Cridefea Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 10 hours ago, Morgana Lannister said: As for the Riverlands there are various threads on the previous season and people were debating at great length whether he was making himself sound worse than he is to Edmure because Edmure would not believe anything else, so he played the Kingslayer. Now, of course I may not be right here Exactly my point. He was playing the kingslayer and prevented a bloodshed. Now that very same person decides to sack a castle without blinking an eye (and kills a woman). Jaime can make choices, but not this season apparently. What I'm saying he is in contraddition with the Jaime of the prevoius seasons. It's not about leaving Cersei or not. To me this means occ writing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgana Lannister Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 36 minutes ago, Cridefea said: Exactly my point. He was playing the kingslayer and prevented a bloodshed. Now that very same person decides to sack a castle without blinking an eye (and kills a woman). Jaime can make choices, but not this season apparently. What I'm saying he is in contraddition with the Jaime of the prevoius seasons. It's not about leaving Cersei or not. To me this means occ writing. I agree but there seems to also be a marked difference in Jaime depending on who he is influenced by; when he is around Brienne he seems a lot more reasonable than around Cersei who seems to have him almost hypnotised lol I guess with Olenna yes he made her drink poison before she confessed to killing Joffrey but I guess in that sort of world, despite having excellent reasons for doing so, she was technically in open rebellion with the Crown so he possibly didn't have many options unless he was prepared to rebel against Cersei's rule himself but yes he is much better when he is not around her lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonslack Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 The question is, if not killing cerci, what is his use? A lone lannister in the north? If he had deposed her and taken control of the meager army... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Error-504 Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 28 minutes ago, Dragonslack said: The question is, if not killing cerci, what is his use? A lone lannister in the north? If he had deposed her and taken control of the meager army... There are a host of possibilities, all pure speculation at this point, but I think there will be defectors and strays throughout Westeros that will come to help fight the NK, and Jamie could head up this rag tag team, or possibly Cersei is dealt with early in the next season, freeing up all the Lannister forces to head North (although I am skeptical of D & D offing the precious Lena H until the last possible moment). I still think Jamie dies a hero's death, and have a sneaking suspicion that it might be taking out not the NK, but the NK's dragon, allowing Jon to deal with the NK. I think we might have seen some foreshadowing of that in Episode 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgana Lannister Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 18 minutes ago, Error-504 said: There are a host of possibilities, all pure speculation at this point, but I think there will be defectors and strays throughout Westeros that will come to help fight the NK, and Jamie could head up this rag tag team, or possibly Cersei is dealt with early in the next season, freeing up all the Lannister forces to head North (although I am skeptical of D & D offing the precious Lena H until the last possible moment). I still think Jamie dies a hero's death, and have a sneaking suspicion that it might be taking out not the NK, but the NK's dragon, allowing Jon to deal with the NK. I think we might have seen some foreshadowing of that in Episode 4. Interesting. I was wracking my brains thinking what part each member of Team Living could play individually. There are a lot of people here with powerful skills, be it super powers or just diplomatic skills or even simple common sense, like with Davos. Now, I doubt very much one individual will do the whole deed or even two individuals. StIll, according to Beric if someone on their own takes on the NK, game over! So are the rest just there for moral support??? I would like to see a real team effort but failing to see how it could be done lol I agree though that some Lannister forces will follow Jaime and desert Cersei. Also, I think Jaime will die in quite an epic manner in a very honourable way and I love your theory. Still, it could also be argued that Bran or Arya are in fact in a better position to cross him off purely by stealth... so who knows! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgana Lannister Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 1 hour ago, Dragonslack said: The question is, if not killing cerci, what is his use? A lone lannister in the north? If he had deposed her and taken control of the meager army... My guess is dying with a bang!!! i.e. doing something that watchers and readers will consider worth it. I think, but tinfoil no doubt, that it will be in fact Brienne who fills up his blank page for him in the book of the King's Guard... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apoplexy Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 9 minutes ago, Morgana Lannister said: My guess is dying with a bang!!! i.e. doing something that watchers and readers will consider worth it. I think, but tinfoil no doubt, that it will be in fact Brienne who fills up his blank page for him in the book of the King's Guard... I really, really hope that Jaime comes out alive from the battle and lives long enough to be called goldenhand the just. Failing which, it would be poetic to have brienne complete his page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgana Lannister Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 44 minutes ago, Apoplexy said: I really, really hope that Jaime comes out alive from the battle and lives long enough to be called goldenhand the just. Failing which, it would be poetic to have brienne complete his page. Okay, this is probably very fanfic lol I know George doesn't like them but with 2019 before show and probably a life-time before book I need my fix!!! Started one but got as far as part of prologue lol, reason being I complicate my life too much and I wanted a lot of mythology with UnCat and the book cliffhanger but hey, super out of topic here I just had this visual image of a very heavily pregnant Brie (cheesy I know, pardon the pun) writing his pages after him at least seriously contributing (not by money or forces) but by himself to the final battle lol... I know it is all very cheesy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgana Lannister Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 55 minutes ago, Apoplexy said: I really, really hope that Jaime comes out alive from the battle and lives long enough to be called goldenhand the just. Failing which, it would be poetic to have brienne complete his page. I am with you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apoplexy Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 48 minutes ago, Morgana Lannister said: Okay, this is probably very fanfic lol I know George doesn't like them but with 2019 before show and probably a life-time before book I need my fix!!! Started one but got as far as part of prologue lol, reason being I complicate my life too much and I wanted a lot of mythology with UnCat and the book cliffhanger but hey, super out of topic here I just had this visual image of a very heavily pregnant Brie (cheesy I know, pardon the pun) writing his pages after him at least seriously contributing (not by money or forces) but by himself to the final battle lol... I know it is all very cheesy... I'm all for cheesy when it comes to JB! Maybe a pregnant brienne completed his page and hands it over to the next LC, before heading over to an obscure village to meet up with Jaime where they raise their child in anonymity. And they both somehow get pulled back to public life, with many stories to tell, Dunk and Egg style. (I have no illusions to the fact that I suck at storytelling, but I just want a happy ending for JB :D) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
falcotron Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 2 hours ago, Apoplexy said: I really, really hope that Jaime comes out alive from the battle and lives long enough to be called goldenhand the just. Failing which, it would be poetic to have brienne complete his page. I'd prefer it if he has to murder Cersei to save the world, and a few people like Brienne call him Goldenhand the Just (and she can even write it in his KG page, sure), but most of the world goes back to considering him a kingslayer, oathbreaker, and now kinslayer as well. And he knows that's what they're going to think, but he does it anyway, and isn't conflicted about it. (He doesn't actually have to die—he could be exiled to start the new Watch or something, giving him a nice parallel with Bloodraven.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apoplexy Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 17 minutes ago, falcotron said: I'd prefer it if he has to murder Cersei to save the world, and a few people like Brienne call him Goldenhand the Just (and she can even write it in his KG page, sure), but most of the world goes back to considering him a kingslayer, oathbreaker, and now kinslayer as well. And he knows that's what they're going to think, but he does it anyway, and isn't conflicted about it. (He doesn't actually have to die—he could be exiled to start the new Watch or something, giving him a nice parallel with Bloodraven.) It would be interesting to have life come a full circle again for Jaime. He could be westeros's dark knight And Jaime wasn't interested in ruling anyways, so I like the idea of him starting something that's divorced from his titles. Would be bitter sweet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgana Lannister Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 1 hour ago, Apoplexy said: I'm all for cheesy when it comes to JB! Maybe a pregnant brienne completed his page and hands it over to the next LC, before heading over to an obscure village to meet up with Jaime where they raise their child in anonymity. And they both somehow get pulled back to public life, with many stories to tell, Dunk and Egg style. (I have no illusions to the fact that I suck at storytelling, but I just want a happy ending for JB :D) thank you; my idea is that she can only do that because she is Lady Commander!!! and she finally writes something nice about him in the book lol (I did have the "cheese" warning...) Of course by that point he would have died heroically. I hope they both survive too but not counting my chickens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
falcotron Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 1 hour ago, Apoplexy said: It would be interesting to have life come a full circle again for Jaime. He could be westeros's dark knight And Jaime wasn't interested in ruling anyways, so I like the idea of him starting something that's divorced from his titles. Would be bitter sweet. I think multiple characters are going to end up coming full circle and repeating what they did at the start, but it'll have a completely different meaning for them this time around. But I'm not sure why I think GRRM is going to do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dragon & The Wolf Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Jaime in Winterfell again is going to be very interesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyanna19 Posted September 15, 2017 Share Posted September 15, 2017 On 8/30/2017 at 3:59 PM, Apoplexy said: I really, really hope that Jaime comes out alive from the battle and lives long enough to be called goldenhand the just. Failing which, it would be poetic to have brienne complete his page. I would love for that to happen! Unfortunately being a realist (and I blame GRRM for my becoming a realist) I believe Jaime will die, a hero's death yes, but a death none the less, I also like the idea of Brienne completing his page, he certainly wanted to do a great deed, can't wait! ( For the books, they will be So much more satisfying. (Please GRRM hear our pleas, give us satisfaction and set us free from our many and wrongful imaginations! We need this!) Sorry but I had to get this out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinscS2 Posted September 15, 2017 Share Posted September 15, 2017 Jamie might very well die in a way that will forever remove the sobriquet "Kingslayer" when people talk about him. It would be a satisfying way for him to end his arc; he dies, but he will forever be remembered as a honorable hero in the songs, and not as a dishonorable backstabbing kingslayer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcmontea Posted September 15, 2017 Share Posted September 15, 2017 4 minutes ago, MinscS2 said: Jamie might very well die in a way that will forever remove the sobriquet "Kingslayer" when people talk about him. It would be a satisfying way for him to end his arc; he dies, but he will forever be remembered as a honorable hero in the songs, and not as a dishonorable backstabbing kingslayer. What do you think needs to happen for him to be known as a hero and no longer as Kingslayer? I almost feel in this society, he would have to die saving Dany or Jon the living members of the royal family he betrayed. Killing Cersei no matter how justified would probably see him branded a kinslayer in addition to kinglsayer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinscS2 Posted September 15, 2017 Share Posted September 15, 2017 21 minutes ago, jcmontea said: What do you think needs to happen for him to be known as a hero and no longer as Kingslayer? I almost feel in this society, he would have to die saving Dany or Jon the living members of the royal family he betrayed. Killing Cersei no matter how justified would probably see him branded a kinslayer in addition to kinglsayer. I'm not sure actually. Sacrificing himself to save Aerys descendants, i.e. Dany and/or Jon is probably a bare minimum. Someone in power needs to see him do whatever it is he does so that they can spread the word about his heroic end when the dust has settled. Suicide-charge the NK perhaps? We know it's something he's willing to do at this stage if it will bring an end to the horrors of war. (But let's not turn this into a "Is Jamie Azhor Ahai"-thread. ) I agree that killing Cersei, even if justified, is not enough and would probably just increase the low opinion people already have of him. Not only is he a Kingslayer, he also becomes a Queenslayer and a Kinslayer. The fact that both Aerys and Cersei deserved it is irrelevant in the eyes of the mob. Jamie dying in a way that restores his personal honor (and possibly eradicates House Lannister) would also be the perfect middle-finger to Tywin, who always regarded personal honor as something worthless and family legacy the only thing that mattered. Jamie probably wants to be remembered for his deeds, not for being a part of House Lannister, which is the exact opposite view of his father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morte Posted September 15, 2017 Share Posted September 15, 2017 10 hours ago, MinscS2 said: I'm not sure actually. Sacrificing himself to save Aerys descendants, i.e. Dany and/or Jon is probably a bare minimum. 10 hours ago, MinscS2 said: Jamie dying in a way that restores his personal honor (and possibly eradicates House Lannister) would also be the perfect middle-finger to Tywin, who always regarded personal honor as something worthless and family legacy the only thing that mattered. Jamie probably wants to be remembered for his deeds, not for being a part of House Lannister, which is the exact opposite view of his father. In the books: It's actually foreshadowed in the books by his dream with Rhaegar and the Kingsguard, so if he dies, he will die saving the life of a Targ. But before that he will be vindicated by Dany for killing her father, so it will be known everywhere why he did kill the Mad King, and of course he will do other great deeds. My prediction is, that in the end one of the last great knights will survive the whole thing, either Barristan or Jaime, and the surviving will end the others page in the White Book. (Even if they both die, they will have great pages in the end, and will not be simply killed off somewhere random.) And great songs will be written for both the Knight Who Became A Squirre To Find His Queen and The Kingslayer, Saviour or Kings Landing, who went on the great quest to find his lost honour, in which he succeeded with the help of the beautiful Lady-Knight Brienne of Tarth (who will of course be beautiful in the songs, and have her own songs as well). And they all died happily known for their deeds and their shields, as white as honour. /fairytale In the show: Here too he will most likely die doing something great (and we will be vindicated too, for the kingslaying), which may or may not also include saving a Targ. But he has to die a great knight (even if the show scraped his arc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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