respected. But you'd think such a strategic man would go for more than one son, and wouldn't wait several years to do it.

If Tywin had had a spare heir (before Tyrion), he could have coerced Jaime into taking the black or allowed his execution after the regicide incident. And Jaime being in the KG wouldn't have been a problem in the first place. 

Edited by cgrav

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-He's his firstborn son. 

-He's one of, if not the, finest knights of his generation. 

-He's one of the most handsome men in the kingdom and projects a strong image for House Lannister. 

-He didn't outwardly project too many vices, maybe the biggest was vanity and rashness. 

-His only other option as an heir was a disliked, deformed, imp, that spent his days drinking and whoring around across the kingdom. 

Because of all that, he's willing to overlook the faults he KNOWS Jamie to have, because he has all the aspects people will see first. Later on he probably hopes that Jamie is teachable and he can get him in line and to be more cunning. Tyrion on the other hand has the mind and substance, but he'll never have the things that people see when they look at Jamie. 

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He's a non-dwarf with a dick. 

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14 hours ago, ravenous reader said:

Ah.  One of Tyrion's apologists..!

How is Tyrion 'better than Jaime' in your opinion?

When does Tyrion ever do something for someone else that doesn't immediately benefit himself?

And you're right about Tyrion's cruel childhood.  Tyrion is incapable of love just because he wasn't loved -- big whoop.  

P.S.  Please don't confuse Tyrion as GRRM has written him with Peter Dinklage's interpretation.  Dinklage brings pathos, gravitas, compassion and moral complexity to the role that GRRM never put on the page!

He refused to sleep with sansa? He stands up for her consistently. And yes he is far from perfect but in truth he helps alot of people. Jaime on the other hand doesn't care about anyone but cersei and sometimes tyrion for the first three books. He treats everyone like garbage....how is he a caring individual. And I am not a tyrion apologists I will say flat out he has done bad things and does alot to help himself.

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