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Should Lannisters give Daenerys the Ironthrone


norwaywolf123

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If House lannisters cede the iron throne to Daenerys for amnesty. There will be little problem between them. Also Daenersy will have to pay the debt to the ironbank. Everybody wins right! Cersei or Jaime also have no children to inherit the throne so what is the point. They also lack legitmacy to the throne as they have no Targaryen blood.

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5 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

If House lannisters cede the iron throne to Daenerys for amnesty.

Not going to happen, she was ready to take her own life and Tommens if KL fell to Stannis.

5 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

There will be little problem between them. Also Daenersy will have to pay the debt to the ironbank.

Daenerys would not want to pay the debt of a Usurper, but likely with the possible help of Tyrion would convinced it would be the best course of action set up a plan to pay it back. This would stop the IB potentially funding enemies and also would help to borrow money further to fund the rebuilding/civil war/winter etc.

5 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Everybody wins right! Cersei or Jaime also have no children to inherit the throne so what is the point. They also lack legitmacy to the throne as they have no Targaryen blood.

Its all a matter of perspective and to be frank King Aerys was ruler who was overthrown by Robert Baratheon, it was then passed down through ''his children'' and Cersei took it for her own.

 But if want to be nitty and gritty about it here goes in order(this is after Robert Baratheons death)

  1. Joffrey
  2. Tommen
  3. Myrcella
  4. Stannis Baratheon
  5. Shireen Baratheon
  6. Renly Baratheon

But there are all dead so if we venture deeper into the unknown. Robert Baratheons grandmother was acutally Targaryen, Rhaelle Targaryen. This mean Rhaelle was the Mad kings Aunt and his only surviving child would have had the most legitimate claim. But due to Roberts rebellion the Targaryen children were exiled and this may just nullify their claim. So this leaves us with only one person who has the most legitimate claim is Jamie Lannister.

Jamie Lannister was member of the Kings guard til Tommen freed him of his vows. So when Tommen Died the Throne should have gone to Jamie Lannister.

So to answer your question they dont need Targaryen blood to have legitimacy and they are probably the most legitimate to the claim on the Iron Throne. As proved having the right last name and who should succeed doesnt matter.

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4 hours ago, Samwell_Tarly said:

Not going to happen, she was ready to take her own life and Tommens if KL fell to Stannis.

Daenerys would not want to pay the debt of a Usurper, but likely with the possible help of Tyrion would convinced it would be the best course of action set up a plan to pay it back. This would stop the IB potentially funding enemies and also would help to borrow money further to fund the rebuilding/civil war/winter etc.

Its all a matter of perspective and to be frank King Aerys was ruler who was overthrown by Robert Baratheon, it was then passed down through ''his children'' and Cersei took it for her own.

 But if want to be nitty and gritty about it here goes in order(this is after Robert Baratheons death)

  1. Joffrey
  2. Tommen
  3. Myrcella
  4. Stannis Baratheon
  5. Shireen Baratheon
  6. Renly Baratheon

But there are all dead so if we venture deeper into the unknown. Robert Baratheons grandmother was acutally Targaryen, Rhaelle Targaryen. This mean Rhaelle was the Mad kings Aunt and his only surviving child would have had the most legitimate claim. But due to Roberts rebellion the Targaryen children were exiled and this may just nullify their claim. So this leaves us with only one person who has the most legitimate claim is Jamie Lannister.

Jamie Lannister was member of the Kings guard til Tommen freed him of his vows. So when Tommen Died the Throne should have gone to Jamie Lannister.

So to answer your question they dont need Targaryen blood to have legitimacy and they are probably the most legitimate to the claim on the Iron Throne. As proved having the right last name and who should succeed doesnt matter.

I'm curious on how you get to Jaime Lannister as the most legitimate claimant.  Would it be as heir of his dead son Tommen, who in first place got to be king only because it was (supposedly) not his son, but Robert Baratheon's one? 
At least with Cercei it was well established and publicly accepted that she was Tommen's mother, as unfounded as her claim may be. She just sat in the throne because it was there and she wanted her ass on it, and maybe she would get her way  if nobody else claims it, but this is not the case. 
Robert Baratheon's dinasty founded its legitimacy not only on conquest right, but on his Targaryen blood too. That's the reason why he is who got the Throne, and not for example Ned Stark or Jon Arryn. That is also the reason why Robert seemed always so worried about Danaerys as the last remaining Targ, seeing  a possible offspring of hers as a real threat. That's because he knew that the other line derived of their common ancestor Aegon V would always have a more legitimate claim, and that's the main reason he would have slept much better by having all dead and gone for good.
The lines are:
Aegon + -> Rhaelle + ->Steffon B.+-> Robert+, Stannis+ and Renly B+.
Aegon +->Jaehaerys+->Aerys the Mad King+->Rhaegar +, Viserys + and Danaerys T
There's nobody left from the Baratheon line, except Robert's bastards, who are only known as having Robert's blood by few people. 
From the Targaryen line, we have Dani and Jon
 

Spoiler

If the leaks turn out to be true, Jon is not a bastard and has the most legitimate claim as Rhaegar's son

 

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5 minutes ago, LucyMormont said:

I'm curious on how you get to Jaime Lannister as the most legitimate claimant.  Would it be as heir of his dead son Tommen, who in first place got to be king only because it was (supposedly) not his son, but Robert Baratheon's one? 

Corwen Baratheon (Robert Baratheons great,great, great, great Grandfather) wed Lyene and had a son called Arion was Roberts great great great Grandfather, that bloodline was ended. Fortunately another one of Corwen's children, Elyanna, married Mathin Lannister. Mathin was Tywin Lannisters great great Grandfather meaning that when Tywin died he was the True recipent of the Iron Throne.

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If we are talking about TRUE heirs to the throne, it would be Jon (Jaehaerys), assuming Rhaegar and Lyanna were secretly married.  A son of Rhaegar would have more of a claim than a daughter of Aerys.  Tywin, or any Lannister for that matter would have no real claim.  First of all, we know the Baratheon children of Robert's are really Lannister bastards, so they wouldn't have a claim.  The funny thing is all of this is tied to rumors/theories that the general public of Westeros has no knowledge of.  Which is why everything is so muddied and Cersi is sitting on the throne. Technically, if the theory about R+C = G is true, then Gendry has more claim to the throne than anybody in the game, because he would be the only true Baratheon heir, a direct son of Robert. Based on that, my fantasy lineup for the living line of succession would be:

1. Gendry Baratheon (via reveal of Cersei giving him up)

2. Jaehaerys (Jon) Targaryen (via a Targaryen rebellion of the Usurper Queen)

3. Danaerys Targaryen (also via a Targaryen rebellion)

4. Tyrion Lannister (via the above 3 being killed off in the Great War, and a stepping stool)

5. Petry "Littlefinger" Baelish (via the above 4 being killed off and him coming out from his hiding hole to emerge King of the Ashes)

6. The Night King (via a victory in the Great War)

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8 hours ago, Jaehaerys Stark said:

If we are talking about TRUE heirs to the throne, it would be Jon (Jaehaerys), assuming Rhaegar and Lyanna were secretly married.  A son of Rhaegar would have more of a claim than a daughter of Aerys.  Tywin, or any Lannister for that matter would have no real claim.  

Ive based my answer on facts, its fact by succession, Jamie Lannister should be sitting on the Iron Throne. Please explain how you come to the conclusion Jon Snow is the true heir to the Iron Throne?

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2 hours ago, Samwell_Tarly said:

Ive based my answer on facts, its fact by succession, Jamie Lannister should be sitting on the Iron Throne. Please explain how you come to the conclusion Jon Snow is the true heir to the Iron Throne?

Jaime Lannister has no claim to the IT and has no ancestor who has ever sat on the IT so he has literally zero claim. His "children" only have a claim on the "assumption" that they are not his kids and are in fact Roberts, which they aren't.

There should of been a grand council called to vote on who would become the new King. The next in line would probably have a Baratheon ancestor. Like how Robert had a Targaryen grandmother which gave him more legitimacy to take over.

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11 hours ago, Jaehaerys Stark said:

Technically, if the theory about R+C = G is true, then Gendry has more claim to the throne than anybody in the game, because he would be the only true Baratheon heir, a direct son of Robert. Based on that, my fantasy lineup for the living line of succession would be:

1. Gendry Baratheon (via reveal of Cersei giving him up)

 

Gendry saying his mother had blonde hair was just to show that Black Hair > Blonde Hair. Another hint at Joffrey and the rest not being Robert's.

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4 hours ago, Adam_Up_Bxtch said:

Jaime Lannister has no claim to the IT and has no ancestor who has ever sat on the IT so he has literally zero claim. His "children" only have a claim on the "assumption" that they are not his kids and are in fact Roberts, which they aren't.

There should of been a grand council called to vote on who would become the new King. The next in line would probably have a Baratheon ancestor. Like how Robert had a Targaryen grandmother which gave him more legitimacy to take over.

I think that this is what @Samwell_Tarly is saying, he is founding Jaime's (alleged) claim in that he has a  female Baratheon ancestor.

On 1/8/2017 at 7:35 PM, Samwell_Tarly said:

Corwen Baratheon (Robert Baratheons great,great, great, great Grandfather) wed Lyene and had a son called Arion was Roberts great great great Grandfather, that bloodline was ended. Fortunately another one of Corwen's children, Elyanna, married Mathin Lannister. Mathin was Tywin Lannisters great great Grandfather meaning that when Tywin died he was the True recipent of the Iron Throne.

But I guess that  Lannister is not the only House who got a bit of Baratheon blood through the years, why would the heir of Casterly Rock take precedence over any other? 

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5 hours ago, Adam_Up_Bxtch said:

Jaime Lannister has no claim to the IT and has no ancestor who has ever sat on the IT so he has literally zero claim. His "children" only have a claim on the "assumption" that they are not his kids and are in fact Roberts, which they aren't.

There should of been a grand council called to vote on who would become the new King. The next in line would probably have a Baratheon ancestor. Like how Robert had a Targaryen grandmother which gave him more legitimacy to take over.

LOLOLOL - your so contradictive.

you just said that Claims are subjective and you can have a claim for whatever reason, ive just give Jamie a claim. 

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5 hours ago, Adam_Up_Bxtch said:

There should of been a grand council called to vote on who would become the new King. The next in line would probably have a Baratheon ancestor. Like how Robert had a Targaryen grandmother which gave him more legitimacy to take over.

The Baratheon Line has been exhausted in the show. We would have to Roberts great great great great Grandad to find a family line that could be used, Jamie should be king due to succession simple as that.

But as we know succession does not matter, if someone wants the Iron Throne they will take it.

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they should give up the throne but they won't. Right now dani doesn't need to kill cersei because her two allies that wanted that are dead. But cersei would rather die then give up the throne. Her children are dead as is everyone else in her family except jaime and tyrion who she hates. All she really has and cares about is the throne. She is truly mad and in my opinion no longer really cares about jaime as a person but as a toy and asset.

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I don't know why Cersei Lannister would give up a throne she has spent the entire series trying to win. First by killing Robert and seating his illegitimate son Joffrey on the throne, to be controlled by the Lannister family. When he died, it passed to Tommen and we he died, Cersei finally got her hands on it.

If Cersei suddenly gave it all up and offered it to Daenerys, it would be like suggesting that Cersei's plan all along was to win the throne to pass it over to the Targaryen offspring as soon as she came looking for it, which would be very un-Cersei, never mind a massive anti-climax.

Daenerys is going to have to win it by force, that was the only way we ever imagined it happening. Cersei has lost her father and all three of her children. All she has left is her brother/love and her throne. She isn't going to give it up that easily.

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59 minutes ago, snow is the man said:

The one problem I have with this is there is no proof. The entire country would have to take bran's word for it.

There is no proof... yet. 

They can still come up with something more acceptable than having to take Bran's word.  

Spoiler

 

Sam can find some  proof in the "forbidden" texts of the Citadel, as the leaks say, or Bran can discover in his visions some hint pointing in the right direction as to where an actual proof  might be found. The crypts of Winterfell might be a good place to hide something that had to remain unknown but still Ned did not dare to destroy. Maybe inside Lyanna's statue? In a place that keeps the remains of all Starks but we are told that traditionally only Kings and Lords have statues, why a statue of Lyanna? We are told that Ned had statues made for his siblings because he loved them very much. Is it that no other Lord before him loved his brothers and sisters, or his mothers and wiwes?? That has no sense.

My guess is that if Jon is in fact the last living trueborn son of Rhaegar, when Ned found them the baby was already the king, and Lyana died as his Queen Mother. Hence the statue, to honor her. Brandon might have died as Lord too, it would only take that his dead was seconds after his father's one. Or, Ned had also a satue for Brandon just because he couldn't have Lyanna's one and not his. 

In the books there are clues that in the crypts of Winterfell  there is something waiting for Jon.
"Somehow I know I have to go down there, but I don't want to. I'm afraid of what might be waiting for me", he says to Sam

 

Anyway, all this is just speculation,:unsure: 

 

 

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10 hours ago, Adam_Up_Bxtch said:

Gendry saying his mother had blonde hair was just to show that Black Hair > Blonde Hair. Another hint at Joffrey and the rest not being Robert's.

I agree with you. I made a point to put "my fantasy lineup for the living line of succession would be" for a reason my friend.  I don't think Gendry is Cersei's son.  It was a nod to a fan theory about Gendry being the son of R+C.  I think it would be very GRRMish to reveal that Cersei is Gendry's mom and Robert his dad, thus making him the true heir to the throne that everyone is fighting over as he is hidden away in KL making armor and weapons with the common folk in Flea Bottom.  The foreshadowing is there with Cersei telling Catlyn about her dark haired son she lost in the past, as well as Gendry talking about not knowing his blonde haired mother. That's why he is #1 on my fantasy line of succession...

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13 hours ago, Samwell_Tarly said:

Ive based my answer on facts, its fact by succession, Jamie Lannister should be sitting on the Iron Throne. Please explain how you come to the conclusion Jon Snow is the true heir to the Iron Throne?

Well, I thought I did  a pretty decent job of explaining it.  You quoted my statement. You even took the time to make the letters bigger, bold and italicized! lol  IF Rhaegar and Lyanna were married in secret, Jon would be a legitimate son of Rhaegar, thus would have more claim to the throne. More than Dany, and certainly more than any Lannister.  A son of Rhaegar > the brother/lover of the mother of the 2 bastard sons of Robert Baratheon, who stole the throne from the Targs, who ruled for 300 years...

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On 2.8.2017 at 0:23 AM, LucyMormont said:

I'm curious on how you get to Jaime Lannister as the most legitimate claimant.  Would it be as heir of his dead son Tommen, who in first place got to be king only because it was (supposedly) not his son, but Robert Baratheon's one? 
At least with Cercei it was well established and publicly accepted that she was Tommen's mother, as unfounded as her claim may be. She just sat in the throne because it was there and she wanted her ass on it, and maybe she would get her way  if nobody else claims it, but this is not the case. 
Robert Baratheon's dinasty founded its legitimacy not only on conquest right, but on his Targaryen blood too. That's the reason why he is who got the Throne, and not for example Ned Stark or Jon Arryn. That is also the reason why Robert seemed always so worried about Danaerys as the last remaining Targ, seeing  a possible offspring of hers as a real threat. That's because he knew that the other line derived of their common ancestor Aegon V would always have a more legitimate claim, and that's the main reason he would have slept much better by having all dead and gone for good.
The lines are:
Aegon + -> Rhaelle + ->Steffon B.+-> Robert+, Stannis+ and Renly B+.
Aegon +->Jaehaerys+->Aerys the Mad King+->Rhaegar +, Viserys + and Danaerys T
There's nobody left from the Baratheon line, except Robert's bastards, who are only known as having Robert's blood by few people. 
From the Targaryen line, we have Dani and Jon
 

  Reveal hidden contents

If the leaks turn out to be true, Jon is not a bastard and has the most legitimate claim as Rhaegar's son

 

No one knows about Jon's Targaryen ancestry. It is a non factor.

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On 2.8.2017 at 0:35 AM, Samwell_Tarly said:

Corwen Baratheon (Robert Baratheons great,great, great, great Grandfather) wed Lyene and had a son called Arion was Roberts great great great Grandfather, that bloodline was ended. Fortunately another one of Corwen's children, Elyanna, married Mathin Lannister. Mathin was Tywin Lannisters great great Grandfather meaning that when Tywin died he was the True recipent of the Iron Throne.

Do you know about a good family tree from the show?

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