Jump to content

Marvel Cinematic General Discussion 7


Calibandar

Recommended Posts

8 minutes ago, The BlackBear said:

I don't think de-aging would work on film. And it doesn;t make too much sense to have an 80 year old Magneto rocking around. So time-travel him and company from the past/alternate dimension (where Mutants are a thing.) Sort of like they did with the All-New X-Men.

But really I don't want them in the MCU. They work best left to their own devices. Plus being apart gave us the gory, sweary, Deadpool; bloody, misanthropic, Logan; and New Mutants (that is looking like a horror film.) I don't see us getting those films with Disney. So I'd love Disney to keep them separate (if this deal goes through,) but they won't.

I agree, X-men tend to exist in this universe where people are born with superpowers and are treated as freaks and outcasts.. and yet you put them in the same universe as spiderman and Captain America who are treated as heroes, then it becomes quite inconsistent. I would rather they stayed apart and had their own stories. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Eggegg said:

I agree, X-men tend to exist in this universe where people are born with superpowers and are treated as freaks and outcasts.. and yet you put them in the same universe as spiderman and Captain America who are treated as heroes, then it becomes quite inconsistent. I would rather they stayed apart and had their own stories. 

Just gonna say Spider-man really isn't viewed by everyone as a hero.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Myrddin said:

As for Magneto, I wonder if there is someway to shift his character out of WWII Holocaust origins, purely from an age factor of him needing to be 90+ years old. I'm not looking to stir controversy by removing his Jewish heritage or anything. Just thinking through the logistics of having Magneto be active in 2020 when he survived a concentration camp in 1945. 

Could use some bullshit explanation about how his mutant powers have made him age slower than a normal human.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, briantw said:

Could use some bullshit explanation about how his mutant powers have made him age slower than a normal human.

There is a long and storied history of giving Magneto random powers 'because magnetism, that's why'. When Stan was still writing, magnetism and/or transistors could do anything.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I suppose I'd believe a 45 seconds long de- aging clip of having an old man with oxygen tank wheeled into one of those crystal shops in New Mexico's mystic tourism towns, then having his "caretaker" point out one particular set of geodes that crystalized around some radioactive material from the bomb test sites, some metal, you know, then show him cocooned into a huge geode of the stuff a few days later, like it's coursing through his system remaking him as it goes, magnetic anti- oxidents on a scale that would be the envy of every diet supplement pill store in the land.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 hours ago, briantw said:

Wasn't Bale demanding the kind of money that Robert Downey Jr. makes for his Marvel films?  I mean, I thought Bale was a fine Batman, but he's not bringing in viewers like RDJ does for Marvel, and thus he shouldn't be compensated in a similar manner.  No one went to see Nolan's Batman movies because of Bale.  They went because of Nolan, or simply because they were new Batman movies and Batman has always been popular.

In contrast, I think you can make a compelling argument that RDJ is a huge part of why the Marvel cinematic universe has been so successful, as he basically established the tone of the entire universe with his performance in Iron Man, and is just generally an incredibly charismatic actor.

IMO, which might not be something everyone agrees with, Bale's Bruce Wayne was not all that great, it was fine but it's not what made the movie. And given with Batman the only human thing you see is that manly lower jaw, it arguably doesn't matter who plays Batman, it only matters who plays Bruce Wayne. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, Eggegg said:

Jackman was a fantastic Wolverine by the end. I didn't like him at first when it came to the first Xmen movie, he was too tall too good looking and didn't quite live up to the Claremont version of Wolverine I was hoping for.

I think they could easily recast him and we could have just as good a Wolverine. Someone shorter and stockier and more irritable.

Kevin Hart. 

 

2 hours ago, mormont said:

There is a long and storied history of giving Magneto random powers 'because magnetism, that's why'. When Stan was still writing, magnetism and/or transistors could do anything.

It's still around, at least the magnetism can do anything thing. People putting magnets in their mattresses because it will cure your back and joint problems.

We only age because of free radical damage to our cells, tissues and DNA. There is surely some fictional mechanism that can be created whereby Magnetism can be used to reduce or reverse free radical damage and thus potentially indefinitely extend one's life.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Eggegg said:

I agree, X-men tend to exist in this universe where people are born with superpowers and are treated as freaks and outcasts.. and yet you put them in the same universe as spiderman and Captain America who are treated as heroes, then it becomes quite inconsistent. I would rather they stayed apart and had their own stories. 

I actually think it makes for great potential. On the one hand you have ordinary humans who through "science" have acquired enhanced powers. On the other hand you have these genetic freaks who are a different (and morally inferior) species. There is no rationality in people accepting Spider Man and rejecting mutants. It is pure racism. I like the idea that there's this word where there are "approved" enhanced people and "unapproved" enhanced people on the basis that one type of enhanced person is a proper human, and the other type of enhanced person isn't really a proper human. Surely, that's a great narrative opportunity.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

We only age because of free radical damage to our cells, tissues and DNA. There is surely some fictional mechanism that can be created whereby Magnetism can be used to reduce or reverse free radical damage and thus potentially indefinitely extend one's life.

It wouldn't even necessarily have to only be Magneto.  They could just explain it away as mutants having longer lifespans than the traditional human.  Not all of them would be like Wolverine and barely age at all, but say they top out around 120 rather than 100 like a non-mutant and you've basically got a timeline that fits for Magneto still being a Holocaust survivor. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, briantw said:

Could use some bullshit explanation about how his mutant powers have made him age slower than a normal human.

They could make him a Tutsi from Rwanda and I guess that would still give him the "never again will I let a similar fate befall my kind" angle. Or if they insist on him being european he could be a Bosnian muslim from the Yugoslavian war. Both scenarios would allow him to be in his 30s-40s. I think it would be an interesting direction to go with the cinematic version of the character.

Or they just make out he accidentally messed with space/time when he freaked out with his powers in Nazi Germany and wound up in 2000. He doesn't know how he did it (he was super stressed out/angry in that camp). That would provide a long-term fix as they can just have his "origin" as World War 2 and have him time-travel to 2020, 2050 etc whenever they need to alter the time. It also keeps the Xavier rivalry alive as he can meet him after the time travel. That's the "keep things familiar" solution.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

I actually think it makes for great potential. On the one hand you have ordinary humans who through "science" have acquired enhanced powers. On the other hand you have these genetic freaks who are a different (and morally inferior) species. There is no rationality in people accepting Spider Man and rejecting mutants. It is pure racism. I like the idea that there's this word where there are "approved" enhanced people and "unapproved" enhanced people on the basis that one type of enhanced person is a proper human, and the other type of enhanced person isn't really a proper human. Surely, that's a great narrative opportunity.

That angle works with "outed" superheroes but it's still a bit iffy with Spider-man. Do people take his word that he's an enhanced human instead of a mutant. Same with Daredevil and all the other masked vigilantes with powers.

I agree it works well with Iron Man and captain america, etc. One of the better elements of "uncanny Avengers" were the mutants pointing out how Iron Man and Cap never really made much of a stand to help mutants.

Of course that's when mutants were feared and hated. Now the mutants go around being accused of committing Inhuman genocide and it's the poor Inhumans who are hated and feared by EVERYONE.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

38 minutes ago, red snow said:

That angle works with "outed" superheroes but it's still a bit iffy with Spider-man. Do people take his word that he's an enhanced human instead of a mutant. Same with Daredevil and all the other masked vigilantes with powers.

I agree it works well with Iron Man and captain america, etc. One of the better elements of "uncanny Avengers" were the mutants pointing out how Iron Man and Cap never really made much of a stand to help mutants.

Of course that's when mutants were feared and hated. Now the mutants go around being accused of committing Inhuman genocide and it's the poor Inhumans who are hated and feared by EVERYONE.

Why not have it as part of a movie that Spider Man is accused of being a mutant, then someone develops a blood test to identify the X gene, and Spider Man willingly submits to the test to prove he's not a mutant. Submitting yourself to a genetic purity test to prove you are not a freak is very controversial. But for a Spider man who is still in High School it's kind of understandable that he would do that because he doesn't think about the broader consequences of a genetic purity test. He just doesn't want people to hate him because he's different.

Hulk comes back to earth and is also immediately suspected of and vilified as a mutant, thus confirming all the bad shit he says about Earth in Ragnarok.

Like I said, lots of narrative possibilities. And if I can think of a few ideas that aren't complete crap, then people who are actually good at this stuff can come up with away better material.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Maybe real heroes start off as a reason for the world to cheer (movies so far), then as they proliferate over time and more things blow up public opinion sours on them (a process that began in age of ultron, gets worse with the emergence of a whole "mutant" population, until it's too much for humanity to stomach.)    'Racism for cause,' it might turn out the world has good reasons to justify its low opinion of the X bunch.

Also on Magneto's age rollback, is it not possible Scarlet Witch could discover her true dad too late, and regret not ever having the chance to know him while he was alive, until she makes the emotionally charged decision to, you know, bring him back?  (To see him as he was in his prime).

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, The Mother of The Others said:

Maybe real heroes start off as a reason for the world to cheer (movies so far), then as they proliferate over time and more things blow up public opinion sours on them (a process that began in age of ultron, gets worse with the emergence of a whole "mutant" population, until it's too much for humanity to stomach.)    'Racism for cause,' it might turn out the world has good reasons to justify its low opinion of the X bunch.

That sounds pretty paint by numbers, which probably means it's exactly what they'll do.  Just hope they hire a writer with an idea that provides a little more nuance and originality than what we all can come up with.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, The Mother of The Others said:

Maybe real heroes start off as a reason for the world to cheer (movies so far), then as they proliferate over time and more things blow up public opinion sours on them (a process that began in age of ultron, gets worse with the emergence of a whole "mutant" population, until it's too much for humanity to stomach.)    'Racism for cause,' it might turn out the world has good reasons to justify its low opinion of the X bunch.

Also on Magneto's age rollback, is it not possible Scarlet Witch could discover her true dad too late, and regret not ever having the chance to know him while he was alive, until she makes the emotionally charged decision to, you know, bring him back?  (To see him as he was in his prime).

 

 

22 minutes ago, dmc515 said:

That sounds pretty paint by numbers, which probably means it's exactly what they'll do.  Just hope they hire a writer with an idea that provides a little more nuance and originality than what we all can come up with.

Well, and then there is the situation with super villains. Who have been the villains in the MCU so far? Loki (alien), Ultron (robot), Winter Soldier (brainwashed), Red Skull (just looks weird but no particular powers), Vulture (mechanical attachments). We haven't yet seen a superpowered, earth born, human villain, aside from Kaecilius, and his villainy remained hidden from the public gaze, because all of the destruction he wraught was undone with by Dr Strange using the Eye of Aggamodo. Bring in Magneto, Juggernaut and Mystique, who are humans from Earth who intend harm, and people like Nightcrawler who look downright demonic and the implications for deliberate harm by malevolent powered people, and freaky looking people who with fearful appearances, and you have the right conditions to create prejudice and hate in a way that has not really had cause in the MCU to date.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, red snow said:

That angle works with "outed" superheroes but it's still a bit iffy with Spider-man. Do people take his word that he's an enhanced human instead of a mutant. Same with Daredevil and all the other masked vigilantes with powers.

Well, in the comics at least that's not an issue because there are canonically reliable mutant detecting technologies. Don't ask me how they work, but they do. Point one at Spidey, question answered.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, The Mother of The Others said:

Maybe real heroes start off as a reason for the world to cheer (movies so far), then as they proliferate over time and more things blow up public opinion sours on them (a process that began in age of ultron, gets worse with the emergence of a whole "mutant" population, until it's too much for humanity to stomach.)    'Racism for cause,' it might turn out the world has good reasons to justify its low opinion of the X bunch.

Possibly an interesting idea. I do think that the Avengers and Civil War movies are attempting to deal with the public reaction to the emergence of super powered beings, and probably with the UN stuff i think that might be the most interesting that is ever going to get. Just looking at Agents of SHIELD I was never in love with the Inhumans stuff either, it all makes the universe pretty messy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, red snow said:

They could make him a Tutsi from Rwanda and I guess that would still give him the "never again will I let a similar fate befall my kind" angle. Or if they insist on him being european he could be a Bosnian muslim from the Yugoslavian war. Both scenarios would allow him to be in his 30s-40s. I think it would be an interesting direction to go with the cinematic version of the character.

Beat me to it. There are plenty of more recent genocides that could be used, which could need a whole host of more up-to-date politics.

Rwanda would be my go to, Sierra Leone and Yogoslavia absolutely viable. Shiite/Sunni in the Middle East more recently could even bring the use depleted uranium in bombs into play. in a few years we could have a Muslim from Myanmar.

All these allow for greater diversity in casting as well; maybe the world needs a Muslim superhero!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...