UK Politics - summer edition

[SeanF]

17 hours ago, williamjm said:

Even if she considers protecting her minority more important than the principle of protecting women from harassment she could at least fire Garnier as a minister or even withdraw the party whip from him without endangering her minority (he's probably unlikely to start voting against the government), so those would be the least she could do.

It's usually easier to keep people inside the tent pissing out, rather than the reverse.  People who have the whip withdrawn can't be relied on to turn up, even if they don't vote against you.

I must say, I wish I had an unredacted copy of the list in today's Times.  I wonder who the MP is who was urinated on by three men.

[polishgenius]

6 minutes ago, SeanF said:

I must say, I wish I had an unredacted copy of the list in today's Times.  I wonder who the MP is who was urinated on by three men.

 

 

The list is online, but I wish it wasn't, because while weird, that's really nothing of the public's business. It's clearly a list someone's had of 'things we need to be aware might break in the press/our MPs might get blackmailed over' that they've cleverly allowed to break in the press, of which the actual dodgy stuff about inappropriate behaviour is only a part.

[SeanF]

11 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

 

 

The list is online, but I wish it wasn't, because while weird, that's really nothing of the public's business. It's clearly a list someone's had of 'things we need to be aware might break in the press/our MPs might get blackmailed over' that they've cleverly allowed to break in the press, of which the actual dodgy stuff about inappropriate behaviour is only a part.

It's probably been compiled by the Whips' Office, so that they have a hold on MPs.

[HexMachina]

More stuff, this time from the Labour Party;

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/bex-bailey-rape-labour-activist-party-event-nec-members-not-report-told-sexual-harassment-assault-a8029941.html

Quote

Speaking to BBC Radio 4’s PM show, Ms Bailey said that the attack on her when she was 19 years old was not carried out by a Labour MP, but was committed by someone more senior to her in the party.

She said: “I was seriously sexually assaulted at a Labour party event by – it wasn’t an MP – but someone who was more senior to me.

“It took me a while to summon up the courage to tell anyone in the party, but when I did, I told a senior member of staff who told me...it was suggested to me that I not report it.

“I was told that if I did it might damage me.”

Asked later in the interview how serious the assault was, she said: “I was raped.”

 

[Werthead]

Theresa May being asked at PMQs why she didn't act on reports 3 years ago that party whips were hoarding sexual misconduct allegations to use as blackmail material. She spluttered and made some noise about how people could have gone to the police (and lost their jobs). A lukewarm response.

[mormont]

Just what the story was lacking, a high-profile casualty.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41838682

Quote

Defence Secretary Sir Michael Fallon has resigned following allegations of past behaviour, the BBC has been told.
He said his behaviour in the past may have "fallen short" of the standards expected by the UK military.

 

[Slick Mongoose]

I didn't see that coming. Is it the hand-on-knee thing, or is there worse coming out?

[Liffguard]

Quote

Defence Secretary Sir Michael Fallon has resigned following allegations of past behaviour, the BBC has been told.
He said his behaviour in the past may have "fallen short" of the standards expected by the UK military.

I dunno, sexual harrassment and sexual assault? Far from falling short, it seems like he's keeping up with a long and proud tradition.

[Which Tyler]

NB, retired from the cabinet, not from parliament - can't risk that "majority"

[Werthead]

2 hours ago, Slick Mongoose said:

I didn't see that coming. Is it the hand-on-knee thing, or is there worse coming out?

I think it was Fallon looking around him and going, "Oh hang on, I can use this to get out of this chicken shit outfit" and running, laughing hysterically, out of the cabinet as fast as he could go.

That also seems to be the conclusion of the "offended" journalist (who wasn't really offended in the first place).

[williamjm]

3 hours ago, Slick Mongoose said:

I didn't see that coming. Is it the hand-on-knee thing, or is there worse coming out?

The way he phrased the resignation seems purposefully vague, he says 'many of the allegations' have been false but that's quite different to saying 'all' or 'all but one' of the allegations are false.

[mormont]

7 hours ago, williamjm said:

The way he phrased the resignation seems purposefully vague, he says 'many of the allegations' have been false but that's quite different to saying 'all' or 'all but one' of the allegations are false.

It's a very peculiar letter. For one thing, it's not clear what 'the high standards that we expect of the Armed Forces' have to do with it. At first I thought Fallon had some sort of military background, but he doesn't appear to. OK, he's the Defence Secretary. But the Defence Secretary is not part of the Armed Forces, and it would be weird to say that a politician has to meet the professional standards of the people he's in charge of. Jeremy Hunt would be in real trouble, for a start.

Then there's the 'many of these have been false', which as you say appears purposefully vague. It's not even clear whether he's referring to allegations about himself or someone else, since he references both in the previous sentence.

[Maltaran]

The new Defence Secretary has been announced - Gavin Williamson is being moved sideways from Chief Whip. This is the guy who keeps a pet tarantula in his office, which is about all I know of him.

[SeanF]

• 4 hours ago, mormont said:

  It's a very peculiar letter. For one thing, it's not clear what 'the high standards that we expect of the Armed Forces' have to do with it. At first I thought Fallon had some sort of military background, but he doesn't appear to. OK, he's the Defence Secretary. But the Defence Secretary is not part of the Armed Forces, and it would be weird to say that a politician has to meet the professional standards of the people he's in charge of. Jeremy Hunt would be in real trouble, for a start.

  Then there's the 'many of these have been false', which as you say appears purposefully vague. It's not even clear whether he's referring to allegations about himself or someone else, since he references both in the previous sentence.

  Soldiers and sailors are not noted for their chastity.  It is an odd statement.

   

  15 hours ago, Slick Mongoose said:

  I didn't see that coming. Is it the hand-on-knee thing, or is there worse coming out?

  I can only assume that there are additional, well-founded allegations.  Resigning over a minor incident from 15 years ago would be absurd.

   

  20 hours ago, Werthead said:

  Theresa May being asked at PMQs why she didn't act on reports 3 years ago that party whips were hoarding sexual misconduct allegations to use as blackmail material. She spluttered and made some noise about how people could have gone to the police (and lost their jobs). A lukewarm response.

  The questions three years ago related to historic child sex abuse allegations (it's alleged that in the past, whips used to keep paedophile MP's in line by threatening to release information about their activities) so not really relevant to the current allegations.  I don't doubt though, that party whips do know where bodies are buried, and use that information as leverage over MPs.

[Werthead]

43 minutes ago, Maltaran said:

The new Defence Secretary has been announced - Gavin Williamson is being moved sideways from Chief Whip. This is the guy who keeps a pet tarantula in his office, which is about all I know of him.

The BBC is reporting insiders from cabinet (or the cabinet office) that "he appointed himself" and May was unwilling to stop him. That's bizarre.

[Slick Mongoose]

Wouldn't being chief whip make him the most likely person to have gathered all this dirt in the first place?

[williamjm]

12 hours ago, mormont said:

Then there's the 'many of these have been false', which as you say appears purposefully vague. It's not even clear whether he's referring to allegations about himself or someone else, since he references both in the previous sentence.

I seem to remember Harvey Weinstein issuing a similar sort of purposefully vague statement that admitted some carefully unspecified wrongdoing.

8 hours ago, SeanF said:

• I can only assume that there are additional, well-founded allegations.  Resigning over a minor incident from 15 years ago would be absurd.

I doubt May would have wanted him to resign if that was the only allegation, given that Garnier still has a job despite allegations that sound more serious.

7 hours ago, Slick Mongoose said:

Wouldn't being chief whip make him the most likely person to have gathered all this dirt in the first place?

I suppose it might depend whether he was a whip at the time the dirt was gathered, but it is a bit odd that the person in charge of party discipline gets promoted during a crisis about the behaviour of MPs.

[mormont]

1 hour ago, williamjm said:

I doubt May would have wanted him to resign if that was the only allegation, given that Garnier still has a job despite allegations that sound more serious.

If I may put on my Machiavellian conspiracy hat for a second... if I had a guy like Garnier that I had to sack, but knew that he would object and some of his backbench colleagues would too: and if I also had an ally who was willing to fall on his sword for something similar but less serious: then I might well encourage that ally to do so, and in so doing set the bar, maybe?

Unlikely. Probably there are just more skeletons in Fallon's closet than has been revealed.

1 hour ago, williamjm said:

I suppose it might depend whether he was a whip at the time the dirt was gathered, but it is a bit odd that the person in charge of party discipline gets promoted during a crisis about the behaviour of MPs.

You could argue that at least he's unlikely to be blackmailed by someone in the party. But he's certainly not been a popular pick. Another misstep by May, it looks like.

[williamjm]

11 minutes ago, mormont said:

If I may put on my Machiavellian conspiracy hat for a second... if I had a guy like Garnier that I had to sack, but knew that he would object and some of his backbench colleagues would too: and if I also had an ally who was willing to fall on his sword for something similar but less serious: then I might well encourage that ally to do so, and in so doing set the bar, maybe?

If we're going for a fantastical Machiavellian conspiracy, what if your theory is correct but the target isn't someone relatively obscure like Garnier but instead a more senior cabinet colleague who has been openly causing trouble to advance his own leadership ambitions and has always seemed to be on the verge of being embroiled in a sex scandal?

[mormont]

3 minutes ago, williamjm said:

If we're going for a fantastical Machiavellian conspiracy, what if your theory is correct but the target isn't someone relatively obscure like Garnier but instead a more senior cabinet colleague who has been openly causing trouble to advance his own leadership ambitions and has always seemed to be on the verge of being embroiled in a sex scandal?

Boris has already had a sex scandal or two. I wouldn't wonder if he turned out to be immune to further damage.