Prince_Snow

Arya vs Sansa what are your thoughts?

207 posts in this topic

Hi guys,

I've read and seen many comments on the Arya vs Sansa storyline in this season and specifically this episode 6 which pissed off a lot of people to watch Arya being a psychopathe with no empathy for Sansa.

Even though it felt over dramatised, I think Arya is well aware of LF's game, she is testing Sansa's will to know how much of the young Sansa is left in her, after all they haven't seen each other in a while, she wants to be sure Winterfell is in good hands; I think she's waiting to catch LF and play his game making him loose his guard, before stabbing him in the heart.haha

Well, that is just my thoughts, I don't think D&D and all the writer's team would write a stupid bully psychopathe Arya, she is well trained and saw in this episode that her sister is redeeming herself by fighting for her house ( without her, Ramsey would still be there) and that they will at the end have at least mutual respect if not some sort of sister to sister love.

What are your thoughts about it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I credit D&D for trying to make people have conflicting feelings about Daenerys and Arya these season - two fan favorites.  It takes some balls, and while they are still doing a lot of fan service it is in the spirit of GRRM that they also show beloved characters doing awful things.

That being said, I doubt Arya is just testing Sansa since this would be the dumbest freaking test, and it would be even more condescending and disrespectful to Sansa for Arya to do this.  The writing team has let a lot of characters do a lot of really dumb things for the sake of creating the conflict they want over the last 3 seasons, I wouldn't give them too much credit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the show is trying super hard to get people to see major flaws with Arya.  I mean come on she was acting like a total cunt when all she had to do was say, hey I found this in Littlefinger's room and he said you were wanting it to hide it.  Boom end of drama.  But no....  how many people in this series must die or get screwed because of lack of communication?

Edited by SerJeremiahLouistark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's possible that the sisters are working together to show LF who he truly is. Sansa already has a good idea on how LF prefers to operate. She already knows what he did in kings landing and motives. Arya is also aware of what LF did to her father and with Tywin.

it is not far fetched to believe they are working together.

with that said, I dislike the sibling rivalry here. I understand we need screentime to see these two but it would have been better if Aryas murder with the freys ended mid way in season to avoid this entire rivalry

 

I also predict that the LF will survive until the next season. We can't have Cersie as the main protagonist when the person that is responsible for everything has already died. That's just my opinion but it would be nice to see LF get killed by the person he attempted to sway to his side (Sansa)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, xjlxking said:

It's possible that the sisters are working together to show LF who he truly is. Sansa already has a good idea on how LF prefers to operate. She already knows what he did in kings landing and motives. Arya is also aware of what LF did to her father and with Tywin.

it is not far fetched to believe they are working together.

with that said, I dislike the sibling rivalry here. I understand we need screentime to see these two but it would have been better if Aryas murder with the freys ended mid way in season to avoid this entire rivalry

 

I also predict that the LF will survive until the next season. We can't have Cersie as the main protagonist when the person that is responsible for everything has already died. That's just my opinion but it would be nice to see LF get killed by the person he attempted to sway to his side (Sansa)

Honestly this would be waaaaaaay more interesting than the way I suspect it will play out.  With Bran basically saving the day and telling the sisters what he is and what he has done.  Which is what was eluded to in the conversation between Bran and Littlefinger.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's just really bad writing.  The show writers aren't capable of coming up with believable intrigue. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, SerJeremiahLouistark said:

Honestly this would be waaaaaaay more interesting than the way I suspect it will play out.  With Bran basically saving the day and telling the sisters what he is and what he has done.  Which is what was eluded to in the conversation between Bran and Littlefinger.  

Lol

i keep forgetting about Bran. He might have a part to play. I really hope not because he has turned into a plot device. I do hope he comes out of this mess and explain that he couldn't intervene because "the ink was already dry"

this way, we realize there is a path that he can't really change.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, xjlxking said:

It's possible that the sisters are working together to show LF who he truly is. Sansa already has a good idea on how LF prefers to operate. She already knows what he did in kings landing and motives.

Its not possible, its makes no sense. LF is playing Arya not necessarily Sansa. He wants to divide them and hes getting the reaction from Arya by planting seeds of information and doubt in her head. Personally I dont like this storyline and its just a way to get rid of LF, its as simple as that. Sansa does know what he is capable of and thats why she is wary and does not trust him or his intentions 

5 minutes ago, xjlxking said:

Arya is also aware of what LF did to her father and with Tywin.

What did LF do to her father and whatever he did how does she know????

5 minutes ago, xjlxking said:

it is not far fetched to believe they are working together.

It is....

5 minutes ago, xjlxking said:

with that said, I dislike the sibling rivalry here. I understand we need screentime to see these two but it would have been better if Aryas murder with the freys ended mid way in season to avoid this entire rivalry

Sibling rivalry is for one pointless and senseless act, to kill LF.

5 minutes ago, xjlxking said:

I also predict that the LF will survive until the next season. We can't have Cersie as the main protagonist when the person that is responsible for everything has already died. That's just my opinion but it would be nice to see LF get killed by the person he attempted to sway to his side (Sansa)

Bran reveals the truth = Sansa gives the command = Arya kills him :o 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well since the mods will NOT allow me to post this in a thread, maybe it can remain here without deletion

****************************************************

Now in ep6...

In Arya's room Sansa finds the faces.  Some people are already bashing Arya, etc.  What she laid down in her dialogue was some pretty deep and compelling stuff.

She talked to Sansa about how they wanted to be other people when they were young.  Sansa wanted to be a Queen sitting next to a young king.  Arya wanted to have a sword to go out to battle like their father.  But Arya goes really deep and maybe some of you missed it.  She talks about her training and how she learned how to be other people.  To impersonate them, to use their voice, to BE them.  And all she needs is their face.

She approaches Sansa concerning "all I would need to be you - the Lady of Winterfell - is YOUR FACE".  What does this mean, exactly?  You have to look deeper.

The implications of this are quite profound.  The comparative nature of what/who hey wanted to be as children and how it turned out they "don't get chances to choose as girls".  But Arya did choose.  She went somewhere to train to be a Faceless Man.  She can becomes anyone.  What now does this mean for Sansa?  All Arya needs is her face to become The Lady Of Winterfell.  Sansa has not really evolved at all.  She is just using her face/name/title as her identity.

That doesn't say much of what Sansa has become.  It means all anyone would have to do to BE Sansa is to wear her face!  Put on her clothing, speak like her, and *blam* Sansa has been replaced.  Hence Arya "you always did like nice things" and "I saw you as our rather was killed wearing your fancy clothes and nice hair" and in the letter "they (the Lannisters are treating me well" and basically Sansa has never had to wear rags or crawl in the mud at any point in her life.  Unlike most of Westeros that has been put down LOW.  Sansa even talks about how she has endured things you (Arya) can't imagine as if Sansa's woes were so much greater than that of others.

ALSO, Sansa "you should be on your knees thanking me for saving Winterfell" when she just simply called upon someone else to come help - not doing it herself.  Arya, on the other hand, has done EVERYTHING herself.  And her "training" that Sansa scoffs at, has kept her alive - unlike Sansa who has been kept alive and safe by others throughout the whole story.

As I have been saying for almost all of season 7 now, Sansa is not irreplaceable.  She has no skills or abilities that cannot be impersonated or are unique to her and only her.  All she has is a face and a voice.  Arya can BECOME her if she wants to. If they impersonate her corporeal persona and wear her fancy clothes, they can BE her.  Unlike Arya, who has many other diverse skills that cannot be impersonated by simply wearing her face.

I thought this was pretty heavy and is bringing the comparison between the two sisters to very fascinating heights.  And I think that was the underlying point Arya has being making toward Sansa all along.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bran won't have anything to do with this intrigue.  His head is in another place, perhaps time.  He has bigger fish to fry than littlefinger, or littlefinger would already have been fried.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Arya is sincerely worried that Sansa is too weak and fearful to be trusted not to betray the family again. She's pushing Sansa so that, if she is still driven by fear, she will break now, before Arya starts to trust her, rather than later, when she can hurt Arya more.

I think the result will be Sansa deciding to stand up to both Arya and Littlefinger by taking care of LF in some bold, public way before Arya can do anything to anyone in her sneaky way. In which case you could sort of say that "Sansa passed Arya's test", but I don't think Arya meant it as a test, only as a defense against being hurt by Sansa.

If that's the way they're going, I don't have a problem with that.

Except that I'm pretty sure the sisters will immediately reconcile and forget all the crap they did to each other earlier in the season as soon as this happens, because they've only got a few hours of show left and there's no time for the slower and more painful process that it would take in real life. Which will be disappointing, but I guess I can live with it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Arya is in desperate need of having her head mounted on a spike. She is certainly not helping her family's cause.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Iron Mother said:

Well since the mods will NOT allow me to post this in a thread, maybe it can remain here without deletion

****************************************************

Now in ep6...

In Arya's room Sansa finds the faces.  Some people are already bashing Arya, etc.  What she laid down in her dialogue was some pretty deep and compelling stuff.

She talked to Sansa about how they wanted to be other people when they were young.  Sansa wanted to be a Queen sitting next to a young king.  Arya wanted to have a sword to go out to battle like their father.  But Arya goes really deep and maybe some of you missed it.  She talks about her training and how she learned how to be other people.  To impersonate them, to use their voice, to BE them.  And all she needs is their face.

She approaches Sansa concerning "all I would need to be you - the Lady of Winterfell - is YOUR FACE".  What does this mean, exactly?  You have to look deeper.

The implications of this are quite profound.  The comparative nature of what/who hey wanted to be as children and how it turned out they "don't get chances to choose as girls".  But Arya did choose.  She went somewhere to train to be a Faceless Man.  She can becomes anyone.  What now does this mean for Sansa?  All Arya needs is her face to become The Lady Of Winterfell.  Sansa has not really evolved at all.  She is just using her face/name/title as her identity.

That doesn't say much of what Sansa has become.  It means all anyone would have to do to BE Sansa is to wear her face!  Put on her clothing, speak like her, and *blam* Sansa has been replaced.  Hence Arya "you always did like nice things" and "I saw you as our rather was killed wearing your fancy clothes and nice hair" and in the letter "they (the Lannisters are treating me well" and basically Sansa has never had to wear rags or crawl in the mud at any point in her life.  Unlike most of Westeros that has been put down LOW.  Sansa even talks about how she has endured things you (Arya) can't imagine as if Sansa's woes were so much greater than that of others.

ALSO, Sansa "you should be on your knees thanking me for saving Winterfell" when she just simply called upon someone else to come help - not doing it herself.  Arya, on the other hand, has done EVERYTHING herself.  And her "training" that Sansa scoffs at, has kept her alive - unlike Sansa who has been kept alive and safe by others throughout the whole story.

As I have been saying for almost all of season 7 now, Sansa is not irreplaceable.  She has no skills or abilities that cannot be impersonated or are unique to her and only her.  All she has is a face and a voice.  Arya can BECOME her if she wants to. If they impersonate her corporeal persona and wear her fancy clothes, they can BE her.  Unlike Arya, who has many other diverse skills that cannot be impersonated by simply wearing her face.

I thought this was pretty heavy and is bringing the comparison between the two sisters to very fascinating heights.  And I think that was the underlying point Arya has being making toward Sansa all along.

Heavy indeed, and perhaps you have uncovered the actual trap Arya is setting for LF.....All Arya needs is Sansa's face to be her. Make me wonder, aside from the depth of meaning you protray, if Arya is trying to lure him in to making her an offer to become Sansa.  Such treachery would mean death for LF.  The whole diatribe about what being faceless means would start to make sense.....While it scared the bejeezus out of Sansa, she is really trying to get Littlefinger to see the benefit of betraying Sansa, much like he's done to others throughout the story.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Illiterati said:

Heavy indeed, and perhaps you have uncovered the actual trap Arya is setting for LF.....All Arya needs is Sansa's face to be her. Make me wonder, aside from the depth of meaning you protray, if Arya is trying to lure him in to making her an offer to become Sansa.  Such treachery would mean death for LF.  The whole diatribe about what being faceless means would start to make sense.....While it scared the bejeezus out of Sansa, she is really trying to get Littlefinger to see the benefit of betraying Sansa, much like he's done to others throughout the story.

You say Arya is trying to work through LF?  I don't get that.  Sansa would have to confide in LF (who currently is trying to get Sansa to have Brienne take out Arya) about the faces and that Arya told her all she needs is her face. 

That seems a little backward?  Arya isn't the one communicating with LF -- Sansa is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Iron Mother said:

You say Arya is trying to work through LF?  I don't get that.  Sansa would have to confide in LF (who currently is trying to get Sansa to have Brienne take out Arya) about the faces and that Arya told her all she needs is her face. 

That seems a little backward?  Arya isn't the one communicating with LF -- Sansa is.

No, Sansa doesn't need to confide in Littlefinger.  He has spied on the entire conversation by some means.  Sansa's reminding LF about Brienne stopping Arya from attacking her, then sending Brienne away, was all the direct communication needed for the scheme to work.

LF will think that there is no one to stop Arya from killing Sansa, so he will now attempt to orchestrate that.....just as the sisters plan.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Illiterati said:

No, Sansa doesn't need to confide in Littlefinger.  He has spied on the entire conversation by some means.  Sansa's reminding LF about Brienne stopping Arya from attacking her, then sending Brienne away, was all the direct communication needed for the scheme to work.

LF will think that there is no one to stop Arya from killing Sansa, so he will now attempt to orchestrate that.....just as the sisters plan.

That makes more sense.  But I genuinely do not believe Sansa is acting this whole time.  She seems genuinely freaked out by Arya.  So if there is a scheme, it would have to be Arya playing it by herself against LF and then later will explain to Sansa what she was doing.

Sansa was the one who always said "I'm not a good liar.  And for them to assume behind closed doors LF is monitoring their conversations?  I don't know about that.  They haven't spat out in the open.  LF only knows what Sansa has been telling him.  And I don't think she can pull all this off the way we are seeing it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sansa has a bit of a timid personality, even when she is showing strength.  I'd wager Arya could tell her, "look, I'm gonna go after you HARD, it's for the game," and it would STILL frighten her.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now