Carl Benson

The Olynna Scene Changes Everything...

59 posts in this topic

...or at least it should.

Because Westeros believed Tyrion and Sansa killed Jeoffry:

Tyrion went on the run at great peril to himself

Sansa went on the run, became Lady of the Vale, gave Little Finger a reason to kill her Aunt, was in a position to secure the knights of the Vale for battle of the bastards and retake the north

kept Little Finger away from kings landing

reunitied Varys and Tyrion

sent Tyrion to Dany

brought Jamie closer to Cersie (in spite of his apprehensions)

caused the Red Viper to be killed

caused the mountain to become more of a monster

caused Tyrion to kill Tywin

caused Cersie to take out the sept, Hightower and Dorne

anything else?


and NOW what?
 

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Sets up conflict between Jaime and Cersei (now that Jaime has confirmation of Tyrions innocence) he likely will have to confront Cersei over her vindictiveness towards their (innocent) brother. A vindictiveness that set in motion so many troubleing events, includimg Tywins death.

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IF Jamie grows a spine, this might lead to the gap between him and Cersei to increase. Olennas lines about Cersei being a monster point in the same direction. At the end of that direction is the fulfilling of the Valonqar prophecy with Jamie killing her off.

I am not totally convinced that we will see it this season though. Without Cersei only the Night King remains as a threat and it has been a key characteristic for the series that several conflicts are brewing at the same time.

So we might have to wait some more time before reaping the fruits of this revelation.

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If Jamie now blames Jeoffreys death on the Tyrells, conveniently freeing his little brother from the accusation, that's pretty suspicious.

After all, it's based on the confession of a dead woman, witnessed only by Jamie, a person who has strong personal bias and is considered untrustworthy anyway (Kingslayer).

 

It might cause tension between Jamie/Cersei, but I don't think anyone else in the realm should care or believe it.

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One thing for sure is that, even if Jaime tells Cersei Olenna Tyrell admitted to murdering Joffrey, Cersei isn't going to suddenly soften any towards Tyrion. She hated his guts long before she ever thought he killed her son and it was multiplied when he killed their father.

I do think this will add to the conflict between Cersei and Jaime. You can see him changing towards her as the series has progressed and leading towards the prophecy of the Valonqar being fulfilled.

Personally I'd like to see it at the end of the this series, in a similar scenario to Jaime killing Aerys. Perhaps Dany and her army are at the gates of the city trying to sack it. Cersei begins to boil over and orders Jaime to go bring her Dany and Tyrion's heads. In that moment, he slays another ruler, this time his Queen/sister/lover...

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I can't see it changing much for Jaime. He never gave a crap about Joffrey anyway and either didn't believe Tyrion killed him or didn't care if he did, which is why he helped him escape. He's still gunna be pissed at him for killing Tywin in any case 

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It will trigger the last falling out between Jaime & Cersei, IMO. He was clearly distraught when he left the room, fuming.

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Posted (edited)

It doesn't and why should it..?

Cersei won't care that Olenna admitted to it, even if she believes Jamie (who believes Olenna) when he presumably tells her. Jamie will say Tyrion is vindicated, but Cersei won't agree or won't care, and then we continue as normal. It will be a further thought for Jamie towards killing Cersei but that's it.

Tyrion also killed Tywin so Jamie isn't going to be best buds with him.

Edited by Parkourya Stark
Extra

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The show is not very consistent,  unfortunately it seems like it will. But, since when has Jaime cared about Joffrey? And he didn't even think Tyrion did it anyway, he was mad that he killed Tywin. 

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4 hours ago, Fearodh said:

IF Jamie grows a spine, this might lead to the gap between him and Cersei to increase. Olennas lines about Cersei being a monster point in the same direction. At the end of that direction is the fulfilling of the Valonqar prophecy with Jamie killing her off.

I am not totally convinced that we will see it this season though. Without Cersei only the Night King remains as a threat and it has been a key characteristic for the series that several conflicts are brewing at the same time.

So we might have to wait some more time before reaping the fruits of this revelation.

Thats what the show is aiming towards.........

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It changes the dynamic in the Lannister family, but I think that bridge is burned and Tyrion would have no problem killing Cersei no matter what she thinks. The realtionship between Jamie and Tyrion still has legs, and there must be a reason for that.

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Posted (edited)

Um... I don't think so. The only thing it could change is that Jaime and Cersei would argue about Tyrion. But Jaime has already helped him, Cersei will hate him either way because of the prophecy, Jaime knows that Cersei hated Tyrion even before Joffrey's death, and Tyrion is still an outlaw because he killed Tywin.

Honestly it could change some things if Olenna said that LF had a role in the murder too. For example, Cersei could place a bounty on his head and Jon when / if he returns to Winterfell could execute him for regicide, even if it was the hated Joffrey. But as no one (including Cersei who made a deal with him not so long ago) cares about Littlefinger, it wouldn't change anything anyway.

Edited by Nerevanin

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Jaimie and Tyrion were very close. Jaimie did believe Tyrion killed Joffrey - Tyrion said he did it, out of spite, to upset Jaimie, after Jaimie admitted to his part in driving Tyrion's wife away (pretty sure that was the sequence, it's been a few years). 

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6 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

Sets up conflict between Jaime and Cersei (now that Jaime has confirmation of Tyrions innocence) he likely will have to confront Cersei over her vindictiveness towards their (innocent) brother. A vindictiveness that set in motion so many troubleing events, includimg Tywins death.

Jaime might not even tell Cersei about the confession. Don't forget, he talked Cersei out of torturing and giving Olenna a horrible death. Instead he gave Olenna a very easy death, only to find out that she killed Joff? I'm pretty sure that the Cersei, now in full whack-job mode,  would be pretty vexed, to say the least, about being denied her vengence.

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Posted (edited)

It won't change anything. The false narrative is too deeply rooted at this point: The Imp is a kinslayer.

 

Edited by Leto Atreides

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I don't think it matters much that it sent Tyrion to Dany at this point. Cersei,Jaimie and Euron have outsmarted Tyrion at every turn. If one didn't know any better they might even think Tyrion is sabotaging Dany to help his brother and sister. Even killing Tywin helped out Cersei in the sense that it made it so Cersei would not have to marry Loras and leave with him to Highgarden, something neither Cersei nor Jaime wanted to happen. Tyrion is helping Cersei's cause more then she knows.

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13 minutes ago, Ralphis Baratheon said:

I don't think it matters much that it sent Tyrion to Dany at this point. Cersei,Jaimie and Euron have outsmarted Tyrion at every turn. If one didn't know any better they might even think Tyrion is sabotaging Dany to help his brother and sister. Even killing Tywin helped out Cersei in the sense that it made it so Cersei would not have to marry Loras and leave with him to Highgarden, something neither Cersei nor Jaime wanted to happen. Tyrion is helping Cersei's cause more then she knows.

Sad but true. Tyrion is not a war time consigliere.

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1 hour ago, crlovel said:

Sad but true. Tyrion is not a war time consigliere.

poor Tom Hagen

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I don't see why this is being downplayed.  Tyrion not being guilty should change Jamie's entire outlook on his family.  Accusing Tyrion of the murder showed 1. Cersei despised him and wanted him dead and was willing to overlook basic logic (ie Tyrion not really the prime suspect to kill Joeffrey) in order to have him killed and 2. Tywin's willingness to overlook searching for Joffrey's murdered in order to have his son put on trial and sentenced to death. I understand Jamie knew of their overall dislike for Tyrion but I don't think Jamie believed they would go this far out of hatred. This goes against what both of them have said for the entire series about preserving the Lannister name and making sure the house survives.  Literally their hatred for Tyrion made sure the house did not survive. 

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2 hours ago, crlovel said:

Jaimie and Tyrion were very close. Jaimie did believe Tyrion killed Joffrey - Tyrion said he did it, out of spite, to upset Jaimie, after Jaimie admitted to his part in driving Tyrion's wife away (pretty sure that was the sequence, it's been a few years). 

I think you're thinking of the books.

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