Cron

Bets On The Father of Cersei's Current Pregnancy?

263 posts in this topic

2 minutes ago, Samwell_Tarly said:

Valonqar theory is not existent in the show.........

Really, why wouldn't we want to be shocked, ill hedge my bets we see Euron banging Cersei before GOT comes to and end.

The only time she ''cheats'' is to gain lanel lannisters trust and manipulate him to poison the Kings wine so he consequently has a fatally wounding accident.

Mmmm, in the books Cersei is much more promiscuous.

If I recall correctly, she has sex with ALL THREE Kettleblack brothers in exchange for them doing her dirty work for her.  They are her personal thugs, and in return she lets them have sex with her body.

Plus Lancel.

(She might have had sex with other people in the books, too, I can't recall for sure) 

Now, the Kettleblacks aren't in the show, but that does not mean Cersei's character is any different.

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2 minutes ago, Wildling Queen said:

Interesting theory. I took the aggressive sex scene to mean Cersei was turned on by torturing the women from Dorne, which is icky but plays into the Mad Queen persona with Cersei.

This.

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32 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

I just had a thought... Falia Flowers.

What about her?

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33 minutes ago, Lurid Jester said:

No one. It's a bad case of gas. 

LOL, that would explain her perpetually constipated expression. 

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2 minutes ago, Lockjaw of House Boltagon said:

LOL, that would explain her perpetually constipated expression. 

And Qyburn's visits. 

"Your last potion didn't work Qyburn. No no, don't light a match. Do you want a reenactment of the Sept of Baelor in here?"

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10 minutes ago, Wildling Queen said:

I tend to agree with you on that, but just working on other possibilities: Missandei said this season that the word everyone was using for "prince" was genderless in Valyrian, it could also mean "princess." Could the word "valonqar" also be genderless? Could the younger sibling be Arya considering that she's a younger sibling of Sansa, the girl Cersei tortured for so long?

Again, I think you're right. If it wasn't for Qyburn standing there in the scene last night confirming the pregnancy to Cersei, I wouldn't even believe it was a real pregnancy and that Jaime would bust her in that lie somehow.

Actually, yes, you're right, my strong memory is that the word Valonqar really means "little sibling," not necessarily "little brother."

(If I'm not mistaken, I think Aemon Targaryen confirmed it in the books)

And so, yes, the possibility of a female Valonqar exists.

But I'm just not buying it (and I understand you're saying you think it's Jaime, too)

I've seen theories that stretch the prophecy so far that it could be nearly anyone, but in the end I think it will be Jaime, the person Cersei would have LEAST suspected when she first heard about the Valonqar.

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10 minutes ago, Cron said:

Well, the problem with that, in my mind is that Jaime IS the Valonqar.

It all fits.  When we first learned of the Valonqar, Jaime was, perhaps, the least likely suspect, cuz he loves Cersei so much.  But then, as time goes by, we see a growing rift between Jaime and Cersei, and then we are given the otherwise useless scrap of irrelevant information that Jaime IS younger than Cersei (by a few minutes), and thus he IS her "little brother," just like Tyrion.

Tyrion is not the Valonqar, that would be FAR too obvious, and poor story-telling.

And while I've heard theories about other people, they have all left me totally unconvinced.

But it's gonna take a LOT for Jaime to cross Cersei, off, and an intensely personal betrayal would do it.

Has it been established in the show that Jaime is younger?  I love the in utero story foot-holding story, but I cannot remember if it was said in the show.

6 minutes ago, Cron said:

My theory is that that sex scene between Jaime and Cersei was put in for purposeful misdirection.

My guess:  Cersei discovered she was pregnant, then grabbed Jaime and had sex with him so he wouldn't otherwise know the baby wasn't his.  As I recall, Cersei aggressively initiated sex in that scene, which, I think, is quite unusual between them, especially in recent years.

Funny, I was just thinking that this scene is the only reason to consider your hypothesis.  But if she was suddenly desperate to hide a pregnancy, the Iron Banker would be my pick, not Euron.  Unlike Euron, the IBB guy would also want to be discreet about having sex with a customer--it could cost his job--but he might not be above trading a loan for sex.  However, I still think it's Jaime's baby.  

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13 minutes ago, Wildling Queen said:

Interesting theory. I took the aggressive sex scene to mean Cersei was turned on by torturing the women from Dorne, which is icky but plays into the Mad Queen persona with Cersei.

Could be some of both, what I said and what you said.

Could be that she had recently found out she was pregnant, AND was turned on by what she had done to Ellaria and Tyene, so maybe that was a real opportune moment for her.

But if I was Jaime, I'd be somewhat suspicious.  As I recall, lately Cersei had been refusing him sex, and/or at least grumbling and complaining and making excuses, and now, suddenly, SHE'S going after HIM??

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17 minutes ago, Cron said:

What about her?

Really? I have to explain the possablity? 

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Posted (edited)

13 minutes ago, nara said:

Has it been established in the show that Jaime is younger?  I love the in utero story foot-holding story, but I cannot remember if it was said in the show.

Funny, I was just thinking that this scene is the only reason to consider your hypothesis.  But if she was suddenly desperate to hide a pregnancy, the Iron Banker would be my pick, not Euron.  Unlike Euron, the IBB guy would also want to be discreet about having sex with a customer--it could cost his job--but he might not be above trading a loan for sex.  However, I still think it's Jaime's baby.  

Valonquar is supposedly a genderless word, however it was followed by "he will wrap his hands around your white throat", so it has to be a male character.  Additionally, the prophecy indicates the manner by which he will kill her.  However, as has been pointed out, the prophecy hasn't been mentioned in the show.  Doesn't mean it couldn't still be.

Edited by SansaJonRule

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Has anyone considered the baby is the valonqar? We know he only has the 3 living children, technicallly right now it is the youngest sibling, she and the baby could die in childbirth. 

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Couldn't the pregnancy be a ploy by Cersei to keep Jaime loyal to her? When they embrace after she tells him she says "don't ever betray me again." So obviously she does not feel she has his complete loyalty.

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25 minutes ago, pinoyathletics said:

Qyburn

Eeeeew!  Only thing worse than him is the Mountain!

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6 minutes ago, SansaJonRule said:

Valonquar is supposedly a genderless word, however it was followed by "he will wrap his hands around your white throat", so it has to be a male character.  Additionally, the prophecy indicates the manner by which he will kill her.  However, as has been pointed out, the prophecy hasn't been mentioned in the show.  Doesn't mean it couldn't still be.

To clarify, I wasn't referring to the prophecy, but rather to the story in which Jaime comes out of the womb holding Cersei's foot.  It's the only way we know she's older.

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25 minutes ago, nara said:

Has it been established in the show that Jaime is younger?  I love the in utero story foot-holding story, but I cannot remember if it was said in the show.

To my strong memory, the show has not stated Jaime is younger by a few minutes.  But my person rule of "show-watching" is that book-canon is true for the show, too, unless specifically contradicted.  If that weren't the case, then nearly anything would be possible in many situations.  

Having said that, D&D may decide to specifically contradict book-canon in the future, of course.

25 minutes ago, nara said:

Funny, I was just thinking that this scene is the only reason to consider your hypothesis.  But if she was suddenly desperate to hide a pregnancy, the Iron Banker would be my pick, not Euron.  Unlike Euron, the IBB guy would also want to be discreet about having sex with a customer--it could cost his job--but he might not be above trading a loan for sex.  However, I still think it's Jaime's baby.  

Pretty sure the Iron Bank guy's name is Tycho.

And wow, I never even thought of him!

But no, I think it's Euron.  That's how it's being set up, with him needling Jaime, and Jaime intensely disliking Euron, so that when Jaime finds out the reveal will have maximum impact.  In fact, I believe Cersei probably chose Euron on purpose, as "revenge sex" against Jaime b/c of what Cersei sees as Jaime's betrayal of her (which Cersei recently mentioned to Jaime, when she told him to never betray her again)

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23 minutes ago, SansaJonRule said:

Valonquar is supposedly a genderless word, however it was followed by "he will wrap his hands around your white throat", so it has to be a male character.  Additionally, the prophecy indicates the manner by which he will kill her.  However, as has been pointed out, the prophecy hasn't been mentioned in the show.  Doesn't mean it couldn't still be.

Good stuff, but even though I agree with you about the Valonqar being male, the "female Valonqar" theories account for what you said, by basically saying that Maggy the Frog simply misinterpreted the word (as is so commonly done in Westeros), and/or simply used the male pronouns b/c they can sometimes be considered genderless in a generic sense cuz she (Maggy) did not know the gender of the Valonqar.

Having said that, the fact that the Valonqar has not been mentioned in the show does not matter.  In fact, it will not matter if the word "Valonqar" is never uttered even once in the show, b/c, as i recall, we've been expressly told that GRRM has told D&D the endings for all major characters, and we've been told that the major characters in the show will end up the same as in the books, even if they take very different paths to get there.

Thus, if Jaime is the Valonqar in the books and is destined to kill Cersei, he WILL do it in the show, too, even if the word "Valonqar" and the Valonqar prophecy are never mentioned in the show, I think..

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I would like it to be anyone else but Jaime, that would probably mean he breaks up with her soon.

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