Oily black stone

[velo-knight]

On 4/6/2017 at 6:43 PM, Lollygag said:

The stone itself may or may not be important, but because GRRM decided to add the line about an immense weird stone being randomly found on a beach, I take it that he wants the reader to wonder how it got there.

It doesn't sound like it's part of cliff rock which has broken off, and an immense piece of rock is too heavy to just wash ashore. So how did it get there, and why?

Or they'll conclude it's a baseless myth that makes the world more exciting, because people make up stories like that all the time?

[Lollygag]

9 minutes ago, velo-knight said:

Or they'll conclude it's a baseless myth that makes the world more exciting, because people make up stories like that all the time?

Writing about random rocks found on a beach a long time ago isn't exciting at all unless you're really into Walden. If beach rock description was world-building on GRRM's part, it's pretty lame. But the story behind it could be pretty exciting.

[velo-knight]

42 minutes ago, Lollygag said:

Writing about random rocks found on a beach a long time ago isn't exciting at all unless you're really into Walden. If beach rock description was world-building on GRRM's part, it's pretty lame. But the story behind it could be pretty exciting.

It makes the world feel more real that there are stories claiming various items are ancient heirlooms with a magic and mysterious past, since in real life people did and continue to do that. Fantasy is exciting because sometimes the ancient myths turn out to be true, but I disagree that they all have to be so. In fact, it makes the mysteriousness all the more tantalizing.

I'll believe the story is true either if GRRM shows us more, or if Bran looks fondly on that time Old Nan told him about the throne that came from the sea.

[Lollygag]

6 minutes ago, velo-knight said:

It makes the world feel more real that there are stories claiming various items are ancient heirlooms with a magic and mysterious past, since in real life people did and continue to do that. Fantasy is exciting because sometimes the ancient myths turn out to be true, but I disagree that they all have to be so. In fact, it makes the mysteriousness all the more tantalizing.

I'll believe the story is true either if GRRM shows us more, or if Bran looks fondly on that time Old Nan told him about the throne that came from the sea.

I don't disagree on this.

But when looking at the text from a different perspective, it doesn't make sense to me that this is completely random. And the chairs that are described in story seem quite significant either to the plot or the character. I'm thinking of the Iron Throne, the weirwood throne in the Eyrie, Doran's wheelchair says much about his character, and Dany's bench at Meereen says much about her situation there, as she doesn't have a proper throne.

Actually we don't know what a lot of chairs/thrones look like for the various houses either through in-the-moment POV narration or in recall, so it raises the question of why GRRM felt compelled to describe this one and not so many others for just world-building purposes?

I also can't ignore the connection to volcanic rock, given that volcanoes, hot springs (Winterfell), caves (CotF, the ones near Storm's End),Valyria, and the Doom are clearly such a big part of the plot, though we don't know why yet.

[LmL]

On 4/6/2017 at 3:24 PM, Dorian Martell's son said:

I do have extreme confidence in my viewpoint. So far, the oily black stone has not played any role in the story unlike say, the wall, or weirwood trees, or wildfire, or greyscale or any pile of other tidbits that have already been written. And while GRRM had to approve what was written, the purveyors of this forum are the authors of that book 

By the way, you're dead wrong about this. Martin wrote the vast majority of the text - he wrote 300,000 words for it actually, of which only 150,000 were used TWOIAF was mostly written by Martin, so kindly stop speaking from ignorance and spreading misinformation. 

Quote

Why, you might ask, is George R.R. Martin offering us a new book (The World of Ice and Fire) that's not the new book (The Winds of Winter)? Because he can't stop writing about Westeros! (Along with Essos, Sothoryos, and Ulthos, of course.) "I was supposed to write 50,000 words of text for sidebars, and then I wrote 300,000!" Martin told us recently, laughing over a slice of pizza. "The more I wrote, the more stories were coming, and it just got to be hundreds of pages long."

http://www.vulture.com/2014/11/george-rr-martin-new-book.html

In fact, I'd appreciate it if you'd stop denigrating the work of George R. R. Martin here on the biggest fan forum dedicated to George R. R. Martin. 

Oh and you are certainly not right until proven wrong, that's absurd on its face. 

[LmL]

Let's take the somewhat trollish assertion that the oily black stone will not mean anything "just 'cuz" and treat it like an honest discussion point. It's true that the oily black stone is only mentioned in the main series for sure in ACOK with the seastone chair, and once in ADWD the black basalt blocks of Moat Cailin appear "coated in some fine black oil," and since there are other reasons to wonder about MC's origin, I put this in the maybe pile. But other than that, most of the oily stone info comes in TWOIAF. So how important can it be? 

Well, for starters, the Seastone Chair indicates that the idea of creepy oily black stone is not a late throw in as merely an homage to Lovecraft. Furthermore, anyone who has read some of the analysis highlighting Martin's use of influences from mythology and classic lit and world history and other things, you'll know that he usually finds a way to do more than an homage to ideas he pulls into ASOIAF. But the point is, it was there, right from the start. The mysterious origins of the Ironborn and the suggestion they are not First Men is also right there atthe beginning, and developed throughout the series. 

Asshai is clearly important, and has been seen early in Book One. And in TWOIAF, we learn that Asshai is ENTIRELY made of oily black stone. So, the black stone might be important in that it has to do with the secret of why Asshai is the way it is. 

Then we have the possibility that the black stone will turn up in a place we already know is important. What if there is oily black stone in the Heart of Winter? All the sudden, it's quite important, and it wouldn't come out of left field either - because it's been set up by the Seastone Chair and TWOIAF. What if there is oily black stone on the Isle of Faces, or underneath the Wall? My point isn't to assert that there IS oily stone there, merely that Martin could decide "that's why the Wall is a magical barrier" or "that's what is animating the Others" and boom, black stone is crucial. 

What about Valyrian steel swords? What if oily black stone is the secret ingredient? V steel swords are smoke dark, weirdly, because usually the more pure the steel (meaning the higher the forge temp), the more silver the metal, but V steel is almost black. When Ned's sword is split and reforged, Tobho Mott says that the steel "drank the sun" from the color he attempted to give it. The oily black stone of Asshai "drinks the light" - is there a connection? Asshai is rumored to be an origin point for dragons predating Valyria (that's in AGOT btw), so perhaps there is a common magic used to make oily stone and V steel swords? Some magic which leaves shadow and darkness? If Martin decided that oily stone is the secret ingredient, then it's very easy to see how that would make sense in retrospect.

If the oily black stone has anything to do with a meteor impact as I theorize, then making swords with the meteorite ore makes even more sense, like a dark version of Dawn. The Bloodstone Emperor lived at the time of Azor AHai according to legend, and he had that black meteor which people here are rightly comparing to the Shining Trapezohedron, meaning that it may well have been used for magical purpose. 

So there you go, plenty of possibilities.