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A Theory With No Name


Maester Crypt

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Where is her heart? 

A Dance with Dragons - Melisandre I  

"I saw water. Deep and blue and still, with a thin coat of ice just forming on it. It seemed to go on and on forever."  

A Game of Thrones - Daenerys VI  

The day was warm and cloudless, the sky a deep blue. When the wind blew, she could smell the rich scents of grass and earth. As her litter passed beneath the stolen monuments, she went from sunlight to shadow and back again. Dany swayed along, studying the faces of dead heroes and forgotten kings. She wondered if the gods of burned cities could still answer prayers.  

A Clash of Kings - Arya II  

He blinked at her, startled. Strands of thick black hair, still wet from the bathhouse, fell across his deep blue eyes. "I'd hurt you."  

A Clash of Kings - Daenerys IV  

A long stone table filled this room. Above it floated a human heart, swollen and blue with corruption, yet still alive. It beat, a deep ponderous throb of sound, and each pulse sent out a wash of indigo light. The figures around the table were no more than blue shadows. As Dany walked to the empty chair at the foot of the table, they did not stir, nor speak, nor turn to face her. There was no sound but the slow, deep beat of the rotting heart.  

What is her cloak? 

A Dance with Dragons - Melisandre I  

“Hills. Fields. Trees. A deer, once. Stones. She is staying well away from villages. When she can she rides along the bed of little streams, to throw hunters off her trail.” 

A Storm of Swords - Bran II  

No roads ran through the twisted mountain valleys where they walked now. Between the grey stone peaks lay still blue lakes, long and deep and narrow, and the green gloom of endless piney woods. The russet and gold of autumn leaves grew less common when they left the wolfswood to climb amongst the old flint hills, and vanished by the time those hills had turned to mountains. Giant grey-green sentinels loomed above them now, and spruce and fir and soldier pines in endless profusion. The undergrowth was sparse beneath them, the forest floor carpeted in dark green needles.  

Who is she?   

A Dance with Dragons - Melisandre I  

Melisandre closed her eyes, remembering. "West." 

"She is not coming up the kingsroad, then. Clever girl. There are fewer watchers on the other side, and more cover. And some hidey-holes I have used myself from time—" He broke off at the sound of a warhorn and rose swiftly to his feet. All over Castle Black, Melisandre knew, the same sudden hush had fallen, and every man and boy turned toward the Wall, listening, waiting. One long blast of the horn meant rangers returning, but two …  

A Clash of Kings - Arya VI  

"Lord Tywin and his knights have grooms and squires to tend their horses, they don't need the likes of you," Goodwife Amabel said. "The kitchens are snug and clean, and there's always a warm fire to sleep by and plenty to eat. You might have done well there, but I can see you're not a clever girl. Harra, I believe we should give this one to Weese."  

A Clash of Kings - Arya VIII  

She crept up quiet as a shadow, but he opened his eyes all the same. "She steals in on little mice feet, but a man hears," he said. How could he hear me? she wondered, and it seemed as if he heard that as well. "The scuff of leather on stone sings loud as warhorns to a man with open ears. Clever girls go barefoot."  

A Dance with Dragons - Jon VII  

He glanced at the letter again. I will save your sister if I can. A surprisingly tender sentiment from Stannis, though undercut by that final, brutal if I can and the addendum and find a better match for her than Ramsay Snow. But what if Arya was not there to be saved? What if Lady Melisandre's flames had told it true? Could his sister truly have escaped such captors? How would she do that? Arya was always quick and clever, but in the end she's just a little girl, and Roose Bolton is not the sort who would be careless with a prize of such great worth. 

Why does she seek Jon? 

A Game of Thrones - Arya IV  

Syrio Forel allowed himself a smile. "I am thinking that when we are reaching this Winterfell of yours, it will be time to put this needle in your hand."  

A Dance with Dragons - Melisandre I  

“Daggers in the dark. I know. You will forgive my doubts, my lady. A grey girl on a dying horse, fleeing from a marriage, that was what you said.”

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First Lesson:

A Dance with Dragons - Melisandre 

Melisandre paid the naked steel no mind. If the wildling had meant her harm, she would have seen it in her flames. Danger to her own person was the first thing she had learned to see, back when she was still half a child, a slave girl bound for life to the great red temple. It was still the first thing she looked for whenever she gazed into a fire. "It is their eyes that should concern you, not their knives," she warned him.

A Game of Thrones - Jon II

"I think so," Arya said.

"First lesson," Jon said. "Stick them with the pointy end."

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Maester Crypt said:

Where is her heart? 

 

What is her cloak? 

 

Who is she?   

 

Why does she seek Jon? 

 

 

[Mad Hatter]: 'Why is a raven like a writing-desk?'

 

`Come, we shall have some fun now!' thought Alice. `I'm glad they've begun asking riddles.--I believe I can guess that,' she added aloud.

`Do you mean that you think you can find out the answer to it?' said the March Hare.

`Exactly so,' said Alice.

`Then you should say what you mean,' the March Hare went on.

`I do,' Alice hastily replied; `at least--at least I mean what I say--that's the same thing, you know.'

`Not the same thing a bit!' said the Hatter. `You might just as well say that "I see what I eat" is the same thing as "I eat what I see"!'

You might just as well say,' added the March Hare, `that "I like what I get" is the same thing as "I get what I like"!'

`You might just as well say,' added the Dormouse, who seemed to be talking in his sleep, `that "I breathe when I sleep" is the same thing as "I sleep when I breathe"!'

`It is the same thing with you,' said the Hatter, and here the conversation dropped, and the party sat silent for a minute, while Alice thought over all she could remember about ravens and writing-desks, which wasn't much.

The Hatter was the first to break the silence. `What day of the month is it?' he said, turning to Alice: he had taken his watch out of his pocket, and was looking at it uneasily, shaking it every now and then, and holding it to his ear.

Alice considered a little, and then said `The fourth.'

`Two days wrong!' sighed the Hatter. `I told you butter wouldn't suit the works!' he added looking angrily at the March Hare.

`It was the best butter,' the March Hare meekly replied.

`Yes, but some crumbs must have got in as well,' the Hatter grumbled: `you shouldn't have put it in with the bread-knife.'

The March Hare took the watch and looked at it gloomily: then he dipped it into his cup of tea, and looked at it again: but he could think of nothing better to say than his first remark, `It was the best butter, you know.'

Alice had been looking over his shoulder with some curiosity. `What a funny watch!' she remarked. `It tells the day of the month, and doesn't tell what o'clock it is!'

`Why should it?' muttered the Hatter. `Does your watch tell you what year it is?'

`Of course not,' Alice replied very readily: `but that's because it stays the same year for such a long time together.'

`Which is just the case with mine,' said the Hatter.

Alice felt dreadfully puzzled. The Hatter's remark seemed to have no sort of meaning in it, and yet it was certainly English. `I don't quite understand you,' she said, as politely as she could.

`The Dormouse is asleep again,' said the Hatter, and he poured a little hot tea upon its nose.

The Dormouse shook its head impatiently, and said, without opening its eyes, `Of course, of course; just what I was going to remark myself.'

`Have you guessed the riddle yet?' the Hatter said, turning to Alice again.

`No, I give it up,' Alice replied: `what's the answer?'

`I haven't the slightest idea,' said the Hatter.

 

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2 hours ago, LynnS said:

First Lesson:

Second Lesson?

A Game of Thrones - Arya II  

"She was," Eddard Stark agreed, "beautiful, and willful, and dead before her time." He lifted the sword, held it out between them. "Arya, what did you think to do with this … Needle? Who did you hope to skewer? Your sister? Septa Mordane? Do you know the first thing about sword fighting?" 

All she could think of was the lesson Jon had given her. "Stick them with the pointy end," she blurted out.

2 hours ago, ravenous reader said:

`What day of the month is it?'

The sixth?

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Manchester United?
 

Quote

 

A Game of Thrones - Arya V

A thousand voices were screaming, but Arya never heard them. Prince Joffrey … no, King Joffrey … stepped out from behind the shields of his Kingsguard. "My mother bids me let Lord Eddard take the black, and Lady Sansa has begged mercy for her father." He looked straight at Sansa then, and smiled, and for a moment Arya thought that the gods had heard her prayer, until Joffrey turned back to the crowd and said, "But they have the soft hearts of women. So long as I am your king, treason shall never go unpunished. Ser Ilyn, bring me his head!"

The crowd roared, and Arya felt the statue of Baelor rock as they surged against it. The High Septon clutched at the king's cape, and Varys came rushing over waving his arms, and even the queen was saying something to him, but Joffrey shook his head. Lords and knights moved aside as he stepped through, tall and fleshless, a skeleton in iron mail, the King's Justice. Dimly, as if from far off, Arya heard her sister scream. Sansa had fallen to her knees, sobbing hysterically. Ser Ilyn Payne climbed the steps of the pulpit.

Arya wriggled between Baelor's feet and threw herself into the crowd, drawing Needle. She landed on a man in a butcher's apron, knocking him to the ground. Immediately someone slammed into her back and she almost went down herself. Bodies closed in around her, stumbling and pushing, trampling on the poor butcher. Arya slashed at them with Needle.

 

 

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9 hours ago, ravenous reader said:

 

 

[Mad Hatter]: 'Why is a raven like a writing-desk?'

 

`Come, we shall have some fun now!' thought Alice. `I'm glad they've begun asking riddles.--I believe I can guess that,' she added aloud.

`Do you mean that you think you can find out the answer to it?' said the March Hare.

`Exactly so,' said Alice.

`Then you should say what you mean,' the March Hare went on.

`I do,' Alice hastily replied; `at least--at least I mean what I say--that's the same thing, you know.'

`Not the same thing a bit!' said the Hatter. `You might just as well say that "I see what I eat" is the same thing as "I eat what I see"!'

You might just as well say,' added the March Hare, `that "I like what I get" is the same thing as "I get what I like"!'

`You might just as well say,' added the Dormouse, who seemed to be talking in his sleep, `that "I breathe when I sleep" is the same thing as "I sleep when I breathe"!'

`It is the same thing with you,' said the Hatter, and here the conversation dropped, and the party sat silent for a minute, while Alice thought over all she could remember about ravens and writing-desks, which wasn't much.

The Hatter was the first to break the silence. `What day of the month is it?' he said, turning to Alice: he had taken his watch out of his pocket, and was looking at it uneasily, shaking it every now and then, and holding it to his ear.

Alice considered a little, and then said `The fourth.'

`Two days wrong!' sighed the Hatter. `I told you butter wouldn't suit the works!' he added looking angrily at the March Hare.

`It was the best butter,' the March Hare meekly replied.

`Yes, but some crumbs must have got in as well,' the Hatter grumbled: `you shouldn't have put it in with the bread-knife.'

The March Hare took the watch and looked at it gloomily: then he dipped it into his cup of tea, and looked at it again: but he could think of nothing better to say than his first remark, `It was the best butter, you know.'

Alice had been looking over his shoulder with some curiosity. `What a funny watch!' she remarked. `It tells the day of the month, and doesn't tell what o'clock it is!'

`Why should it?' muttered the Hatter. `Does your watch tell you what year it is?'

`Of course not,' Alice replied very readily: `but that's because it stays the same year for such a long time together.'

`Which is just the case with mine,' said the Hatter.

Alice felt dreadfully puzzled. The Hatter's remark seemed to have no sort of meaning in it, and yet it was certainly English. `I don't quite understand you,' she said, as politely as she could.

`The Dormouse is asleep again,' said the Hatter, and he poured a little hot tea upon its nose.

The Dormouse shook its head impatiently, and said, without opening its eyes, `Of course, of course; just what I was going to remark myself.'

`Have you guessed the riddle yet?' the Hatter said, turning to Alice again.

`No, I give it up,' Alice replied: `what's the answer?'

`I haven't the slightest idea,' said the Hatter.

 

Inverse Relationship

I think I'm a truly a fool...

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7 minutes ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

Is this merely a theory with no name, or is it also a theory with no theory? Admittedly I'm sleep-deprived (and should be sleeping now) but I seem to be missing something. Shall all be revealed or is the Sphinx the riddle here?

Once you answer my question -- 'why is a raven like a writing desk...' -- perhaps I will consider letting you in on the secret... ;)

 

32 minutes ago, Maester Crypt said:

Inverse Relationship

I think I'm a truly a fool...

I'm not quite sure what you mean.  Are you sure you 'mean what you say' and 'say what you mean'?  ;)  I just know you like answering riddles with more riddles!  Don't feel a fool -- no one is yet to answer Carroll's famous riddle 'why is a raven like a writing desk' satisfactorily!  In contrast, GRRM's prophecies are only marginally more transparent...

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20 minutes ago, ravenous reader said:

Once you answer my question -- 'why is a raven like a writing desk...' -- perhaps I will consider letting you in on the secret... ;)

<snip

There's never one around when you need it?
Neither makes a good pillow?
They both taste better with bacon?

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19 hours ago, ravenous reader said:

[Mad Hatter]: 'Why is a raven like a writing-desk?'

Hi Mad Hatter.  :P

Answer:  Because Poe wrote on both.

Alternatively.....

Because it can produce a few notes, though they are very flat; and it is 'nevar' put with the wrong end in front. [Clever Carroll]  ;)

Riddles, riddles, riddles...........  :huh:

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3 hours ago, Wizz-The-Smith said:

Hi Mad Hatter.  :P

Answer:  Because Poe wrote on both.

Alternatively.....

Because it can produce a few notes, though they are very flat; and it is 'nevar' put with the wrong end in front. [Clever Carroll]  ;)

Riddles, riddles, riddles...........  :huh:

He he...Look who's come out of the woodwork..!  The cheeky wordsmith who cannot resist a riddle (that may be another similarity between a raven and a writing desk, namely that they both emerge from the 'wood'!  :P)

I like the Poe answer -- that seems to be a favorite online.  Originally, Carroll omitted to provide a solution, but then, after being continuously pestered to provide one (it appears people just can't bear to live with ambiguity), suggested the clever 'nevar' pun as an 'afterthought' in the preface of the 1896 edition of his book, while simultaneously affirming that the riddle 'had no answer at all':

Quote

 

Enquiries have been so often addressed to me, as to whether any answer to the Hatter's Riddle can be imagined, that I may as well put on record here what seems to me to be a fairly appropriate answer, viz: 'Because it can produce a few notes, tho they are very flat; and it is never put with the wrong end in front!' This, however, is merely an afterthought; the Riddle, as originally invented, had no answer at all.

 

Another version based on Carroll's explanation is that the raven is 'nevar' backwards, which means that it is always forwards ('for words'), just like the writing desk!  'Dark wings, dark words...' and much 'unkindness'... (Ah -- I have it now -- they are both involved in delivering 'killing words'! ;)).  The other thing to consider is whether there might be a difference in whether one asks 'how' (which is usually the way the question is implicitly interpreted) vs. 'why' is a raven like a writing desk (the way Carroll explicitly chose to frame it).  While we might be able to eke out an answer to the 'how,' comparing characteristics and so forth, the 'why' of it might nevertheless remain elusive!

A restatement of this rather vexing game played by the author, also allegedly attributed to Lewis Carroll (although I have not been been able to locate the original reference in order to verify the source, the gist of it serves our purpose here):

Quote

"the riddle has no answer, unless it does. But it doesn't, however it might."

This reminds me of the game GRRM is likewise playing with his readers, in which there does not appear to be any conclusive solution (unless it does, but it doesn't, however it might...):

Quote

"Born amidst salt and smoke, beneath a bleeding star. I know the prophecy." Marwyn turned his head and spat a gob of red phlegm onto the floor. "Not that I would trust it. Gorghan of Old Ghis once wrote that a prophecy is like a treacherous woman. She takes your member in her mouth, and you moan with the pleasure of it and think, how sweet, how fine, how good this is . . . and then her teeth snap shut and your moans turn to screams. That is the nature of prophecy, said Gorghan. Prophecy will bite your prick off every time." He chewed a bit. "Still . . ."

(AFFC - Samwell V)

'Prophecy will bite your prick off every time..,' and yet I've observed several readers, including on this forum, who still get cocky about the 'rightness' of their particular solution to any given prophecy!

I like this solution to the raven and writing desk -- it's so wondrously, whimsically corny:

Quote

Because they are both used to carri-on de-composition.

by Noel Petty.

:D

Could Carroll be making a pun on 'raven' with 'ravin(g)'..? -- it's the 'mad' hatter asking the riddle, after all!  Perhaps we should apply Tom Stoppard's advice in another context to the current enterprise:

Quote

Thomasina: There is no proof, Septimus. The thing that is perfectly obvious is that the note in the margin was a joke to make you all mad.

Tom Stoppard, from 'Arcadia'

 

I also read that Carroll's riddle has been referenced in other works, e.g. rather ingeniously here:

Quote

 ...a play called "The Babel of Circular Labyrinths" by Don Nigro. It is about a blind man in a library in the middle of a labyrinth who is confronted by a woman who is suppose to kill him. He asks her the question and she says "a dead man sits at one and the other sits on a dead man."

 

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12 hours ago, Lady Blizzardborn said:

There's never one around when you need it?
Neither makes a good pillow?
They both taste better with bacon?

There's never one around when you need it? Pen
Neither makes a good pillow? Black or White Pearls
They both taste better with bacon? Eggs

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I've already gone into madness once with ASOIAF, I have a feeling with my desire to solve the riddle, I have begun my descent again...ugh...lol

I will try to decipher what you are saying, in hope there is some answer there to find...I did want to ask about House Hedgehog of the Seven Kingdoms and whether all their prickly members had the ability to burn fiercely?...but that can wait for another time...I have a riddle to solve, that probably can't be solved....I do hope all of you are smiling :D

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30 minutes ago, ravenous reader said:

He he...Look who's come out of the woodwork..!  The cheeky wordsmith who cannot resist a riddle (that may be another similarity between a raven and a writing desk, namely that they both emerge from the 'wood'!  :P)

;)

I like your explanation, clever raven.

33 minutes ago, ravenous reader said:

I like the Poe answer -- that seems to be a favorite online.

I thought you might like that [Edgar Allan] Poe'tic' answer. 

37 minutes ago, ravenous reader said:

Another version based on Carroll's explanation is that the raven is 'nevar' backwards, which means that it is always forwards ('for words'), just like the writing desk!

 Dammit, I missed that one.  Note to self:  Nevar look backwards always look forwords Wizz.  :ph34r:

46 minutes ago, ravenous reader said:

A restatement of this rather vexing game played by the author, also allegedly attributed to Lewis Carroll (although I have not been been able to locate the original reference in order to verify the source, the gist of it serves our purpose here):

Quote

"the riddle has no answer, unless it does. But it doesn't, however it might."

This reminds me of the game GRRM is likewise playing with his readers, in which there does not appear to be any conclusive solution (unless it does, but it doesn't, however it might...):

Haha, yes that sounds familiar.  Huxley had another such nonsensical answer for the riddle that made me chuckle.  He suggested  ''Because there is a 'b' in both and an 'n' in neither."   :lol:  Wonderfully wacky.

52 minutes ago, ravenous reader said:

'Prophecy will bite your prick off every time..,' and yet I've observed several readers, including on this forum, who still get cocky about the 'rightness' of their particular solution to any given prophecy!

Indeed, one should never get 'cock'y about prophecy when the author has given us a clear indication as to where that might lead.  The thought still makes me cringe.  Ouch!!  :blink:

57 minutes ago, ravenous reader said:

I like this solution to the raven and writing desk -- it's so wondrously, whimsically corny:

Quote

Because they are both used to carri-on de-composition.

by Noel Petty.

:D

That's my favourite one, it's so wondrously and whimsically up my street. (Said The (bad) Joker to the Riddler)

1 hour ago, ravenous reader said:

Could Carroll be making a pun on 'raven' with 'ravin(g)'..? -- it's the 'mad' hatter asking the riddle, after all!

I really like that one, it works perfectly.  My dearest Mad 'ravin(g) ravenous riddler' Hatter, you could be on to something there. 

Seriously though, thanks for expanding on some of the ideas I had read about, riddles are always fun.  :D 

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'Why is a raven like a writing-desk?  

They are both liars....  

A Game of Thrones - Bran IV  

"Crows are all liars," Old Nan agreed, from the chair where she sat doing her needlework. "I know a story about a crow."  

There are also these two liars who used a quill  

A Game of Thrones - Eddard XI  

At the council table below, Petyr Baelish lost interest in his quill and leaned forward. "Ser Marq, Ser Karyl, Ser Raymun—perhaps I might ask you a question? These holdfasts were under your protection. Where were you when all this slaughtering and burning was going on?"  

A Game of Thrones - Eddard XIII  

Ned smoothed the paper out across his knee and took up the quill. "At your command, Your Grace."  

I can't believe I'm calling Ned a liar!

 

There's never one around when you need it?   

Pens 

A Game of Thrones - Daenerys VI  

The Western Market was a great square of beaten earth surrounded by warrens of mud-baked brick, animal pens, whitewashed drinking halls. Hummocks rose from the ground like the backs of great subterranean beasts breaking the surface, yawning black mouths leading down to cool and cavernous storerooms below. The interior of the square was a maze of stalls and crookback aisles, shaded by awnings of woven grass. 

  

Neither makes a good pillow?  

Pearls 

A Game of Thrones - Eddard IV  

The Grand Maester smiled gently from his tall chair at the foot of the table. "Well enough for a man of my years, my lord," he replied, "yet I do tire easily, I fear." Wispy strands of white hair fringed the broad bald dome of his forehead above a kindly face. His maester's collar was no simple metal choker such as Luwin wore, but two dozen heavy chains wound together into a ponderous metal necklace that covered him from throat to breast. The links were forged of every metal known to man: black iron and red gold, bright copper and dull lead, steel and tin and pale silver, brass and bronze and platinum. Garnets and amethysts and black pearls adorned the metal-work, and here and there an emerald or ruby. "Perhaps we might begin soon," the Grand Maester said, hands knitting together atop his broad stomach. "I fear I shall fall asleep if we wait much longer."  

 

They both taste better with bacon?  

Eggs 

A Game of Thrones - Daenerys VI  

Dany liked the strangeness of the Eastern Market too, with all its queer sights and sounds and smells. She often spent her mornings there, nibbling tree eggs, locust pie, and green noodles, listening to the high ululating voices of the spellsingers, gaping at manticores in silver cages and immense grey elephants and the striped black-and-white horses of the Jogos Nhai. She enjoyed watching all the people too: dark solemn Asshai'i and tall pale Qartheen, the bright-eyed men of Yi Ti in monkey-tail hats, warrior maids from Bayasabhad, Shamyriana, and Kayakayanaya with iron rings in their nipples and rubies in their cheeks, even the dour and frightening Shadow Men, who covered their arms and legs and chests with tattoos and hid their faces behind masks. The Eastern Market was a place of wonder and magic for Dany.

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22 hours ago, LynnS said:

Manchester United?

Until the day I die, there is only one United! 

They looking good so far but have an easy schedule to start the season. 

Are you a fan of the game? 

 

A Game of Thrones - Sansa VI  

She forced herself to take King Joffrey's hand. The climb was something out of a nightmare; every step was a struggle, as if she were pulling her feet out of ankle-deep mud, and there were more steps than she would have believed, a thousand thousand steps, and horror waiting on the ramparts. 

From the high battlements of the gatehouse, the whole world spread out below them. Sansa could see the Great Sept of Baelor on Visenya's hill, where her father had died. At the other end of the Street of the Sisters stood the fire-blackened ruins of the Dragonpit. To the west, the swollen red sun was half-hidden behind the Gate of the Gods. The salt sea was at her back, and to the south was the fish market and the docks and the swirling torrent of the Blackwater Rush. And to the north …  

She turned that way, and saw only the city, streets and alleys and hills and bottoms and more streets and more alleys and the stone of distant walls. Yet she knew that beyond them was open country, farms and fields and forests, and beyond that, north and north and north again, stood Winterfell.

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6 hours ago, Maester Crypt said:

Until the day I die, there is only one United! 

They looking good so far but have an easy schedule to start the season. 

Are you a fan of the game?

I didn't grow up with the beautiful game.  Hockey and golf were the order of the day in my house.  My experience is limited but I have watched when the occasion presented itself and It's quite exciting to see.  I found this documentary at one time when I was poking around the internet on the subject.    It's not Man U but I hope it puts a smile on your face as much as it did mine.   

 

. "As I was saying … why is it that when one man builds a wall, the next man immediately needs to know what's on the other side?" – Tyrion to Jon  GoT Jon III

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