Karstarks are the Real Starks

[The Twinslayer]

On 8/6/2017 at 3:19 PM, TurkJedi said:

The Bael Story mentions Lord Starks, not King Starks. <snip>

Prior to the Conquest, the Starks called themselves "Lord of Winterfell" and "King in the North."  From Ned Stark:  "The first Lords of Winterfell had been men as hard as the land they ruled.  In the centuries before the Dragonlords came over the sea, they had sworn allegiance to no man, styling themselves the Kings in the North."

It is therefore not surprising that Ygritte referred to the Lord of Winterfell.  What would have been surprising would be for her to refer to a Stark as the "King in the North" when from her perspective, Winterfell is in "the South" (as she explains to Jon Snow).  

So I would not use Ygritte's reference to the Lord of Winterfell to mean that Bael's adventures took place after Aegon's conquest. 

On 8/6/2017 at 5:21 PM, Ferocious Veldt Roarer said:

Ygritte is famously ignorant of kneeler customs, traditions and titles, so it tells very little.

Also, in her story "One o’ his lords peeled the skin off him and wore him for a cloak.”, which must have meant Bolton, and the last time Bolton stood up to Stark was something like seven hundred years ago. isn't going to become the Vale of Hardyng, should Littlerobin kick the bucket without fathering any children of his own.

The fact that Lord Bolton flayed Bael's bastard likely places those events prior to the time the Karstarks broke away from the main Stark line.  Meaning that the Karstarks are all descended from Bael.  That is what gives rise to the theory that Dany's vision of a blue rose at the Wall, when she visits the Houses of the Undying, is a prophesy that one of Bael's female descendants would one day arrive at the Wall.  A prophesy that was fulfilled in A Dance With Dragons, when Alys Karstark arrived. 

[kissdbyfire]

27 minutes ago, Black Crow said:

Not to mention the words of one Aemon Targaryen: 

"You are a son of Winterfell, a nephew of Benjen Stark. It must be you or no one."

Exactly! Great quote, btw, I had forgotten all about it... 

[Andrés Garcia]

On 2017-08-06 at 11:51 PM, WSmith84 said:

These Houses are thousands of years old; I doubt any one of them could claim to be unbroken in the main line for that amount of time. Every House, at some point, will have been carried on by a daughter and her children.

If a good point like this is raised, don't just ignore it. Address it explicitly. 

[TMIFairy]

BTW - I think that Alys/Robb is a great opportunity missed by Ned/Cate.

Such a match had sent out a message that the Starks are still Northmen through and thorough in spite of that marriage to a Southron Sevener.

OK - I agree that a match with any Noble House of the North would had sent such a message, maybe with the possible exception of Manderly.

An Alys/Robb match also might serve to "breed out the Tully-look" from the main Stark line?

Also, in a hypothetical "the North knows but one King, and her name is Stark" scenario, marrying Sansa or Arya to one of the Karstarks - IIRC there are four young men/boys of that family still alive - might be a politically deft move.