Swordfish Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 9 minutes ago, Mexal said: If you can show me examples of any a plan or cunning and improve my intelligence, I'd love to see it. He won the election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Reborn Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 3 minutes ago, Mexal said: And just to add more, it looks like Trump is looking to reshuffle his WH staff again, this time "reassigning" Bannon and Preibus. This is a guy who ran on the idea that he's a successful businessman who would hire the absolute best people. He's now looking to have to replace his National Security Advisor, his Chief of Staff, his Deputy Chief of Staff and his Chief Strategist. I'm sure Spicer is coming soon as well. Long term planning indeed. All that being said, it's better for the country if all this happens but lets get beyond the whole "Donald Trump is a secret mastermind with a cunning plan" bullshit. Well thats where your absolutism leads you astray again. No one in this thread appears to have claimed that he is a genius. Just that he is not an utter bumbling fool either. Which your paradigm cannot seem to appreciate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 1 minute ago, Swordfish said: He won the election. Yawn. That's not an example of his plan or cunning intelligence, it's an confluence of multiple factors, some of which were completely out of his control and others which will likely end up being illegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 Just now, Free Northman Reborn said: Well thats where your absolutism leads you astray again. No one in this thread appears to have claimed that he is a genius. Just that he is not an utter bumbling fool either. Which your paradigm cannot seem to appreciate. I'm looking for examples from you. I'm giving you examples of failures he's had in the first 11 weeks of his Presidency. You're telling me he's smarter then he looks. Not sure what to do with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Week Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 Just now, Mexal said: I'm looking for examples from you. I'm giving you examples of failures he's had in the first 11 weeks of his Presidency. You're telling me he's smarter then he looks. Not sure what to do with that. I heard from a very reliable source (i.e. not a bumbling idiot) that it has been, in fact, 13 weeks of his Presidency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 Just now, Free Northman Reborn said: Well thats where your absolutism leads you astray again. No one in this thread appears to have claimed that he is a genius. Just that he is not an utter bumbling fool either. Which your paradigm cannot seem to appreciate. You claimed that he has long-term planning, subterfuge and cunning. Now you're backing off of that to claim that simply he's not a huge idiot. Glad we had this talk. Just now, Mexal said: Yawn. That's not an example of his plan or cunning intelligence, it's an confluence of multiple factors, some of which were completely out of his control and others which will likely end up being illegal. As has been pointed out repeatedly, winning elections is not remotely the same thing as governing well, and one of the biggest failures in American politics is believing that they are equivalent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Reborn Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 Just now, Mexal said: I'm looking for examples from you. I'm giving you examples of failures he's had in the first 11 weeks of his Presidency. You're telling me he's smarter then he looks. Not sure what to do with that. I don't need to convince you. I'm just pointing out that I find your position simplistic. By all means, keep believing it. It makes no difference to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swordfish Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 4 minutes ago, Mexal said: Yawn. That's not an example of his plan or cunning intelligence, it's an confluence of multiple factors, some of which were completely out of his control and others which will likely end up being illegal. Right. He's a bumbling fool, and he won the election by accident. You're right. I don't know what i was thinking. I mean, bumbling fools accidentally win presidential elections all the time, MIRITE?!?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 3 minutes ago, Free Northman Reborn said: I don't need to convince you. I'm just pointing out that I find your position simplistic. By all means, keep believing it. It makes no difference to me. Fair enough. I'll continue to form my opinion based on everything that happens and you continue to form your opinion on beliefs that you don't seem capable of backing up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swordfish Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 3 minutes ago, Kalbear said: You claimed that he has long-term planning, subterfuge and cunning. Now you're backing off of that to claim that simply he's not a huge idiot. Glad we had this talk. As has been pointed out repeatedly, winning elections is not remotely the same thing as governing well, and one of the biggest failures in American politics is believing that they are equivalent. A fortunate thing then that no one said they were equivalent here, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 1 minute ago, Free Northman Reborn said: I don't need to convince you. I'm just pointing out that I find your position simplistic. By all means, keep believing it. It makes no difference to me. And I find your position unsupported by observable data, and thus fantastical. By all means, keep believing it. I'm sure believing in made up things has served you well so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 Just now, Swordfish said: Right. He's a bumbling fool, and he won the election by accident. You're right. I don't know what i was thinking. I mean, bumbling fools accidentally win presidential elections all the time, MIRITE?!?!? I didn't say he was a bumbling fool. I said he has no long term or secret cunning plan in anything he's doing. Regardless, we're in a different paradigm right now then we've ever seen. Lots of things are happening that has never happened before, like I don't know, a foreign adversary intentionally and directly interfering in our election for the sole purpose of electing the sitting President. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 4 minutes ago, Swordfish said: Right. He's a bumbling fool, and he won the election by accident. You're right. I don't know what i was thinking. I mean, bumbling fools accidentally win presidential elections all the time, MIRITE?!?!? Eh, listen to him talk off the cuff. He's not an intelligent man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 This is funny and sad if true. Fox used Trump's Access Hollywood Tape as part of workplace harassment seminars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swordfish Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 5 minutes ago, Mexal said: I didn't say he was a bumbling fool. I said he has no long term or secret cunning plan in anything he's doing. Regardless, we're in a different paradigm right now then we've ever seen. Lots of things are happening that has never happened before, like I don't know, a foreign adversary intentionally and directly interfering in our election for the sole purpose of electing the sitting President. Perhaps the difficulty here is that you do not know the definition of the word cunning: Quote having or showing skill in achieving one's ends by deceit or evasion. I hope that clarifies things for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Week Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 6 minutes ago, Swordfish said: Right. He's a bumbling fool, and he won the election by accident. You're right. I don't know what i was thinking. I mean, bumbling fools accidentally win presidential elections all the time, MIRITE?!?!? What evidence supports cunning or intelligence since the outcome of November 6? AHCA? Travel bans? Wiretapping allegations? etc. etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 Just now, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Eh, listen to him talk off the cuff. He's not an intelligent man. I suspect he's smart, but he does not think about things or consider them. Again, by his own words he acts on instinct, and he believes that his instincts are very good. He believes he can talk his way out of anything and that nothing will hurt him as long as he continues to be rich. This is why he'll happily reverse his position on things in the space of a conversation, because his goal in the conversation isn't to push a position; it's to please and sell the other person on Trump. I would probably put it this way: he doesn't necessarily make horrible decisions all the time, but he does make incredibly rash, passionate decisions all of the time. Some times they work out, some times they don't, but as he has little ego invested in them it doesn't matter much. He'll just be on to the next one. This worked reasonably well in the campaign (though really do I not want to relitigate that yet again), but it is not a great way to govern unless you are in crisis mode all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swordfish Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 6 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Eh, listen to him talk off the cuff. He's not an intelligent man. I think it's highly dubious to judge someones intelligence based solely on their style of speaking. Nevertheless, I am not claiming hes the next Einstein. I'm simply pointing out my surprise that people still continue to underestimate him, given all he;s accomplished. And of all the words to describe him, 'cunning' might be among the best of them. Not that consider calling someone cunning to be a compliment, mind you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 36 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said: Eh, he's clearly operating at an empathetic deficiency. Maybe you're right, but I don't think so. I think the overriding motivation for Trump here was essentially "not on my watch". Agreed. And really, empathy doesn't matter here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 Also, boy does Assad look spanked, eh @Commodore? Nothing like bombing an observatory for human rights to show how cowed you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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