Howdyphillip

NFL 2017 - The Afterdraft

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Posted (edited)

 Yet again, I am impressed with the Dallas Cowboys on draft day. Stephen Jones must have full control of the team now as splashy pics have firmly given way to best players available according to need. I am super impressed all of the way around with almost every single pic, including the later rounds this year. 

OK... you guys can continue talking about those damned, dirty Patriots now. I just wanted to start this thread out talking about the Good Guys...

Edited by Howdyphillip

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Like everything the Niners did.  (With the possible exception of reaching to grab a scruffy long haired farm boy QB in the third.)  This was a weak O Line draft overall so it will be interesting to see if some of the UDFA's they have been connected to could stick.

There was a report that the Niners had signed U.K. center John Toth, but now apparently that's not true.  Would love to see him make the roster.

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2 hours ago, Howdyphillip said:

 Yet again, I am impressed with the Dallas Cowboys on draft day. Stephen Jones must have full control of the team now as splashy pics have firmly given way to best players available according to need. I am super impressed all of the way around with almost every single pic, including the later rounds this year. 

OK... you guys can continue talking about those damned, dirty Patriots now. I just wanted to start this thread out talking about the Good Guys...

You guys got a great pick with Ryan Switzer. He'll be an immediate impact guy. Plus he's from the WV.

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3 hours ago, Rhom said:

Like everything the Niners did.  (With the possible exception of reaching to grab a scruffy long haired farm boy QB in the third.)  This was a weak O Line draft overall so it will be interesting to see if some of the UDFA's they have been connected to could stick.

There was a report that the Niners had signed U.K. center John Toth, but now apparently that's not true.  Would love to see him make the roster.

Me too, although I think you have to attribute the lion's share of that to the Bears helping us out. The defense should improve dramatically. I'm mostly fine with the QB pick (despite not knowing anything about the kid) as they had to start developing somebody. I suppose they could've waited another round to make that pick, but I have some hope that Shanahan can work some magic. 

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Posted (edited)

In the Soooooo predictable department, the Lions, in their infinite anti-wisdom, choose yet another 2nd round slow footed CB. Guy ran a 4.75 in one 40. 

4.75 is fast for a 300 lb lineman in todays NFL, for a CB thats crawling.

I had HS teammates that were quicker than 4.75. Most of them never even went onto NCAA ball let alone go Pro. 4.75 is just too slow, he should fit in wonderfully at Detroit with his other slow teammates!

The Lions did sign a 4.32 40 CB in a later round, I fully expect him to get cut and then go to a real NFL franchise and be very productive.

Seriously a 4.75 40, you cant make this stuff up. Cursed Lions!! 

Heres an 300 lb Offensive Lineman running a 4.65 40.....,,,just for some perspective- 

 

^^ Maybe the NFL has the vid blocked from sharing? Anyways its viewable on YouTube afaik.

 

Edited by DireWolfSpirit

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1 hour ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

In the Soooooo predictable department, the Lions, in their infinite anti-wisdom, choose yet another 2nd round slow footed CB. Guy ran a 4.75 in one 40. 

4.75 is fast for a 300 lb lineman in todays NFL, for a CB thats crawling.

I had HS teammates that were quicker than 4.75. Most of them never even went onto NCAA ball let alone go Pro. 4.75 is just too slow, he should fit in wonderfully at Detroit with his other slow teammates!

The Lions did sign a 4.32 40 CB in a later round, I fully expect him to get cut and then go to a real NFL franchise and be very productive.

Seriously a 4.75 40, you cant make this stuff up. Cursed Lions!! 

Heres an 300 lb Offensive Lineman running a 4.65 40.....,,,just for some perspective- 

 

^^ Maybe the NFL has the vid blocked from sharing? Anyways its viewable on YouTube afaik.

 

You mean the one from Florida whose tape made him a positive first round pick until he ran slow at the event specifically known for causing NFL teams to seriously ignore tape because of what a player can do in a straight line? If the tape is real, y'all got a steal. The risk that is not is why he fell fast enough to possibly be stolen.

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The slow 40 times were on multiple occasions, in other words it wasnt just a fluke, bad sprint. The guy is just really slow for a NFL DB. We'll see in time what kind of a football player he is, but the Lions have loooooong history with trying to fill their defense with too slow DB's and LB's. Hence my nervousness that this is just another in the long line of flat footers. 

 

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2 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

The slow 40 times were on multiple occasions, in other words it wasnt just a fluke, bad sprint. The guy is just really slow for a NFL DB. We'll see in time what kind of a football player he is, but the Lions have loooooong history with trying to fill their defense with too slow DB's and LB's. Hence my nervousness that this is just another in the long line of flat footers. 

 

Him not running well in a track-style sprint is repeatable and not a fluke, yes.  

On film, before he ran, almost every analyst I saw said he was a first rounder.  Y'all spent a late-mid second round pick on a guy with first round talent in everything but speed.  Is there risk?  Yes.  There's also a heck of a lot of potential reward.  I wanted the Cowboys to take him in the second.  He didn't last that wrong, but I still think it's an appropriate pick from a risk/reward standpoint. 

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4 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

The slow 40 times were on multiple occasions, in other words it wasnt just a fluke, bad sprint. The guy is just really slow for a NFL DB. We'll see in time what kind of a football player he is, but the Lions have loooooong history with trying to fill their defense with too slow DB's and LB's. Hence my nervousness that this is just another in the long line of flat footers. 

 

His combine time was ~4.6. That's bad, but it's 'should be a safety instead of a corner' speed, not 'should be a nose tackle instead of a corner' speed.

I don't think that straight line speed will make a cornerback good, but there has to a minimum track speed to be a viable db in the NFL. Unless you're Richard Sherman, your eventually going to have to deal with guys running past you, and even Sherman ran a 4.56 in the combine. You just can't be an NFL corner if receivers can easily outrun you.

Now there's the possibility that he just choked during workouts, but I find that unlikely.

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23 hours ago, Howdyphillip said:

 Yet again, I am impressed with the Dallas Cowboys on draft day. Stephen Jones must have full control of the team now as splashy pics have firmly given way to best players available according to need. I am super impressed all of the way around with almost every single pic, including the later rounds this year. 

OK... you guys can continue talking about those damned, dirty Patriots now. I just wanted to start this thread out talking about the Good Guys...

I agree with you, they seem to be making the picks that make sense now. They needed defense badly, specifically DB's and well, they drafted 4 of them! In the past Jones would have gotten cute and taken a name offensive player instead and ignored need. Hopefully in 2020 we are looking back at this draft and not shaking our heads!

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I think out of Mitch Trubisky, Deshaun Watson, and Pat Mahomes, Mahomes has the best chance of succeeding in the NFL. none of them is an Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning, or John Elway who can succeed no matter how shitty their situation is.

Trubisky is with the Bears, an organization so dysfunctional, top to bottom, that I think we can just write him off. He's off to wherever they sent Gabbert and Ponder, and where they're about to send Goff and Bortles.

Watson is in a better sitiuation, but Bill O'Brien's track record with developing quarterbacks is:

1. turned Hall of Famer Tom Brady into slightly better Hall of Famer

2. Christian Hackenberg

3. held a quarterback competition between Brian Hoyer and Ryan Mallet. Made a big show of choosing Hoyer. When Hoyer had a bad game in the opener, switched to Mallet. Went back and forth for a couple more times that season. Mallet ended up cut, and Hoeyr ended up laying an egg in the playoffs.

4. Brock Osweiler

Mahomes is described as a big armed and athletic, but inaccruate and poorly disciplined. Andy Reid had pretty good success developing a quarterback like that*. He's also really good a running a competent offense. I think this is the perfect sitiuation for a raw but talented QB.

 

*Ok, fine, McNabb was a lot more athletic than Mahomes is.

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I feel like the Redskins 2nd round pick Ryan Anderson pick is a good example of why caring about the draft is so silly.  I wasn't terribly excited about another OLB second round pick after already having a first (Kerrigan) and two second (Murphy, Smith) round OLB picks on the roster.  Plus, a lot of writers seemed to think he was a high energy guy but physically underwhelming, and frankly that describes our OLB core already. 

But I obviously have no idea if he will be good, and if he is, I'm sure I'll happily cheer his name.  And yet, I am disappointed that my team, who have dramatically more information on potential draft picks and roster needs, didn't pick Zach Cunningham instead.  He went 8 picks later to Houston. I of course know virtually nothing about either player, just having watched a few highlights of linebackers that we might draft.  My disappointment is totally silly, I have no idea which of these players will be better.  But nonetheless as a fan of the team and the NFL draft, I couldn't help but feel a bit of a letdown that they didn't go with my preferred pick.

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2 hours ago, White Walker Texas Ranger said:

 He's off to wherever they sent Gabbert and Ponder, and where they're about to send Goff and Bortles.

San Francisco... they send those guys to San Francisco.  I keep telling myself that the league thought Alcatraz is still open and they can stick them in a hole and forget their embarrassment, sadly The Rock is closed and the 49ers put them on the active roster.

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1 hour ago, Rhom said:

San Francisco... they send those guys to San Francisco.  I keep telling myself that the league thought Alcatraz is still open and they can stick them in a hole and forget their embarrassment, sadly The Rock is closed and the 49ers put them on the active roster.

Once that rare item drops they'll be able to take them all and evolve them into a real quarterback

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1 minute ago, Kalbear said:

Once that rare item drops they'll be able to take them all and evolve them into a real quarterback

That's been tried...

Bortles_zpsj1axcmsk.gif

 

/Not Super Effective, as it turns out

 

 

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They need to wait for Gen3

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So far, the rumor mill on undrafted free agents is that the Cowboys are pulling in another haul. With this draft plus 2 high draft picks from last year coming on who spent the year on IR, this defense is going to be formidable I think. If the unit can gel this year, Dallas is going to be a force next season...

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On April 30, 2017 at 11:37 PM, White Walker Texas Ranger said:

His combine time was ~4.6. That's bad, but it's 'should be a safety instead of a corner' speed, not 'should be a nose tackle instead of a corner' speed.

I don't think that straight line speed will make a cornerback good, but there has to a minimum track speed to be a viable db in the NFL. Unless you're Richard Sherman, your eventually going to have to deal with guys running past you, and even Sherman ran a 4.56 in the combine. You just can't be an NFL corner if receivers can easily outrun you.

Now there's the possibility that he just choked during workouts, but I find that unlikely.

He ran a 4.65 and a 4.75 in a earlier workout. 4.75 .........

There was no choking involved, the 4.65 apparently is his good time.

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Posted (edited)

Kind of strange reading pretty unanimously positive reviews from sports analysts for a Browns draft, but I'll take it.  It seems basically everyone lists the Browns among the top five drafts of all thirty-two teams.

Edited by briantw

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Niners got Cannon, who some people I respect think has a shot as a 3-4 branch X niche guy.

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