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Marvel Cinematic General Discussion 7


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2 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

I don't think it's accurate to say "dumb". He did outsmart Loki. This version of Thor comes across to me like a less conceited, self-centered and vulgar version of Archer.

I just mean dumb in that he often says stupid things and is the subject of a lot of physical comedy, like when he throws the ball at the window and it bounces back and hits him right in the face.  

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1 hour ago, briantw said:

I just found Thor 2 to be forgettable.  It wasn't bad or anything.  Just nothing special.

Iron Man 3 I thought was outright bad.

I enjoyed Ant-Man.  Thought it was enjoyable and funny.  Not a great film, but certainly not bad.

Age of Ultron was all right.  It was just too similar to the first Avengers and it obviously wasn't as good as its predecessor.  

So yeah...I'd probably take Iron Man 3 as the last bad one.  There were a few underwhelming ones after that, but nothing that was as bad as Iron Man 3.

That sums up my feelings as well... IM3 just didn;t do it for me... the kid was just awful... and the Mandarin swerve pissed me off...

I had similar feelings about Thor 2... except no dumb swerve at the end... just a a dumb crazy selvig sub plot and a bad villain...

Unlike a lot of people.... I liked Ultron... it wasn;t a masterpiece... but it had a lot of moving parts...

Ant Man was a lot better than i thought it would be... they were smart enough to keep the scope small... and turn it into a heist film... and Michael Pena was just great

For me, the Captain America movies have been the best series thus far... Although I'll put Ragnarok right up there with Winter Soldier for my favorite Marvel flick 

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1 hour ago, briantw said:

I just mean dumb in that he often says stupid things and is the subject of a lot of physical comedy, like when he throws the ball at the window and it bounces back and hits him right in the face.  


'Goofy' might perhaps be a word closer to what you're looking for?

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2 minutes ago, Martini Sigil said:

That sums up my feelings as well... IM3 just didn;t do it for me... the kid was just awful... and the Mandarin swerve pissed me off...

I had similar feelings about Thor 2... except no dumb swerve at the end... just a a dumb crazy selvig sub plot and a bad villain...

Unlike a lot of people.... I liked Ultron... it wasn;t a masterpiece... but it had a lot of moving parts...

Ant Man was a lot better than i thought it would be... they were smart enough to keep the scope small... and turn it into a heist film... and Michael Pena was just great

For me, the Captain America movies have been the best series thus far... Although I'll put Ragnarok right up there with Winter Soldier for my favorite Marvel flick 

Yeah I'd agree with most of this.

Looking back I think Iron Man 3 probably was quite a bad movie, despite the absolute hype it got at the time of being some sort of masterpiece simply due to who wrote and directed it. I think actually it was in some ways quite a brave movie, the way it decided to make a lot of it about Tony without the suit. But it was hugely let down by its last section ( the dumb iron suit brawl) and a pretty damn uninspiring villain. In fact I loved the Mandarin twist, it was really cool and Ben Kingsley was excellent when he was revealed to be just an actor. But that the real villain was so dull was a big failure and he needed to be a lot more interesting. 

I also liked Ant Man quite a bit, it was often quite funny, but probably not good enough to bother rewatching.

 

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6 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

'Goofy' might perhaps be a word closer to what you're looking for?

Yeah that would work.  I just go with dumb Thor.  Either way, I enjoy that portrayal of the character.  It fits within the mythological origins of the character and also meshes well with turning Thor into a comic relief character, and I think that's an effective use of the character within the greater Marvel universe.

I think it works because it's a lovable stupidity rather than a frustrating one.

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However people feel about the Mandarin swerve in IM3, it is a very cunning plan for misdirection, and because of that I liked it. Could they have made it work if Ben Kingsley was the actual Mandarin and Killian was the enforcer / captain of the troops? Probably. Not sure it would have made a better movie. And It was a great vehicle for humour in the movie.

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Quote

What was the last bad Marvel movie?  Iron Man 3?

 

I don't think any of the Marvel movies have been "bad" in the sense of being unwatchably awful or actually shit, like Man of Steel and Batman vs. Superman. The worst of them - Iron Man 2 and 3 - are just deeply mediocre, I think. The flipside of that is that absolutely none of them have been stand-out classics (although Guardians of the Galaxy might have a shot at being this generation's Ghostbusters in terms of mixing comedy and action, but we'll have to see how it ages). They're a little too disposable for that, I think.

 

 

 

 

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On 12/3/2017 at 1:44 AM, RumHam said:

I'm not sure this is true. As I said before Marvel has released trailers with altered or misleading scenes before. It would be a simple thing to CGI in other stones to the glove. Also I thought the scene where he has the two stones was not on Earth. In the leaked comic-con footage doesn't he

  Reveal hidden contents

pulls one of the planet's multiple moons down to the planet? I've seen speculation that that all takes place on a devostated Xandar 

Perhaps, but I would think a trailer should CGI out the power stone and leave the reality stone in. Nabbing the reality stone off the collector is less interesting than taking out the Nova Corps to get the power stone. So it's less spoilery to show the reality stone and keep the power stone hidden. But they left the power stone there to tell us all that the Nova Crops has been taken down.

Of course that means they cheaped out with showing how he got the power stone by having it in the trailer, and people will be like, OK we only need a 20 second flash back to give us the Cliff's notes version. We already knew Loki handed over the space stone, but what's important about it is not that Loki handed it over, but what is Loki's motivation in handing it over, and what he does after handing it over.

I guess it is right for the movie to almost exclusively focus on telling the story around Thanos' quest to acquire the 3 stones that are on Earth, or rather the two stones we know are on Earth and the soul stone which no one has seen...yet.

I was watching a Youtube about the soul stone. It said the soul stone is unique among the stones in that it is, or is a portal to, a pocket dimension. In the context of it probably being in Wakanda, and showing up in Black Panther possibly, this could be represented by the soul stone being the means by which Black Panthers can communicate with and call upon past Black Panthers.

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So we've learned the way to happiness is to not demand that villains meet a specific set of expectations for villainy.   Just let the movie entertain you as what it is.   For example, lots of moments in Ironman 3 really shine and the rest of the smaller moments are still fun.   And still to this day the greatest threat they've ever faced was in Thor 2.    The Ironman where he fought some guy from within his own company was the worst because that guy was such a butt for no real reason.  Was that movie meant to reinforce the democrat belief that  businessmen are the devil?   Whatever.

 There's a real Mandarin out there somewhere, but they needed to introduce magic first via Dr.Strange, not waste that reveal on a magic vs. metal showdown it wasn't time for yet.  And apparently China won't let you caste a bad guy Asian if you want the full # of movie screens they offer if they like your portrayal.

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9 hours ago, The Mother of The Others said:

So we've learned the way to happiness is to not demand that villains meet a specific set of expectations for villainy.   Just let the movie entertain you as what it is.   For example, lots of moments in Ironman 3 really shine and the rest of the smaller moments are still fun.   And still to this day the greatest threat they've ever faced was in Thor 2.    The Ironman where he fought some guy from within his own company was the worst because that guy was such a butt for no real reason.  Was that movie meant to reinforce the democrat belief that  businessmen are the devil?   Whatever.

 There's a real Mandarin out there somewhere, but they needed to introduce magic first via Dr.Strange, not waste that reveal on a magic vs. metal showdown it wasn't time for yet.  And apparently China won't let you caste a bad guy Asian if you want the full # of movie screens they offer if they like your portrayal.

I prefer my superhero movies to not have things that are true in real life.

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Something that got talked about back when GotG was released, but I haven't seen discussed about the trailer: is anyone else still worried that Thanos is gonna be a bit underwhelming? We don't see him speak, or emote at all. We see him punch Iron Man, that's about it. Other than his ambition of owning these things we've been told are super powerful, I'm not really hyped about him as a villain. I'm sure I'll still love the movie though.

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Just now, DaveSumm said:

Something that got talked about back when GotG was released, but I haven't seen discussed about the trailer: is anyone else still worried that Thanos is gonna be a bit underwhelming? We don't see him speak, or emote at all. We see him punch Iron Man, that's about it. Other than his ambition of owning these things we've been told are super powerful, I'm not really hyped about him as a villain. I'm sure I'll still love the movie though.

As a non-comic reader I've yet to find Thanos even remotely interesting in his brief appearances so far in the movies. I'm hoping that will change when he's the main focus of the film, but Marvel's track record of delivering interesting movie villains isn't great.

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10 hours ago, DaveSumm said:

Something that got talked about back when GotG was released, but I haven't seen discussed about the trailer: is anyone else still worried that Thanos is gonna be a bit underwhelming? We don't see him speak, or emote at all. We see him punch Iron Man, that's about it. Other than his ambition of owning these things we've been told are super powerful, I'm not really hyped about him as a villain. I'm sure I'll still love the movie though.

I would say they still have a lot of polish to put on Thanos' facial animations, they will probably still be polishing it until nearly the day before release. So not terribly surprising the trailer didn't contain any substantial facial animation. Thanos' motivations need to be reasonably fleshed out in this movie, we don't know why Thanos wants to forge the Infinity Gauntlet, and it would be pretty weird to introduce the Lady Death love plot this late in the game. They also can't substitue with Hela, because Thanos was intent on the gauntlet well before Hela showed up. Becoming master of the universe seems really lame and cliche. I hope "bringing balance to the universe" has an interesting explanation and motivation behind it.

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The Guardians comic played with him being the avatar of death. Life and Death are actual cosmic forces, in balance. So they might do something with that?

In terms of his strength as a villain, having the Black Order there, should help him. Giving him recognisable minions, and not just a faceless horde.

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Funny, but I noticed quite a bit of subtle facial movement during his closeup as he surveyed the scene. Amusement, threatening smirk, determination, air or superiority. Brief, yes, but not non-existent.

Hey, he emoted more in the trailer than Steppenwolf did the whole JL movie. ;)

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5 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

we don't know why Thanos wants to forge the Infinity Gauntlet, and it would be pretty weird to introduce the Lady Death love plot this late in the game.



They introduced the Lady Death plot in his very first scene; it just didn't mean anything to anyone who didn't already know what it is.

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4 hours ago, polishgenius said:



They introduced the Lady Death plot in his very first scene; it just didn't mean anything to anyone who didn't already know what it is.

Yeah, that definitely passed me by. Can you explain?

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Just now, The Anti-Targ said:

Yeah, that definitely passed me by. Can you explain?


Basically, in the comics, Thanos is literally in love with the embodiment of Death, and in his early apperances is essentially comitting his evil deeds in order to impress her.
So when the Chitauri emissary kneels in front of him at the end of Avengers and declares that humans 'are unruly and therefore cannot be ruled. To attack them is to court Death', that's not a warning, that's a plan of action, and Thanos' big grin in response says it all.

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2 minutes ago, polishgenius said:


Basically, in the comics, Thanos is literally in love with the embodiment of Death, and in his early apperances is essentially comitting his evil deeds in order to impress her.
So when the Chitauri emissary kneels in front of him at the end of Avengers and declares that humans 'are unruly and therefore cannot be ruled. To attack them is to court Death', that's not a warning, that's a plan of action, and Thanos' big grin in response says it all.

It's a pity when people talk we can't see if they are capitalising nouns. I always interpretted the grin as "We'll see who can't be ruled." But the grin of courting lady Death also makes sense.

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