Katleesi

Longclaw [spoilers, probably]

36 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

 If Ser Jorah shows up on Dragonstone while Jon is hanging about with Longclaw, does Jon give the sword to Jorah? Jon needs Valerian steel to fight walkers, but he's too MF honorable, and knows it's a Mormont sword.

On the other hand, he didn't offer it up to Lady Mormont, who probably deserves it more.  

Edited by Katleesi
spelling

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, he won't and Jorah won't bring it up either. That Jeor Mormont gifted Jon an ancient family heirloom makes zero sense in both the show and the books. But that's what happened because it was important for Jon to get a special sword as part of his hero's journey.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Pecan said:

No, he won't and Jorah won't bring it up either. That Jeor Mormont gifted Jon an ancient family heirloom makes zero sense in both the show and the books. But that's what happened because it was important for Jon to get a special sword as part of his hero's journey.

Uh.. it makes perfect sense. Jeor Mormont was a very honorable man who took the black in Jorah's place since Jorah fled Westeros.  

Jon saved him from wights so as a sign of appreciation he gave the sword to Jon. Makes sense to me. 

What I don't get is why Jeor brought the sword with him to the wall in the first place. If Ned had taken the black back in book 1, would he have brought Ice?  Seems like he probably would have left it at Winterfell.  

Maybe for Jeor, since he was paying for his son's sins, he brought Longclaw as additional cost?  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is Jons. Good luck taking it from him. Dude is considered as a legend in the north

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, xjlxking said:

It is Jons. Good luck taking it from him. Dude is considered as a legend in the north

Rising from the dead has a tendency of doing that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Lurid Jester said:

Uh.. it makes perfect sense. Jeor Mormont was a very honorable man who took the black in Jorah's place since Jorah fled Westeros.  

Jon saved him from wights so as a sign of appreciation he gave the sword to Jon. Makes sense to me. 

What I don't get is why Jeor brought the sword with him to the wall in the first place. If Ned had taken the black back in book 1, would he have brought Ice?  Seems like he probably would have left it at Winterfell.  

Maybe for Jeor, since he was paying for his son's sins, he brought Longclaw as additional cost?  

That part you spoke of makes sense.

The part that doesn't really make sense is why Jeor, upon leaving to go to the wall to take the black, would take his family's heirloom sword with him. It was in his family's possession for generations, and he was leaving for the wall, forsaking his name/titles/possessions. Why did he take the sword, which by all accounts is more valuable than the entire worth of many houses? He should have left it in the Mormont family on Bear island, not taken it with him to the north. It's the Mormont family sword.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

On 8/10/2017 at 6:49 PM, Katleesi said:

 

 If Ser Jorah shows up on Dragonstone while Jon is hanging about with Longclaw, does Jon give the sword to Jorah? Jon needs Valerian steel to fight walkers, but he's too MF honorable, and knows it's a Mormont sword.

 

 

No. Jorah disgraced the family name and has no claim to it. As you stated the only person who has any type of claim would be Lady Mormon, but she would not ask as her father gave it to Jon.

 

Edited by TheMachine
Typo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, mykeuva said:

That part you spoke of makes sense.

The part that doesn't really make sense is why Jeor, upon leaving to go to the wall to take the black, would take his family's heirloom sword with him. It was in his family's possession for generations, and he was leaving for the wall, forsaking his name/titles/possessions. Why did he take the sword, which by all accounts is more valuable than the entire worth of many houses? He should have left it in the Mormont family on Bear island, not taken it with him to the north. It's the Mormont family sword.

He could take the Black, take the sword with him, when his watch is ended the Night's Watch sends the sword back to the Mormonts, not rocket science 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By all rights, Longclaw belongs to Jon. It was given to him by its previous owner and it is Jons to keep or to give away as he pleases

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, TheonGreyjoy said:

By all rights, Longclaw belongs to Jon. It was given to him by its previous owner and it is Jons to keep or to give away as he pleases

It was Lord Mormont's decision to give it to Jon.. The Weserosi tradition would give it to Jorah, but Jeor chose Jon..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/10/2017 at 6:49 PM, Katleesi said:

 If Ser Jorah shows up on Dragonstone while Jon is hanging about with Longclaw, does Jon give the sword to Jorah? Jon needs Valerian steel to fight walkers, but he's too MF honorable, and knows it's a Mormont sword.

On the other hand, he didn't offer it up to Lady Mormont, who probably deserves it more.  

Oh dear, you are forgetting that Jon is the prince (or princess) who was promised. He will be getting a better sword soon enough.

Also Jon has just captured Jamie who was carrying widow's wail which is the reforged remains of Ice. It is thus properly the property of house Stark. 

So Jon is going to have enough Valerian swords to start on a throne of them at this rate.

The books make plain that there is a whole tradition round the swords and the great houses make great efforts to return them to their owners even after defeating them in battle. So it would probably be understood that Longclaw would return to its family on Jon's death. So giving it to him would not lose it from the family permanently.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, hallam said:

Oh dear, you are forgetting that Jon is the prince (or princess) who was promised. He will be getting a better sword soon enough.

Also Jon has just captured Jamie who was carrying widow's wail which is the reforged remains of Ice. It is thus properly the property of house Stark. 

So Jon is going to have enough Valerian swords to start on a throne of them at this rate.

The books make plain that there is a whole tradition round the swords and the great houses make great efforts to return them to their owners even after defeating them in battle. So it would probably be understood that Longclaw would return to its family on Jon's death. So giving it to him would not lose it from the family permanently.

My dear friend who told you that Jon is the prince that was promised?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, hallam said:

The books make plain that there is a whole tradition round the swords and the great houses make great efforts to return them to their owners even after defeating them in battle. So it would probably be understood that Longclaw would return to its family on Jon's death. So giving it to him would not lose it from the family permanently.

I always assumed Jon would have the blade returned on his death, same gos for Mormont, who incidentally did leave longclaw for his son, and only got it back after his exile, still a little odd it did not stay on bear island

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, TheMachine said:

No. Jorah disgraced the family name and has no claim to it. As you stated the only person who has any type of claim would be Lady Mormon, but she would not ask as her father gave it to Jon.

 

Wasn't Jeor Lyanna Mormont's great-uncle? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, the Greenleif Stark said:

He could take the Black, take the sword with him, when his watch is ended the Night's Watch sends the sword back to the Mormonts, not rocket science 

Agree. NW surely is more honourable than Tywin Lannister was. That bastard didn't give back the Ice!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jorah leaving it behind indicates that he no longer has a claim to it and he understands why. It's Jon's sword now.

I think it would be funny if Jorah looked at the sword and is like, "Hey! That looks a lot like my family's Valerian sword... oh! It has a little wolf on the pommel and not a bear. My mistake"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well how would he know it was his sword? it isn't a very distinctive sword (except being valyrian steel but they are a few of those) except the white wolf pommel which wasn't on the sword because the original one melted

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now