Ran

[Spoilers] EP706 Discussion

358 posts in this topic

4 hours ago, The Knight of Flours said:

This Arya/Sansa plot is annoying me - Arya is becoming very unlikeable

On the contrary, I'm enjoying the tension between the two. Arya cares for Jon, and although she may be misguided in passive-aggressively attacking Sansa, her heart is in the right place. :D

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2 hours ago, Pandean said:

It's almost as-if Arya thinks Sansa was treated like a Princess or a honored guest when she was in King's Landing and not a hostage.

It's either one of 2 things, both involve a plot twist in the cheesiest way possible.

- Arya is not Arya but is actually the Waif and Arya really died back in Bravos. She seemed very creepy and sounded much like the Waif with her words. Perhaps the Waif or Jaquen Hqar made it to Winterfell before the real Arya and perhaps a nod to the book's Fake Arya.

- Or (this actually makes the most sense) Arya is blackmailing Sansa into killing Littlefinger herself to prove her loyalty to her family again. Look at the way Arya gave Sansa the dagger that was used to try and kill Bran. This is mob speak by Arya to basically prove Sansa's loyalty to House Stark once again or else face the wrath that is Arya. Arya has her sister dead to rights and she finally wins versus Sansa. 

I think it is safe to say that even though the show portrays LF winning the spy game with Arya, it's all a roose :)  Think about it, how the hell can LittleFinger out-spy a Faceless assassin that can morph into anyone they want? Arya has LittleFinger all figured out and how he works the game, she doesnt even need Bran to tell her.

 

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2 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I mentioned in a post last week that Arya is being written like she's still twelve, and now along with that she's being completely stripped of compassion as well. The fact that she doesn't even inquire as to what Sansa's referring to when she mentions how she suffered is a prime example of this.

I do think Maisie and Sophie did a good job with this scene, however. There were two spots in the argument where you could actually she Arya's resolve falter just a bit: when Sansa pointed out that Arya was present for Ned's death and yet didn't do any more than Sansa did to stop it, and when she was forced to realize that, for all her training, Arya didn't do anything to help recapture Winterfell (it also knocked her idolized perception of Jon down a peg when Sansa revealed that he wouldn't have won the battle without the Vale). Unfortunately, show-Arya is incapable of acting rationally at this point, so she just continues to angrily steamroll forward. It's even more mind-numbing when you consider that Sansa's letter didn't have much of an effect on anything: Robb ignored it, and Ned was still beheaded.

We're reminded once again that Sansa isn't trying to usurp Jon when she tells Littlefinger that she's afraid the northern lords will abandon Jon should they discover her letter, since their loyalty to her is the only thing keeping the fickle lords from abandoning Winterfell. The fact that she dismisses Brienne after LF hints at having Brienne kill Arya for her also indicates that she hasn't suddenly started trusting LF and that she doesn't want her sister killed. 

Unless it's revealed that Arya was listening just outside the door for all of this, then I honestly don't know why she hands Sansa the dagger, aside from being a way for the show to build suspense. Did she want to see if Sansa would try to stab her with it? Unfortunately, I don't think they're playing LF, at least not yet. Much like with the Talisa-spy theory, I think this is simply a nonsensical plot that doesn't have a clever explanation.

I think Arya has signed her death sentence by laying it all out to Sansa, and to LF by proxy. When LF points out to Sansa that Brienne has sworn to protect both of the Stark sisters, he simply means that Brienne has to be removed from the picture so that Arya can be dealt with without interruption. Sansa is now savvy at playing the game and she understands what LF implies, and makes up a pretext to send Brienne away. I expect that there will be an attempt to assassinate Arya very soon. The only question is whether her super-ninja-assassin-warrior skills will be enough to protect her.

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I just came to the somewhat belated realization that wights are GoT's equivalent of Orcs - in as much as they're these guys that one can enjoy watching being fried without conflict , guilt ,or thought.

Which is one more reason for me to rate this below "Spoils  of War".

But hey, ice dragon!

Edited by Knight of Ashes

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1 minute ago, Monster_Under_the_Bed said:

I think Arya has signed her death sentence by laying it all out to Sansa, and to LF by proxy. When LF points out to Sansa that Brienne has sworn to protect both of the Stark sisters, he simply means that Brienne has to be removed from the picture so that Arya can be dealt with without interruption. Sansa is now savvy at playing the game and she understands what LF implies, and makes up a pretext to send Brienne away. I expect that there will be an attempt to assassinate Arya very soon. The only question is whether her super-ninja-assassin-warrior skills will be enough to protect her.

Arya can be dealt with? Pfft, Sansa better watch out, and step the truck back, because Arya Stark is hella-scary.

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2 hours ago, Daendrew said:

I was mercilessly mocked for it in 2015 but here we are.

IceBrandon has come.

Your theory, if memory serves, was that there was an ice dragon living inside the wall or the pool at Winterfell (I forget which you were partial to), and his name was Winter, and that's what all the Starks always meant when they said "Winter is coming."  I think a water dragon coming into play with the Greyjoys was a part of it as well.

I say this respectfully, but a dragon getting wightified in the great war doesn't exactly vindicate those theories.

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16 minutes ago, tmug said:

It's either one of 2 things, both involve a plot twist in the cheesiest way possible.

- Arya is not Arya but is actually the Waif and Arya really died back in Bravos. She seemed very creepy and sounded much like the Waif with her words. Perhaps the Waif or Jaquen Hqar made it to Winterfell before the real Arya and perhaps a nod to the book's Fake Arya.

- Or (this actually makes the most sense) Arya is blackmailing Sansa into killing Littlefinger herself to prove her loyalty to her family again. Look at the way Arya gave Sansa the dagger that was used to try and kill Bran. This is mob speak by Arya to basically prove Sansa's loyalty to House Stark once again or else face the wrath that is Arya. Arya has her sister dead to rights and she finally wins versus Sansa. 

I think it is safe to say that even though the show portrays LF winning the spy game with Arya, it's all a roose :)  Think about it, how the hell can LittleFinger out-spy a Faceless assassin that can morph into anyone they want? Arya has LittleFinger all figured out and how he works the game, she doesnt even need Bran to tell her.

 

I feel like Sansa shouldn't have to prove anything. She is loyal to House Stark.

I mean, I know Arya probably has a very poor opinion of Sansa, but still. 

 

Waif!Arya would...make me quit the show 

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3 hours ago, Pandean said:

I found it kind of funny that Arya had/has no desire to wear nice dresses or looks pretty but then threatens to kill Sansa....so she can look pretty and wear nice dresses among other things.

Lol she wasn't threatening to kill Sansa at all. She wanted to scare Sansa I think, but she was letting her know she is on her side. 

Also, even if it was a genuine threat, the reason was not so Arya could wear nice things lol

Edited by Gaz0680

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3 minutes ago, Gaz0680 said:

Lol she wasn't threatening to kill Sansa at all. She wanted to scare Sansa I think, but she was letting her know she is on her side. 

Also, even if it was a genuine threat, the reason was not so Arya could wear nice things lol

I believe it was a threat of some sort.

And I know it wasn't the reason she said so, I just found it funny that that's what she brought up versus, say, being the Lady of Winterfell.

Just considering Arya's approach to anything feminine.

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17 minutes ago, Dawn of Fyre said:

Arya can be dealt with? Pfft, Sansa better watch out, and step the truck back, because Arya Stark is hella-scary.

She is scary and unhinged. Her mistake was in letting Sansa and LF know who/what she is. She also doesn't have any protectors other than Brienne who has been deliberately sent away. The northern army and the Vale knights are loyal to Sansa so unless Arya can kill off 20K men, one by one, she's in a bit of trouble. 

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33 minutes ago, tmug said:

It's either one of 2 things, both involve a plot twist in the cheesiest way possible.

- Arya is not Arya but is actually the Waif and Arya really died back in Bravos. She seemed very creepy and sounded much like the Waif with her words. Perhaps the Waif or Jaquen Hqar made it to Winterfell before the real Arya and perhaps a nod to the book's Fake Arya.

- Or (this actually makes the most sense) Arya is blackmailing Sansa into killing Littlefinger herself to prove her loyalty to her family again. Look at the way Arya gave Sansa the dagger that was used to try and kill Bran. This is mob speak by Arya to basically prove Sansa's loyalty to House Stark once again or else face the wrath that is Arya. Arya has her sister dead to rights and she finally wins versus Sansa. 

I think it is safe to say that even though the show portrays LF winning the spy game with Arya, it's all a roose :)  Think about it, how the hell can LittleFinger out-spy a Faceless assassin that can morph into anyone they want? 

 

There is something very different about Arya's character this season and in Maisie's acting. I cant pinpoint the reason for it.

Arya had always been a strong minded individual who wears her heart on her sleeve. She always spoke her mind directly when something was bothering her and she was very expressive. Maisies acting was too. She was brilliant.

In season 7, Arya is almost a different person and Maisie is definitely playing her more controlled and emotionless, like she has lost touch with most of her humanity.

 Even in the conversations with Sansa this season, Maisie's delivery has been more in line with the Waif than that of Season 1-6 Arya. I also believe this is by design and not just an acting choice from Maisie. 

I see only 3 reasons for this:

1. The writers are taking Arya down an even darker path towards full blown psychopath and the change in delivery of the character is to illustrate that descent.

2. Arya is dead and the Waif is wearing her face. I would absolutely loathe for this to be true but I am genuinely fearful the show may go that way.

3. Arya truly did become No One at end of season 6 and is just playing the part of the old Arya Stark, therefore the true emotion of the real Arya isnt there.

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3 hours ago, Daendrew said:

I was mercilessly mocked for it in 2015 but here we are.

IceBrandon has come.

Can i mock you now just to make up for not being around to mock you the first time? :D 

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2 hours ago, Blood on the Saddle said:

This makes me think that one of the little plot details that might be handled is: somehow they get some more dragon eggs (and before anyone says anything I'm not sure the dragons can't reproduce without sex, there are plants that do it, it is called parthenogenesis) That might make Dany happy

awww that would be so great it that could happen.

I hope Rhageal comes back soon.

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Most importantly, fuck email, send a raven.

 

All the arya hate...at what point did anyone think she is/should be all fine in the head?  She's a killer.  Arya has never forgotten her butcher boy and Sansa not speaking up.  She is not jealous of nice dresses and hairdos, she's disdainful of them.  All that being said, i felt like giving Sansa the knife was a warning, and not only of herself.

 

LF is scared of Arya, he doesn't know quite know how to predict her and knows she can and will kill him without being worried of consequences.  

 

As far as sending Brienne to KL, i think Sansa did it first and foremost because LF tried to push the thought of her (clumsily i thought) on Sansa.

Edited by My friend Alayne Arya mad

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3 hours ago, Lurid Jester said:

Probably being carried across is easier than walking across yourself.  

They already established that wights can be brought across by others in season 1.

Ah yes... Completely forgotten about that. I was fixated on Benjen's explanation that there are ancient spells that prevent the dead from passing through the wall (season 6 episode 6. Also in wiki). Clearly, I need to rewatch and reread the series.

If that's the case, does it mean Benjen could've made it past the wall if the Night's Watch carry him across? Though I'm more inclined to think that Benjen chose to stay behind and fight for the remaining men beyond the wall.

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I was pretty sure Dany was dying in this episode, I was wrong. Seeing the dragon go down was sad. 

 

I loved the ginger line, can't wait to see those shirts. 

 

The whole mission without horses was just dumb. The teleportation was a little bit hard to swallow. 

 

Also I expected to see a romp fest on that boat coming back, slightly disappointed 

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1 hour ago, Gaz0680 said:

1. The writers are taking Arya down an even darker path towards full blown psychopath and the change in delivery of the character is to illustrate that descent.

This is pretty obvious that Arya in the show appears to have "lost it", but I am starting to think Bran saves the day at the last second and reconciles the sisters.

Quote

2. Arya is dead and the Waif is wearing her face. I would absolutely loathe for this to be true but I am genuinely fearful the show may go that way.

I would hate it too, but what a way to cap of those shenanigans Arya getting stabbed in the stomach 3 times and go on living crap back in S6. A cheezy ending for a cheezy storyline. But there is still hope they redeem this plot at Winterfell.

Quote

3. Arya truly did become No One at end of season 6 and is just playing the part of the old Arya Stark, therefore the true emotion of the real Arya isnt there.

If this is true then Arya might as well be the Waif in the spirit of the Faceless Men. She is a Fake Arya lol. I doubt she will ever see Jon again to find out.

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Is it me or are they building up that infamous "bittersweet ending" with something in the lines of Jon dying but Danny bearing his child/children?

A lot of talk lately about how she will never have kids again.

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3 hours ago, kevinbgwrites said:

SThe whole shoehorned plot of catching an undead specimen to force a really contrived situation was crude, and really takes a lot of suspension of disbelief. To go on such a risky quest to get something to convince CERSEI of all people is preposterous.

A lot of people seem to hate the capture-a-zombie scheme. Fair enough, if you don't like it, you don't like it.

I'm curious though -- do people think this is going to be a show-only plotline? Are they going to be angry about it if it shows up in the books too? 'Cos I'm pretty convinced it will do.

Everyone did notice that Jon Snow just travelled through the icy wastelands to the ancient centre of power of the Children, where they first created the WW, right? With 12 companions, a dog, a horse and a sword? Jon is fulfilling the Last Hero role, Dany the Azor Ahai role -- the champions of Ice and of Fire. 

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