Jon Snow is the real Aegon.

[Dragonsbone]

1 hour ago, Romaine3 said:

If R + L = J, and the great houses of fire and ice are combined within Jon, why didn't Lyanna give him a Stark first name? When & if his identity is revealed, wouldn't it be pretty rad if he got to be King (insert historical Stark name) Targaryen the first of his name?

This way, the combination of his bloodlines are clearly illustrated. Ice and Fire. He won't be confused with the Aegon's, Aemon's, and what have you. He will be the first of his name re-establishing the Targaryen dynasty.

Because this is a medievil patriarchal society and the father not the mother chooses the name of the children. The son continues the line of the fathers family not the mothers. Rhaegar would of course choose a Targaryen name since it is his son. 

Rhaegar obviously did not know that his family will be doomed and defeated, when he named his son. Lyanna just told Ned his real name and Ned was smart enough to give him a bastard name since his real name and his origins has become obsolete and rather dangerous. 

[Romaine3]

I understand that. However, no one can be sure that Rhaegar gave her a name. Plus, first names from families that mix in Westeros seem to go from one family to the next all of the time. So why can't it happen in this specific case?

I can't seem to find any examples of Starks and Targaryens marrying before. If it did happen, then a precedent may have been set in that case. All in all, I feel that Jon deserves a unique name. It seems he is destined to be remembered. Not only for his lineage, but also for his deeds.

[Romaine3]

38 minutes ago, Dragonsbone said:

Because this is a medievil patriarchal society and the father not the mother chooses the name of the children. The son continues the line of the fathers family not the mothers. Rhaegar would of course choose a Targaryen name since it is his son. 

Rhaegar obviously did not know that his family will be doomed and defeated, when he named his son. Lyanna just told Ned his real name and Ned was smart enough to give him a bastard name since his real name and his origins has become obsolete and rather dangerous. 

If I'm ruffling any feathers with the name thing, I apologize. I checked into the Targaryen dynasty and didn't see a King Rhaegar. If Lyanna wants to give him a purely Targaryen name, why not name him after his father, the man she loved dearly?

King Rhaegar I Targaryen 

[Dragonsbone]

10 minutes ago, Romaine3 said:

If I'm ruffling any feathers with the name thing, I apologize. I checked into the Targaryen dynasty and didn't see a King Rhaegar. If Lyanna wants to give him a purely Targaryen name, why not name him after his father, the man she loved dearly?

King Rhaegar I Targaryen 

Because Rhaegar, not Lyanna gave him the name. I just said that in my post. She just gave this information to Ned. She was not the one who chosed the name.

[Romaine3]

That he gave her a name is speculation. Unless you are secretly GRRM, how do you know that?

In most cases, the husband and wife talk it over and decide on a name together. In a scenario like this, Lyanna is dying, Rhaegar is already dead, and to honor him she changes it from whatever it may have been to Rhaegar. Eddard honors her dying wishes, but calls the boy Jon, so as not to raise any eyebrows.

[kissdbyfire]

Just now, Dragonsbone said:

Because Rhaegar, not Lyanna gave him the name. I just said that in my post. She just gave this information to Ned. She was not the one who chosed the name.

How can you possibly know that? There's nothing in the text to support this.

Furthermore, we have Martin on the subject:

http://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/1202/

5. Since all of their mothers died, who gave Jon Snow, Daenerys Targaryen and Tyrion Lannister their names?

Mothers can name a child before birth, or during, or after, even while they are dying. Dany was most like named by her mother, Tyrion by his father, Jon by Ned.

Just now, Romaine3 said:

That he gave her a name is speculation. Unless you are secretly GRRM, how do you know that?

Exactly.

Just now, Romaine3 said:

In most cases, the husband and wife talk it over and decide on a name together. In a scenario like this, Lyanna is dying, Rhaegar is already dead, and to honor him she changes it from whatever it may have been to Rhaegar. Eddard honors her dying wishes, but calls the boy Jon, so as not to raise any eyebrows.

If Jon has another name chosen by R+L or R or L, we have no way of knowing what that na,e is w/ the info we have so far. So it is at least possible. 

[Dragonsbone]

13 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

How can you possibly know that? There's nothing in the text to support this.

Furthermore, we have Martin on the subject:

http://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/1202/

5. Since all of their mothers died, who gave Jon Snow, Daenerys Targaryen and Tyrion Lannister their names?

Mothers can name a child before birth, or during, or after, even while they are dying. Dany was most like named by her mother, Tyrion by his father, Jon by Ned.

Exactly.

If Jon has another name chosen by R+L or R or L, we have no way of knowing what that na,e is w/ the info we have so far. So it is at least possible. 

Is the whole point of this topic not speculation? We don't even know wheather R+L=J in the books. I can impossibly state under every sentence "I think" or "I speculate" . The question that is discussed is why Jons Name could be Aegon. And the only speculative answer I can give to that is that Rhaegar must have named him that way...I don't see any sense why Lyanna should have give him that name. 

[Romaine3]

3 minutes ago, Dragonsbone said:

Is the whole point of this topic not speculation? We don't even know wheather R+L=J in the books. I can impossibly state under every sentence "I think" or "I speculate" . The question that is discussed is why Jons Name could be Aegon. And the only speculative answer I can give to that is that Rhaegar must have named him that way...I don't see any sense why Lyanna should have give him that name. 

The way I interpreted the OP is that Jon is the true hidden Targaryen heir that Varys wants, not the kid who was raised up as Aegon in secret.

My little addition to the topic was to try and give Jon a name worthy of a king in Westeros. Rhaegar makes sense to me now that I've written it all out. 

[Dragonsbone]

7 minutes ago, Romaine3 said:

The way I interpreted the OP is that Jon is the true hidden Targaryen heir that Varys wants, not the kid who was raised up as Aegon in secret.

My little addition to the topic was to try and give Jon a name worthy of a king in Westeros. Rhaegar makes sense to me now that I've written it all out. 

I would love it, if his name was Rhaegar. Three are six known Aegons in the story. Another fake Aegon running around who claims or believes to be the sixth Aegon. We don't need another Aegon.  

Edit: but maybe it makes sense after all. All the even Number Aegons have been horrible (A parallel to the Star Trek Movies ?). The second and the forth where terrible. The sixth being fAegon could also bring war and destruction over Westeros. The seventh being the Hero makes sense again. Also: seven books, seven Kingdoms, seven Aegons 

[kissdbyfire]

Just now, Dragonsbone said:

I would love it, if his name was Rhaegar. Three are six known Aegons in the story. Another fake Aegon running around who claims or believes to be the sixth Aegon. We don't need another Aegon.  

I agree. If Jon has another name I'd rather it's Rhaegar and not yet another Aegon. But if I'm going w/ what I would really, really like, then he will keep the name he has. It's so perfect,

Jon Snow, King of Winter.

 

[Romaine3]

2 minutes ago, Dragonsbone said:

I would love it, if his name was Rhaegar. Three are six known Aegons in the story. Another fake Aegon running around who claims or believes to be the sixth Aegon. We don't need another Aegon.  

I'm happy we can reach a consensus!

As soon as I thought of naming Jon after his father, all I could think of was a young nerdy Rhaegar reading that scroll, jumping out of his chair, going up to the master at arms and saying, "My training begins now" or whatever. I think that he thought that he was tptwp, or that one of his children would be.

[kissdbyfire]

Just now, Romaine3 said:

I'm happy we can reach a consensus!

As soon as I thought of naming Jon after his father, all I could think of was a young nerdy Rhaegar reading that scroll, jumping out of his chair, going up to the master at arms and saying, "My training begins now" or whatever. I think that he thought that he was tptwp, or that one of his children would be.

He did, at first 

AFfC - Samwell IV 

 On Braavos, it had seemed possible that Aemon might recover. Xhondo's talk of dragons had almost seemed to restore the old man to himself. That night he ate every bite Sam put before him. "No one ever looked for a girl," he said. "It was a prince that was promised, not a princess. Rhaegar, I thought . . . the smoke was from the fire that devoured Summerhall on the day of his birth, the salt from the tears shed for those who died. He shared my belief when he was young, but later he became persuaded that it was his own son who fulfilled the prophecy, for a comet had been seen above King's Landing on the night Aegon was conceived, and Rhaegar was certain the bleeding star had to be a comet. What fools we were, who thought ourselves so wise! The error crept in from the translation. Dragons are neither male nor female, Barth saw the truth of that, but now one and now the other, as changeable as flame. The language misled us all for a thousand years. Daenerys is the one, born amidst salt and smoke. The dragons prove it." Just talking of her seemed to make him stronger. "I must go to her. I must. Would that I was even ten years younger."

[Romaine3]

Thank you for backing me up with the actual text kissdbyfire! Now I can sit here and believe Jon's name is Rhaegar until GRRM decides to reveal his actual name in the novels.

[Ghost+Nymeria4Eva]

13 hours ago, HallowedMarcus said:

   Is that a joke? Many Lords and Knights lost castles and lands because they supported the BackFyre's claim. They went east and formed the Golden Company. They defended the BackFyre's rebellion many times and many Lords in Westeros supported them and had their land seized too. Many of them now are descendants from that lot. They want to get their family's land and titles back and also new ones from the ones who fight against them and lose. Considering they always lost supporting a "fake" Targaryen (BlackFyre), now they support a real one with a Lord who was a Hand to the real late King, to wit, Lord Jon Connington and expecting that another real Targaryen (Daenerys) with Dragons comes to their aid and even marries Aegon. The Golden Company knows they never, ever had such a chance to finally win.

So the Golden Company is going to turn their back on their ancestors' support for the Blackfyres, forget their hatred of Targs for taking their lands and titles away for fighting with Blackfyres, and bend the knee to Rhaegar's supposed Targ son, which means literally handing Targs the victory in this civil squabble? Right. 

[Hodor the Articulate]

22 hours ago, IceFire125 said:

The election was also influenced by the raven landing next to Jon on the table and then flew to his shoulder.  This is a foreshadowing when Jon will be crowned king by the Great Lords of Westeros in the Great Council.

Drogon, Cannibal, or another dragon that will represent the "black winged" creature that GRRM cleverly attributed in the story (describing ravens with black wings and dragons being horses with wings).  It will be this black winged creature that will land next to Jon, and in that moment, Jon will mount the dragon's shoulders, prompting the lords to elect him to be their king and protector of the realm.

Yes, and from there he'll single handedly defeat the evil monsters, unite the Kingdom, claim a heart-shape faced maiden with Huge Tracts of Land as his trophy Queen, and live to be The Greatest King That Ever Was.

Sorry, but Drogon ain't leaving his mama.

[IceFire125]

2 hours ago, Dragonsbone said:

I would love it, if his name was Rhaegar. Three are six known Aegons in the story. Another fake Aegon running around who claims or believes to be the sixth Aegon. We don't need another Aegon.  

3

But in that instant, as he twisted, the opening was there. Jon planted and pivoted. The ranger was leaning away, and for an instant it seemed that Jon's slash had not touched him. Then a string of red tears appeared across the big man's throat, bright as a ruby necklace, and the blood gushed out of him, and Qhorin Halfhand fell.

GRRM established that rubies can be seen, represent or symbolized as blood.

"Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince..." - ACOK Dany, HoTU vision

"Six have been found. We are all waiting for the seventh.” -  AFFC Brienne

Rubies here represent Rhaegar's royal blood.  Westeros have crowned five Aegons and "we are all waiting for the seventh."  In order for a seventh to appear, there has to be a sixth (fAegon).  That's why a lot of R+L= legitimate Jon fans believe Jon might very well be that seventh king named Aegon.  Now, to his companions, he will still be Jon.

Could Rhaegar's ruby plated armor be smashed into more than seven? of course.  However, do not dismiss GRRM's intent (for a purpose later to be revealed) in why and how he worded it the way he did.

[Dragonsbone]

16 minutes ago, IceFire125 said:

But in that instant, as he twisted, the opening was there. Jon planted and pivoted. The ranger was leaning away, and for an instant it seemed that Jon's slash had not touched him. Then a string of red tears appeared across the big man's throat, bright as a ruby necklace, and the blood gushed out of him, and Qhorin Halfhand fell.

GRRM established that rubies can be seen, represent or symbolized as blood.

"Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince..." - ACOK Dany, HoTU vision

"Six have been found. We are all waiting for the seventh.” -  AFFC Brienne

Rubies here represent Rhaegar's royal blood.  Westeros have crowned five Aegons and "we are all waiting for the seventh."  In order for a seventh to appear, there has to be a sixth (fAegon) to appear.  That's why a lot of R+L= legitimate Jon fans believe Jon might be that very well be that seventh king named Aegon.  Now, to his companions, he will still be Jon.

Could Rhaegar's ruby plated be smashed into more than seven? of course.  However, do not dismiss GRRM's intent (for a purpose later to be revealed) in why and how he worded it the way he did.

Those are great lines, I have never paid attention to them. Probably because I hate the Briene Chapters so much, that I mostly overflow them. Great catch. As I already said, it may be also symbolism, seven Kingdoms, seven Books, the seventh Aegon. It might actually be the case. But I still don't like it . 

[Romaine3]

17 minutes ago, IceFire125 said:

But in that instant, as he twisted, the opening was there. Jon planted and pivoted. The ranger was leaning away, and for an instant it seemed that Jon's slash had not touched him. Then a string of red tears appeared across the big man's throat, bright as a ruby necklace, and the blood gushed out of him, and Qhorin Halfhand fell.

GRRM established that rubies can be seen, represent or symbolized as blood.

"Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince..." - ACOK Dany, HoTU vision

"Six have been found. We are all waiting for the seventh.” -  AFFC Brienne

Rubies here represent Rhaegar's royal blood.  Westeros have crowned five Aegons and "we are all waiting for the seventh."  In order for a seventh to appear, there has to be a sixth (fAegon) to appear.  That's why a lot of R+L= legitimate Jon fans believe Jon might be that very well be that seventh king named Aegon.  Now, to his companions, he will still be Jon.

Could Rhaegar's ruby plated be smashed into more than seven? of course.  However, do not dismiss GRRM's intent (for a purpose later to be revealed) in why and how he worded it the way he did.

Great use of the text to illustrate your point, however, naming both of your sons Aegon is kind of superfluous and confusing right? Let's theorize instead that Jon names his firstborn son Aegon to get us to #7. Or is there a flaw in my logic somewhere that I'm missing?

[Dragonsbone]

34 minutes ago, Romaine3 said:

Great use of the text to illustrate your point, however, naming both of your sons Aegon is kind of superfluous and confusing right? Let's theorize instead that Jon names his firstborn son Aegon to get us to #7. Or is there a flaw in my logic somewhere that I'm missing?

It may fit with Rhaegars obsession with prophecies. He may have believed that the prince that was promissed has to have the Name Aegon. 

[Romaine3]

15 minutes ago, Dragonsbone said:

It may fit with Rhaegars obsession with prophecies. He may have believed that the prince that was promissed has to have the Name Aegon. 

I'm with you on this. However, that doesn't mean I have to like it! Please GRRM, we don't want Jon to be Aegon the 7th! It would kind of be lame in my opinion. But if it's true, then it is what it is.