U.S. Politics-Getting a Handel On Why the DNC Is Pissing Ossof

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

1 hour ago, Zorral said:

This is an astounding medianic moment:

President Trump’s Lies, the Definitive List

 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/06/23/opinion/trumps-lies.html

 

 

Good stuff. What's amazing to me is how this guy has any credibility left, even with his base.It's really unbelievable at this point.

[Altherion]

3 hours ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said:

Good stuff. What's amazing to me is how this guy has any credibility left, even with his base.It's really unbelievable at this point.

Most of his base do not read the New York Times and would most likely take political positions assumed by it as evidence of the contrary. The rest are not sufficiently naive to assume that their politicians are always truthful.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

26 minutes ago, Altherion said:

Most of his base do not read the New York Times and would most likely take political positions assumed by it as evidence of the contrary. The rest are not sufficiently naive to assume that their politicians are always truthful.

But this is not confined to the contents of this article. Many of these instances have been covered by numerous outlets. 

The second is a ridiculous attempt at reductionism that does not hold water. Yes, politicians lie, but no successful politician has ever lied like this. Both in quantity and in quality. By quality I mean in that the level to which his supporters buy into his bullshit. 

[Dr. Pepper]

Cosmo article about women scientists running for office. 

Quote

Since Trump took office, the normally apolitical scientific community has risen up in opposition to his administration. In April, thousands converged in Washington for the March for Science, and many more protested at satellite events around the world. Since January, the science activism nonprofit 314 Action — which is named for the first three digits of mathematical constant pi — has recruited more than 5,000 scientists interested in running for office. They expect to launch eight congressional campaigns this cycle, and hundreds more at the state and local levels.

"There has been more of a push for scientific thinkers, and even active scientists, to get more engaged politically, whether that means running for office or just being more outspoken than they were historically," says Cara Santa Maria, a science journalist who spoke at the Washington March for Science. "We're living in a post-truth era, as they say, and so I think a lot of scientific thinkers are realizing how important it is to stand up for evidence."

 

 

[LongRider]

Sen. Dean Heller, NV coming out strongly as a 'no' vote, if Wealthcare fails, he won't be the deciding vote.  Still, Heller can be flipped of course, so we'll see.  Coming out as a 'no' with Gov. Sandoval at his side is pretty interesting.  Sandoval brought Obamacare with Medicaid expansion to Nevada and it was sorely needed.  But it ain't over till it's over.

Quote

Widely considered a key swing vote in Republican efforts to replace the Affordable Care Act, Sen. Dean Heller said Friday that he cannot support a recently released Senate revision to the health care law as written.

Flanked by fellow Republican Gov. Brian Sandoval, Heller said at a Las Vegas press conference that the Senate’s version of a replacement for the federal health insurance law, which could come up for a vote as soon as next week, was unpalatable for him and for the state.

“It’s simply not the answer,” he said.

Senate Republicans on Thursday unveiled their long-awaited revision of legislation to replace the previous administration’s signature domestic policy achievement, despite widespread skepticism and concern that it could leave millions of people without health insurance.

Chief among Sandoval and Heller’s concerns with the bill is a rollback of expanded eligibility for Medicaid starting in 2021 and ending in 2024. More than 276,000 Nevadans have gained health insurance since Sandoval expanded the entitlement program in 2014, which has helped the state’s uninsured rate drop by nearly 40 percent.

On the other hand, Gov. Sandoval vetoed the 'Sprinklecare' bill Medicare expansion bill.

Quote

Gov. Brian Sandoval scuttled a plan that would have allowed anyone in the state to buy into a Medicaid-like system of health insurance that had attracted national attention as the first of its kind.

With the stroke of his pen, the governor also vetoed an ambitious measure that would have raised the state’s renewable energy production standards, just hours before a constitutionally-set deadline where all unsigned bills automatically become law. Sandoval vetoed a total of 41 bills throughout and after the legislative session, the highest in his seven years as governor.

 

[drawkcabi]

1 hour ago, Nasty LongRider said:

Sen. Dean Heller, NV coming out strongly as a 'no' vote, if Wealthcare fails, he won't be the deciding vote.  Still, Heller can be flipped of course, so we'll see.  Coming out as a 'no' with Gov. Sandoval at his side is pretty interesting.  Sandoval brought Obamacare with Medicaid expansion to Nevada and it was sorely needed.  But it ain't over till it's over.

On the other hand, Gov. Sandoval vetoed the 'Sprinklecare' bill Medicare expansion bill.

 

Did you coin "Wealthcare" or did you see it somewhere else, from someone else? Because I think it's brilliant. Forget about Trumpcare it won't sink into most voters brains beyond being a copycat of Obamacare while Wealthcare is the perfect thing to call it and like the GOP pushing the ACA as "Obamacare, it may be the best chance to deride it and have it stick as a bad thing in the mind of any voter who could be susceptible to being against it and make those somewhat against it strongly against it.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

11 minutes ago, drawkcabi said:

Did you coin "Wealthcare" or did you see it somewhere else, from someone else? Because I think it's brilliant. Forget about Trumpcare it won't sink into most voters brains beyond being a copycat of Obamacare while Wealthcare is the perfect thing to call it and like the GOP pushing the ACA as "Obamacare, it may be the best chance to deride it and have it stick as a bad thing in the mind of any voter who could be susceptible to being against it and make those somewhat against it strongly against it.

Agreed, Wealthcare is the perfect name for it. That said it would be nice to tie both Trump and McConnell's name to this abortion. Trumpy and the Turtle's Wealthcare?

[Kalbear]

1 hour ago, Nasty LongRider said:

Sen. Dean Heller, NV coming out strongly as a 'no' vote, if Wealthcare fails, he won't be the deciding vote.  Still, Heller can be flipped of course, so we'll see.  Coming out as a 'no' with Gov. Sandoval at his side is pretty interesting.  Sandoval brought Obamacare with Medicaid expansion to Nevada and it was sorely needed.  But it ain't over till it's over.

My take on this is that Heller, being in a vulnerable seat and a moderate one, took one of the two 'no' slots for this bill and did so early. He's not going to flip, and McConnell is okay with that. This way Heller can say he always opposed it as early as he could and not be slammed for it later.

It's interesting that McConnell is putting pressure on the women to cave in this case. For a lot of reasons.

[Fez]

5 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

My take on this is that Heller, being in a vulnerable seat and a moderate one, took one of the two 'no' slots for this bill and did so early. He's not going to flip, and McConnell is okay with that. This way Heller can say he always opposed it as early as he could and not be slammed for it later.

It's interesting that McConnell is putting pressure on the women to cave in this case. For a lot of reasons.

Heller is the only Republican senator up for election in 2018 in a state Clinton; so it makes sense for McConnell to try to protect him as much as possible.

But it does make his math much harder. Especially if reconcilaton rules force large unforeseen changes to the bill. Still unclear to what extent that will happen tbough.

[Kalbear]

Just now, Fez said:

Heller is the only Republican senator up for election in 2018 in a state Clinton; so it makes sense for McConnell to try to protect him as much as possible.

But it does make his math much harder. Especially if reconcilaton rules force large unforeseen changes to the bill. Still unclear to what extent that will happen tbough.

Eh, the math is harder but not all that much harder, and he always had 2 slots that he could give up. Giving it to Heller makes the most sense overall, as well as being able to say fuck you to Collins and Murkowski. 

The 4 extreme conservatives are saying no entirely for show/get more conservative, just like the House did. The bet is that if the bill goes more conservative the moderates will cave, and it's hard to think that they won't if they're the ones that are responsible for the bill's failure. The same thing happened with DeVos. It'll probably look precisely like that, as well. 

[LongRider]

36 minutes ago, drawkcabi said:

Did you coin "Wealthcare" or did you see it somewhere else, from someone else?

Wealthcare is something I've seen around and it's a good moniker.  So is this meme from NBC?WSJ The Senate GOP health care bill doesn’t repeal Obamacare; it replaces Medicaid  from here;  although I wouldn't say it 'replaces' Medicaid, more like it kills Medicaid.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/first-read/nbc-wsj-poll-it-s-trump-s-base-against-everyone-n775931

[Kalbear]

I don't like wealthcare because while it's clever, it doesn't associate it with Trump. 

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

12 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

I don't like wealthcare because while it's clever, it doesn't associate it with Trump. 

That's mean. It's just too mean. This just might be the greatest meanest thing I've ever seen in print.

[Zorral]

10 hours ago, Altherion said:

Most of his base do not read the New York Times and would most likely take political positions assumed by it as evidence of the contrary. The rest are not sufficiently naive to assume that their politicians are always truthful.

That does kind of bring to mind those who not liking what is going on cover their eyes and ears and say, I can't see you can't hear you and thereby think they've changed reality.

No POTUS  has ever done the change reality by changing words -- not even Reagan's admin who were the first to turn that into a front-line strategy -- what this deranged monster does.  There is no effective governance in this, which is probably exactly what those for whom he's a front expected, paid for and want, while behind all his deranged flimflammary They do what They have always wanted to do -- bring down the federal government and the constitution.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

Who knew Healthcare could be so mean? 

[LongRider]

1 hour ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said:

Who knew Healthcare could be so mean? 

It's the median, not the mean that counts tho, eh?

[DMC]

2 hours ago, Kalbear said:

The same thing happened with DeVos. It'll probably look precisely like that, as well.

While you may be right overall, I don't think it's really valid to compare a bill like this to a confirmation vote on the Education Secretary.  And both Collins and Murkowski voted against DeVos.

[OldGimletEye]

2 hours ago, Nasty LongRider said:

Wealthcare is something I've seen around and it's a good moniker.  So is this meme from NBC?WSJ The Senate GOP health care bill doesn’t repeal Obamacare; it replaces Medicaid  from here;  although I wouldn't say it 'replaces' Medicaid, more like it kills Medicaid.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/first-read/nbc-wsj-poll-it-s-trump-s-base-against-everyone-n775931

I have a suggested name for "Trump's base". I'd call it "The Republican Party".

[OldGimletEye]

Also, Iove how the "Party of Bidness" gets a 7 point lead in "dealing with economy". Based on what evidence? The Bush Boom? The Brownback boom? The way Reagen did it?

Anyone?

Bueller? Bueller?

[LongRider]

1 minute ago, OldGimletEye said:

Also, Iove how the "Party of Bidness" gets a 7 point lead in "dealing with economy". Based on what evidence? The Bush Boom? The Brownback boom? The way Reagen did it?

Anyone?

Bueller? Bueller?

When the Party 'O Bidnezz deals with the 'economy' even the plebes notice.  Sure, we're losing our houses and jobs, but we do notice.