Maester Saramello Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 What never made sense to me: Kings Landing is the largest city in Westeros. Before the Battle of the Black Water, the Lannisters were in need of every man they could get. They had 6,000 Gold Cloaks, but that is still a small number, and because the small number of 6,000 vs Stannis' 20k, its understandable they would run as they did. However, Kings Landing has 500,000 people! 250,000 of them are men. 100,000 are likely men able to fight. Instead of having them fight agains the king like in the Riot of King's Landing, why not get them to fight for the king(Joffrey I mean) with promise of bread? Draft 20-30k, equip them lightly, and have them all fight Stannis! Joffrey could have raised a host of 25k(1/20th of the city population) who are likely doing nothing but rotting in the streets at the moment, to travel up to the Trident and screw crap up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion of the West Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 Suppose that Joffrey could have done so but when considering the use of the levies Ser Eustace Osgrey raised against Lady Webber I'm inclined to think that such a mass levy would be of little use against Stannis' men-at-arms and knights and that the levy would break before long. Certainly before they could bring their numbers to bear on Stannis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damon_Tor Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 Because defending a fortified position is about creating and abusing bottlenecks. You give 100,000 random men pointy sticks and then you... you what? You crowd them all on top of the walls of King's Landing and get in the way of the guys in charge of keeping the archers equipped with arrows? You want those guys getting in between of the pots of boiling oil and the murder holes that oil needs to be poured down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maester Saramello Posted May 10, 2017 Author Share Posted May 10, 2017 1 hour ago, Damon_Tor said: Because defending a fortified position is about creating and abusing bottlenecks. You give 100,000 random men pointy sticks and then you... you what? You crowd them all on top of the walls of King's Landing and get in the way of the guys in charge of keeping the archers equipped with arrows? You want those guys getting in between of the pots of boiling oil and the murder holes that oil needs to be poured down? You are right about this. I am talking offensively. What if they were to gather 30k and send them to the riverlands to loot and pillage and lower the moral of the young wolf? This would free up more experienced levies to fight in battles and remove 30k mouths to feed and revolt at Kings Landing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damon_Tor Posted May 10, 2017 Share Posted May 10, 2017 4 hours ago, Maester Saramello said: You are right about this. I am talking offensively. What if they were to gather 30k and send them to the riverlands to loot and pillage and lower the moral of the young wolf? This would free up more experienced levies to fight in battles and remove 30k mouths to feed and revolt at Kings Landing. Well the simple answer is "because they wouldn't want to go". Those men wouldn't want to leave the safety and supplies of King's Landing to go out and fight, which means to get them to go out they would have to FORCE them to, and as you note there are only 6,000 goldcloaks. They try to conscript the people of King's Landing and all that would happen is that the revolt you're talking about would just come sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maester Saramello Posted May 11, 2017 Author Share Posted May 11, 2017 Fair point. But would they prefer to starve surely and slowly or fight with a full belly and have just a 1/5 chance of death? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvo the Crow Posted May 11, 2017 Share Posted May 11, 2017 On Invalid Date at 1:32 AM, Maester Saramello said: What never made sense to me: Kings Landing is the largest city in Westeros. Before the Battle of the Black Water, the Lannisters were in need of every man they could get. They had 6,000 Gold Cloaks, but that is still a small number, and because the small number of 6,000 vs Stannis' 20k, its understandable they would run as they did. However, Kings Landing has 500,000 people! 250,000 of them are men. 100,000 are likely men able to fight. Instead of having them fight agains the king like in the Riot of King's Landing, why not get them to fight for the king(Joffrey I mean) with promise of bread? Draft 20-30k, equip them lightly, and have them all fight Stannis! Joffrey could have raised a host of 25k(1/20th of the city population) who are likely doing nothing but rotting in the streets at the moment, to travel up to the Trident and screw crap up! Cause they couldn't. Tyrion tried to recruit as many as he could, with the promise of bread, and that was the number he got. Also after some time he wouldn't even be able to make use of the recruited man; all the blacksmiths were working on the byzantine chain so no one to make arms and armor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyg Doggett Posted May 11, 2017 Share Posted May 11, 2017 Such men would be smashed by any real army. In the Riverlands, the BwB or the Brave Companions would ambush them. The survivors would become broken men. Also, the Lannisters would be even more unpopulars inside the city if they sent a lot of people to fight and die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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