Samwell_Tarly

Viserion....

122 posts in this topic

5 minutes ago, Sumit7Saini said:

When NK touches undead creatures, they turn into WW. So,if that's so, it can be killed with dragonstone / valyrian steel.

Viserion was dead, not undead. And we've never seen NK touch an undead creature in the show turning into a WW.

 

Assuming you mean undead=wight and not undead=alive. Still Viserion was deceased before resurrection.

Edited by Eddard Scissorhands

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On 8/22/2017 at 3:36 AM, SerJeremiahLouistark said:

I think he has to be in order to breathe fire or nitrogen or whatever it is.  

Will viserion still exhale fire , but with complete combustion giving it blue color or even better Ice?

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On 8/22/2017 at 3:43 AM, falcotron said:

But dragons don't walk around, so he can't be a White Walker. And White Flyer sounds even sillier than White Walker. :)

Anyway, what differences would it make?

1. Viserion could fly around raising corpses hundreds of miles off the main army's path. Which would be cool, but then the NK could do that himself just by riding a wighted Viserion.

2. He's not susceptible to fire like a wight. I don't think they were going to take him out in a big two-on-one dragon battle, but I suppose this could be the reason Dany doesn't even try it.

3. He is susceptible to dragonglass, unlike a wight. I don't think they'll take him out this way, but it could be an explanation for how they can keep him at bay with dragonglass-tipped arrows and artillery, so he doesn't just decimate the human armies like Dany in 704.

4. Either way, he's susceptible to Valyrian steel. And I think that's always been D&D's plan. Even since they announced Gendry would eventually return to the show, my suspicion has been that Sam will discover some information, bring it to KL, put it together with some other information he learns there and come up with something that allows Gendry to forge a Big Secret Weapon that turns the course of the war. The obvious possibility now is that what he learns in KL is the secret to the Qyburn Smauginator, and the Big Secret Weapon is a Smauginator Mk II with a Valyrian steel bolt. Presumably made by melting down one of the multiple Chekhov's Weapons now floating around.

May be Bran would be able to control Viserion *as it is not dead*. And burn all the wights with fire(blue). And while doing do it sacrifices with its existence(destroyed by NK).

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On 8/22/2017 at 3:50 AM, Old Blue Eyes said:

I doubt Viserion can be saved, seeing as how he dumped his guts all over that frozen lake as he came down.  That was graphic and tough to watch.  Worse than the Red Wedding as far as shock value, imo.

Remember it is a world of Magic, where John Snow, Beric Dondarrion can be brought to life.

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On 8/22/2017 at 4:29 AM, Apoplexy said:

If he is the NK mount, how does the NK make him fly in a particular direction. Dany has a connection with the dragons, so does that mean the NK touching the dragon was intentional to ensure he has a connection with Viserion? 

Now Viseron is a white walker. NK must be able to control his WWs in some magical way. As dead when raised fight for their WWs.

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On 8/22/2017 at 4:44 AM, Apoplexy said:

The reason I wondered that was dragons are different from regular wights. They are a part of fire magic and maybe hence the need to touch.

May be viserion was not dead by that point and was just unconscious. And NK found it would be better to make it a WW instead of wight. Because WW are more *powerfull* than wights.

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On 8/22/2017 at 5:13 AM, nscheffel said:

I think it's pretty clear we are about to see Jon riding the dragon named after his father, and Drogon is going to kill Viserion. 

It's about as clear as the Hound killing the Mountain.

I agree with you Nscheffel. But Drogon cant kill Viserion by its fire.

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Viserion was dead and brought back to life.  Jon was dead and brought back to life.  The NK will not be the only one who can control Viserion, Jon will eventually fin out that he can. I always thought Jone would ride Viserion, not Rheagal.  In the books he will ride a white dragon with Ghost (a white direwolf) on the found fighting with him.  In the  show, it will be an undead dragon for am undead Jon.

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53 minutes ago, TheValonqarThatWasAzorAhai said:

Viserion was dead and brought back to life.  Jon was dead and brought back to life.  The NK will not be the only one who can control Viserion, Jon will eventually fin out that he can. I always thought Jone would ride Viserion, not Rheagal.  In the books he will ride a white dragon with Ghost (a white direwolf) on the found fighting with him.  In the  show, it will be an undead dragon for am undead Jon.

ohh that would be so cool

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Honestly, this whole scene annoyed me. I felt like D&D said "we can't think of a good way for Dany to actually have trouble winning, so lets make a zombie dragon! Wouldn't that be cool!" Then just desperately through together some terrible, terrible plan that facilitates the night king getting a zombie dragon.

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You guys are all overthinking/ hyping this so much. Viserion will just be an undead dragon for the NK to ride and control, nothing more. And Jon will ride Rhaegal, and he won't be able to control Viserion in any way that wouldn't make any sense.

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4 minutes ago, TywinBestCharacter said:

Honestly, this whole scene annoyed me. I felt like D&D said "we can't think of a good way for Dany to actually have trouble winning, so lets make a zombie dragon! Wouldn't that be cool!" Then just desperately through together some terrible, terrible plan that facilitates the night king getting a zombie dragon.

I honestly don't understand why people assume the books will be completely different than the show. As if GRRM hasn't already given them the outlines and as many details as he possibly can, as they've all stated numerous times. 

GRRM has Writing & Co-Executive Producer credit on every single episode. You think he would allow that if he hated what they're doing?

Sure, they've cut characters and storylines, combined characters, and had to change some things due to the impossibility of filming scenes such as the chain for Blackwater. In my opinion, all for the better. 

But the the chances the main arcs and endings for all the major characters are going to be the same as the book, are high I think. No reason really to think otherwise.

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Just now, ShadowKitteh said:

I honestly don't understand why people assume the books will be completely different than the show. As if GRRM hasn't already given them the outlines and as many details as he possibly can, as they've all stated numerous times. 

GRRM has Writing & Co-Executive Producer credit on every single episode. You think he would allow that if he hated what they're doing?

Sure, they've cut characters and storylines, combined characters, and had to change some things due to the impossibility of filming scenes such as the chain for Blackwater. In my opinion, all for the better. 

But the the chances the main arcs and endings for all the major characters are going to be the same as the book, are high I think. No reason really to think otherwise.

I'm pretty sure that the Others in the books will also get their hands on a dragon for sure, probably even one of Dany's dragons based on this episode. The circumstances under which this happens will be much better thought out I'm pretty sure too though.

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5 minutes ago, Brightstar_ said:

I'm pretty sure that the Others in the books will also get their hands on a dragon for sure, probably even one of Dany's dragons based on this episode. The circumstances under which this happens will be much better thought out I'm pretty sure too though.

I'd like to hear your "better thought out" scenario. 

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10 hours ago, ShadowKitteh said:

I'd like to hear your "better thought out" scenario. 

Lol, I won't pretend I could do it any better. I'm not a screenwriter though and I have full confidence in GRRM to think of that scenario for me, which is why people buy his books, and why the series became so immensely popular. And now that the screenwriters only know critical plot points, but can't piggyback the books anymore on how to get there, we get poorly thought out stuff.

This "as if you can do better" argument is so pointless.

Edited by Brightstar_

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On 23/08/2017 at 4:54 AM, Bran's Tourney said:

One can hope. Unfortunately it doesn't appear that the show is much concerned with the consistencies of the various magics. 

I don't think the dragons have been shown to be that magic (other than perhaps the circumstances in which they hatched, although just needing intense heat is still more biological than magical.)

They're flesh and blood, use their wings to fly, and create fire using chemicals that shoot out of openings by their mouths. It's very easy to believe they're biologically possible rather than needing fantasy magic to exist like the wights. 

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All in all, as much as it costs us, it was a good move for Viserion to agree to join the dead in what's certainly the most shocking transfer of this summer.

I mean, he never did much throughout these years, and Dany was actually trying to figure out how to use him less.

I don't think that will be a problem with the NK. He'll hopefully try to use him as much as possible, to full effect.

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On 8/21/2017 at 5:57 PM, Dragonandwolf said:

If hes a walker with Valyrian steel maybe?

Maybe Sam will find a way to save him :)

Sam will read in an ancient scroll that the cure for Othered Dragons is to rip off the ice scales to reveal the original scales underneath, then apply a topical ointment.

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23 hours ago, Sumit7Saini said:

When NK touches undead creatures, they turn into WW. So,if that's so, it can be killed with dragonstone / valyrian steel.

Thats theory isn't supported by any evidence.  

Anywhere.  

So far we have seen the children create the NK by plunging dragonglass into his chest. 

We've seen the NK touch a baby and turn it's eyes blue. We assume that baby will grow up to be a walker, but we don't definitively know.  For all we know he could be seasoning the baby for a banquet.  

We've seen the NK raise hundreds of wights at Hardhome, without touching.

We've seen the NK touch Viserion and turn his eyes blue.  

We know that D&D are horribly inconsistent now for the sake of expediency. We also know they budget their money.  Hell they changed the dragon glass from being purely anti-WW to anti-everything.  

I find it more likely that it cost much less to have the chain + touch raise Viserion as an undead dragon than it would have to have a reanimated undead Viserion burst forth dramatically from the ice.  

So I find it unlikely that it will be a wight dragon as opposed to an undead dragon. 

But we are talking about D&D who are horribly inconsistent.  

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17 hours ago, Brightstar_ said:

I'm pretty sure that the Others in the books will also get their hands on a dragon for sure, probably even one of Dany's dragons based on this episode. The circumstances under which this happens will be much better thought out I'm pretty sure too though.

This is what I'm hoping/assuming is the case: that Martin said stuff like "the Others kill Viserion and turn him into a wight" without going into all the detail that makes it seem like a natural event and not contrived for excitement.

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