Gaston de Foix

The Unholy Consult post-release SPOILER thread IV

389 posts in this topic

2 hours ago, unJon said:

Huh. So the "pigs" that the Nonmen were eating were Emwama not really pigs. I like that. Haven't heard anyone suggest that before. But roasted nonmen smells like lamb and roasted man smells like pork so I can see it. 

Wait what, no.  Oirunal says that the Emwama feed the Reduced.  I think the Emwama raise pigs along with all the agricultural necessities of the Mansion.  The Boatman is only in charge of feeding the guys in the deepest dark.

Edited by Ajûrbkli

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44 minutes ago, Ajûrbkli said:

Wait what, no.  Oirunal says that the Emwama feed the Reduced.  I think the Emwama raise pigs along with all the agricultural necessities of the Mansion.  The Boatman is only in charge of feeding the guys in the deepest dark.

Great, then it can be my theory and I don't need to credit you. 

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I  mean, Sorweel would notice the pigs were people, right?  There was an earlier scene where Kellhus clearly feeds Proyas human, but Proyas thinks it's pork.   But the Boatman is just tossing out carcasses, and Oirunas has a collection of pig skulls (though with the Emwama's deformation..)

Edited by Ajûrbkli

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I will accept Kals proviso that Bakker isn't as much a troll as I (trollishly) assert, because I like the philosophical vs narrative binary kal is establishing.

just so it's clear to everyone, I am obviously working my way backward from a conclusion and wildly revising  and misinterpreting to fit everything into said conclusion. Because I'm human. it's what we do. But because my reasoning is suspect and likely invalid doesn't  mean Im rejecting what I think, stopped clocks and all that.

Edited by lokisnow

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5 hours ago, Ajûrbkli said:

I  mean, Sorweel would notice the pigs were people, right?  There was an earlier scene where Kellhus clearly feeds Proyas human, but Proyas thinks it's pork.   But the Boatman is just tossing out carcasses, and Oirunas has a collection of pig skulls (though with the Emwama's deformation..)

Emwama deformation plus Amiolas messing with his head? I'd need to go back and re-read to see if anything there. 

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Quote

And, as you and others constant angst shows you are butthurt. Alt-Butthurt that is.

Apologies if there were any alts that I missed. I just feel like all your posts since the AMA are you starting fights (something I'm guilty of too I think) and making random accusations and shouting at people to provide you with links to things that you made up. I could use your same routine and say that you and Bakker's other fanboys (including all the sockpuppets) are just butthurt that their favorite author is being criticized, and they've bought into this whole "it's not Bakker's fault" knee jerk reaction. It reminded me of the post linked recently here where an author says that Bakker claimed his books aren't misogynistic, our brains are just hardwired in the wrong way. Cool. 

On a side note, I went to TSA yesterday to see what you were going on about and the first thing I saw was a thread called "making the community better". I didn't know whether to laugh or cry. 

Eta. Also, some of his fanboys have spent too much time around Bakker that they've come to see his online behavior (trolling, lying, alts/sockpuppets) as normal or funny when it's not. I mean someone said recently here that he was never rude to me personally. Well, we don't know each other personally and we only interact through the forum, and lying to people repeatedly and over extended periods of time is not cool, in fact a lot of people would see it as rude as hell, not sure if Bakker falls in that category.

This reminds me that I almost forgot about Pierce Inverarity.

Edited by Hello World

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On 9/5/2017 at 0:45 AM, Darth Richard II said:

People are defending the MRA dragon.

I was reading the last hundred pages of TUC around the same time that I had started Zoe Quinn's memoir, so I got a HUGE kick out of Serwa being a fucking savage to the GamerGate dragon. Like, she literally calls it a virgin while running around mocking it for never having seen vagina.

Oh yeah, and Quinn's twitter handle is "Unburnt Witch".

That was just fantastic.

EDIT: Now that I think of it, was that what Bakker was going for, yeah? I mean, not literally a GamerGate parallel, but the the image of a burnt up, naked woman, a witch, fighting a giant phallic dragon that's howling about "cunny". I kinda like the symbolism there.

Imma have to go back and read the spoiler threads to see where the discussion is at...

Edited by Let's Get Kraken

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No, no. You guys have repeatedly pointed to the AMA as your disappointment in the series. I can go and quote all of them. But, I don't have to, you already know this. Its so funny, your gonna argue with me either way. You've all been complaining that the AMA ruined the books. When I bring it up and ask why and to provide a link for your angst, you then say no, it's not the AMA it's that we're upset we didn't get answers. Its hilarious. Darth Richard has made a living in this thread pouting to the AMA, as others. Yet, no one can show why the AMA ruined it. 

Oh, your not a fanboy, all of you who've spent a years and thousand of posts on these thread? Your a different breed, huh? What a joke. All I was trying to do was revert the conversation back to the books, in the beginning. But, I kept getting directed to the AMA and how it ruined everything, but still no proof of that. 

Have fun in your little echo chamber here at Westeros. Were you pay each other on the back, gang up on people with views other than your own. So, funny. Never heard of a echo chamber before, when I did, first thought was Westeros. In every respect. Political, Bakker or whatever. Lets all agree and when someone comes in with a different view let's degrade him, rip his arguments to shreds by picking and choosing what we wanna talk about. A joke. Pure joke. Its why Trump won and why he'll win again, because of people like these. Your too dumb to listen to the other side. In any regards. And, it's sad, so sad. Your misery and close mindness shows on all levels. Just pay each other on the back fellows 

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2 minutes ago, Michael Seswatha Jordan said:

No, no. You guys have repeatedly pointed to the AMA as your disappointment in the series. I can go and quote all of them. But, I don't have to, you already know this. Its so funny, your gonna argue with me either way. You've all been complaining that the AMA ruined the books. When I bring it up and ask why and to provide a link for your angst, you then say no, it's not the AMA it's that we're upset we didn't get answers. Its hilarious. Darth Richard has made a living in this thread pouting to the AMA, as others. Yet, no one can show why the AMA ruined it. 

Oh, your not a fanboy, all of you who've spent a years and thousand of posts on these thread? Your a different breed, huh? What a joke. All I was trying to do was revert the conversation back to the books, in the beginning. But, I kept getting directed to the AMA and how it ruined everything, but still no proof of that. 

Have fun in your little echo chamber here at Westeros. Were you pay each other on the back, gang up on people with views other than your own. So, funny. Never heard of a echo chamber before, when I did, first thought was Westeros. In every respect. Political, Bakker or whatever. Lets all agree and when someone comes in with a different view let's degrade him, rip his arguments to shreds by picking and choosing what we wanna talk about. A joke. Pure joke. Its why Trump won and why he'll win again, because of people like these. Your too dumb to listen to the other side. In any regards. And, it's sad, so sad. Your misery and close mindness shows on all levels. Just pay each other on the back fellows 

There's like a discussion of the book going on between all these derailment posts (from both sides of the debate).

It's like the stages of grief, just let it play out.

And I'm nearly sure in the prior thread that there's a @Kalbear post that quotes the various answers from the AMA that people here are reacting to. 

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26 minutes ago, Michael Seswatha Jordan said:

Lets all agree and when someone comes in with a different view let's degrade him, rip his arguments to shreds by picking and choosing what we wanna talk about. A joke. Pure joke. Its why Trump won and why he'll win again, because of people like these. Your too dumb to listen to the other side. In any regards. And, it's sad, so sad. Your misery and close mindness shows on all levels. Just pay each other on the back fellows 

Jesus Christ dude...

Look, I've felt ganged up on for sticking with unpopular opinions before. Not so much here, but elsewhere. But go back and read over what you just said. You basically attacked the entire forum, called us all sad (blatant troll tactics), and said that we were part of the reason that Trump got elected. There are also like, a lot of typos there. So if you're getting frustrated with people mocking you, meltdowns like this just provide more ammunition.

Now, I don't have a dog in this fight, and I want to keep it that way. Having finished the book, I agree with a lot of the sentiment being expressed in this thread. There are some things I was pretty disappointed in that I'll get into in another post when I've had some time to compile my thoughts. That being said, I also think the people calling Bakker a troll and a liar are being a bit disingenuous. To put it another way, I see butthurt on both sides.

So why don't we all chill the fuck out for a moment and remember that nobody reads through seven books of something that they hate. We're all here because we're fans of The Second Apocalypse. That does not mean that the series and the author's conduct are beyond criticism. So go take a walk, smoke some weed, watch a cat video, whatever. But hurling insults at the forum en masse is not going to gain you any sympathy points here.

And FWIW, this thread really isn't being that unfair to Bakker. If you think it is I'd advise you not to gaze into the Inverse Fire open the Rothfuss thread.

Edited by Let's Get Kraken

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Stay civil to one another, folks, and lets not make this about one another.

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16 minutes ago, Michael Seswatha Jordan said:

No, no. You guys have repeatedly pointed to the AMA as your disappointment in the series. I can go and quote all of them. But, I don't have to, you already know this. Its so funny, your gonna argue with me either way. You've all been complaining that the AMA ruined the books. When I bring it up and ask why and to provide a link for your angst, you then say no, it's not the AMA it's that we're upset we didn't get answers. Its hilarious. Darth Richard has made a living in this thread pouting to the AMA, as others. Yet, no one can show why the AMA ruined it. 

Oh, your not a fanboy, all of you who've spent a years and thousand of posts on these thread? Your a different breed, huh? What a joke. All I was trying to do was revert the conversation back to the books, in the beginning. But, I kept getting directed to the AMA and how it ruined everything, but still no proof of that. 

Have fun in your little echo chamber here at Westeros. Were you pay each other on the back, gang up on people with views other than your own. So, funny. Never heard of a echo chamber before, when I did, first thought was Westeros. In every respect. Political, Bakker or whatever. Lets all agree and when someone comes in with a different view let's degrade him, rip his arguments to shreds by picking and choosing what we wanna talk about. A joke. Pure joke. Its why Trump won and why he'll win again, because of people like these. Your too dumb to listen to the other side. In any regards. And, it's sad, so sad. Your misery and close mindness shows on all levels. Just pay each other on the back fellows 

OK look, I am aware of the hypocrisy and irony of me saying this, but you have to stop with the insults. It helps nobody and it takes away from any validness any argument you try and make.

You accused me of dodging a question and demanded I not parrot kalbear, and I did so, three times, and you still kept accusing me, then disappeared for a bit, because, well I dunno. I can you show you screenshots and timestamps where I answer the damn question three times. (Maybe four, I don't feel like backtracking through that mess). You come in here, demand answers, and when you don't like them, start screaming and throwing insults around. It makes you look crazy, honestly. And as long as I'm being hypocritical, we can tell when you're getting really upset, your spelling starts to get real weird.

As for the echo chamber accusation, if you think TSA forum is any less of an echo chamber then here, well, I dunno what to tell you. Bakker has the whole thing about how tribe thinking is bad that I should see if I can pull up, cause damn, that's irony.

(Also, I would quit it with the Trump stuff, unless you're trying to get banned, in which case good luck)

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43 minutes ago, Michael Seswatha Jordan said:

All I was trying to do was revert the conversation back to the books, in the beginning.

No you weren't. In fact the first post that you made after over a week of not posting here (and the one that started this argument) was this:

Quote

I went over AMA and never seen any statement by Bakker that all theories and such were meaningless. Just that meaningless (TNG) was brought into a meaningful world. Granted, in not saying he didn't say it, I could of missed it. Could someone link it please?

And it was pointed out that no one made the claim that Bakker said all the theories are meaningless, yet you keep trolling. The rest of your post and insults are childish as usual.

By the way, it's perfectly fine for people to discuss the AMA here and express any sort of disappointment they have with what Bakker said without being shouted at and accused of "butthurtness" and other schoolyard things. (Unless I'm wrong about this and the "don't discuss what's posted on other forums rule" applies to reddit, in which case I apologize.) And people have said over and over what they didn't like about the AMA.

Edited by Hello World

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I wonder if we will ever see his notes. Maybe after he dies or something like that. 

 

One of the biggest issue I have with the series is the feeling that there's so much more happening... reading the glossary is way more interesting than it should be. 

 

How many stories did Bakker hide from us ? How would TUC be with those instead of the canibalism ? ...

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27 minutes ago, Lutarez said:

I wonder if we will ever see his notes. Maybe after he dies or something like that. 

 

One of the biggest issue I have with the series is the feeling that there's so much more happening... reading the glossary is way more interesting than it should be. 

 

How many stories did Bakker hide from us ? How would TUC be with those instead of the canibalism ? ...

Well, I'm sure a bunch of people will start screaming at me for this, but I thought one of the reasons we're all so "butthurt" is that there ISN'T any thing else happening.

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I'm done ok. Regardless of what I say or how it comes across, I'm the enemy. So I just don't care to continue.

Darth, you explained what you said about the Ark. I seen it, over it. Sorry for throwing insults your way. Please forgive, that all I can ask for and say I'm sorry. Hope you accept.

What I meant by the Trump thing is that when you don't take other views into account and ignore a segment of people, things happen like Trump. This thread/forum has always been a place where if you don't agree with the majority, you are ganged up upon. If you all can't see that, then your view of reality is skewed. 

And so, into @Hello World, I had another poster of this thread, not one of the few mind you, pm me. His sentiments are the same as mine, and said he was glad I was saying what I have been. We talked. I said that this thread got me to love Bakker, the enlightening posts, the just all-around genius of so many of you. But, since the AMA, that's all this thread has been about. And, your wrong, if you go back further, I tried to steer conversation towards things moving forward in the books. But, again, I kept getting comments like "let it go" and "its in the AMA, it's all meaningless, just get over it man". When all I was trying to do was bring the thread back to discussing the books, not the author or each other. Then, yes, I got out of line and did the same shit and derailing the thread. Sorry, is all I can say. But, this poster noted all the same things I did, that the thread had turned into a Bakker hate fest and it was sad. Its not only me that sees it, I'm just the only one with enough balls to call you guys on it.

Sorry, for my non-editing. In mmy anger and haste, spell-check does what spell-check does. Sorry, guess that makes me illiterate...

Edited by Michael Seswatha Jordan

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31 minutes ago, Michael Seswatha Jordan said:

I'm done ok. Regardless of what I say or how it comes across, I'm the enemy. So I just don't care to continue.

Darth, you explained what you said about the Ark. I seen it, over it. Sorry for throwing insults your way. Please forgive, that all I can ask for and say I'm sorry. Hope you accept.

What I meant by the Trump thing is that when you don't take other views into account and ignore a segment of people, things happen like Trump. This thread/forum has always been a place where if you don't agree with the few, you are ganged up upon. If you all can't see that, then your view of reality is skewed. 

And so, into @Hello World, I had another poster of this thread, not one of the few mind you, pm me. His sentiments are the same as mine, and said he was glad I was saying what I have been. We talked. I said that this thread got me to love Bakker, the enlightening posts, the just all-around genius of so many of you. But, since the AMA, that's all this thread has been about. And, your wrong, if you go back further, I tried to steer conversation towards things moving forward in the books. But, again, I kept getting comments like "let it go" and "its in the AMA, it's all meaningless, just get over it man". When all I was trying to do was bring the thread back to discussing the books, not the author or each other. Then, yes, I got out of line and did the same shit and derailing the thread. Sorry, is all I can say. But, this poster noted all the same things I did, that the thread had turned into a Bakker hate fest and it was sad. Its not only me that sees it, I'm just the only one with enough balls to call you guys on it.

Sorry, for my non-editing. In mmy anger and haste, spell-check does what spell-check does. Sorry, guess that makes me illiterate...

:(:(

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