Tywin et al.

NFL 2017: And Now It Begins!

427 posts in this topic

After seeing all the horrendous QB play this weekend, it's clear that Kaepernick could be starting for a bunch of teams.  Tolzien's already in danger of being benched for Brisset, who just joined the team a week ago.  He's also better than McCown, Hoyer, and Savage.  I hope he gets another chance to play this year, but at this point, it seems unlikely.  He's definitely being blackballed.

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6 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I'm curious, who do people think is currently the worst owner?

 

 It seems like it would have to be a near tie between Irsay the drug addict and York the dipshit, with Snyder running third?  JJ still pretty crazy, but think his badness has now been eclipsed. Or am I missing some bad owners?

Worst like biggest prick or most detrimental to the team?

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27 minutes ago, Bronn Stone said:

I see Goff with an Alex Smith/Joe Flacco type ceiling.

How?  Those two guys couldn't be more different.  Smith is the epitome of a risk averse game manager.  He's literally the first QB anyone thinks about when they hear the term "game manager."  Flacco is a gunslinger with a cannon for an arm.  No one thinks of Flacco when they hear game manager.  

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19 minutes ago, Pony Queen Jace said:

Worst like biggest prick or most detrimental to the team?

Most detrimental to the team. But you could give both, LOL, if they're different people.

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1 minute ago, Cas Stark said:

Most detrimental to the team. But you could give both, LOL, if they're different people.

Doesn't it have to be the 49er owner, who took a team which went to the superbowl and fired one of the best coaches in the league in favor of Jim Tonsula, and proceeded to lose basically everyone on the team worth a damn? 

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1 minute ago, Kalbear said:

Doesn't it have to be the 49er owner, who took a team which went to the superbowl and fired one of the best coaches in the league in favor of Jim Tonsula, and proceeded to lose basically everyone on the team worth a damn? 

YES. Yes it does. Jed "I Don't Play Well With Others" York. 

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17 minutes ago, briantw said:

How?  Those two guys couldn't be more different.  Smith is the epitome of a risk averse game manager.  He's literally the first QB anyone thinks about when they hear the term "game manager."  Flacco is a gunslinger with a cannon for an arm.  No one thinks of Flacco when they hear game manager.  

Not really sure Flacco is a gunslinger with a cannon for an arm anymore. Maybe it's the offense, maybe it's his back, maybe it's his weapons, maybe it's his deep ball accuracy. Not really sure which is the culprit. But outside of a few games, he feels more like a bad game manager then a gunslinger who beats you deep. I mean, they do get a lot of PIs in their favor but outside of that, I don't see him connecting on passes down the field all that often.

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4 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

Most detrimental to the team. But you could give both, LOL, if they're different people.

I'm biased because I'm from the Bay area, but from what I've seen over the last 3 or 4 years, York has been horrendous.  Turned a playoff caliber team into a bottom feeder in a year because of his ego.  He couldn't get along with Harbaugh and he wanted credit for the success during the Harbaugh era.  Since firing Harbaugh, the 49ers have finished last in their division for the past two years, and I think the 49ers will finish last in their division again to make it three in a row.

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I would say the thing Flacco and Smith most have in common is they are good enough to win a title if and only if the Defense does the bulk of the heavy lifting.

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I tend to agree, that York is the worst, but Irsay has really allowed the Colts to become totally fucked...but I guess since he didn't actively, with purpose, dismantle a superbowl team and fire a coach with a 70% win record, he can't be number 1.  Ruining Lucks career, is bad, though.  He has to be 2.

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Even though Flacco has a great arm he's not what I think of when I think of the "gunslinger" moniker.  I feel like Flacco typically plays QB conservatively.  Sometimes he'll throw a ridiculous deep out that not all QB's could complete because of this super cannon, but it's usually a hit your drop and throw on timing kind of thing.  Someone like Favre is the prototypical gunslinger who also had a super cannon but went off script much more and improvised and made lots of risky throws.  

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3 hours ago, Rhom said:

Remember me complaining about the high ticket prices in Indy a couple months back?

Colts collapse leads to crash of secondary ticket market in Indy.

Sadly, the Niners game is where they will retire PFM's jersey; so I don't see that game being much of a bargain.  However, what I found most fascinating was the graphic in the article comparing average ticket price for all 32 teams.

The Colts are the cheapest at $117, but holy bleeding hell... the average ticket to see the Patriots is over $540. :stunned:   All those rich southies up there or somethin' I guess.  Wow.

Yeah, I could have gotten 2 tickets to the home opener, but the night in all would have cost over $500. Buying two steaks and a bottle of win for the FwB and myself seemed like the much better option.

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York's the worst. Other owners have sucked due to incompetence; he sucked by design. He told players out there risking brain damage for the sake of touchdowns that being a SB contender wasn't worth an uncomfortable working relationship. There's just no topping that.

 

edit; Flacco/Smith...Smith is a poor man's Peyton, Flacco is a lower-middle class Eli.

Edited by James Arryn

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3 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I tend to agree, that York is the worst, but Irsay has really allowed the Colts to become totally fucked...but I guess since he didn't actively, with purpose, dismantle a superbowl team and fire a coach with a 70% win record, he can't be number 1.  Ruining Lucks career, is bad, though.  He has to be 2.

Dunno, he got rid of Peyton Manning, who proceeded to go to two superbowls afterwards and win one. 

As the comedy bit said: "You just...get rid of one of the best quarterbacks of all time? You choose to do that? Really? Huh". 

Then he proceeds to completely waste the next talent he gets. That's gotta be up there.

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1 minute ago, Kalbear said:

Dunno, he got rid of Peyton Manning, who proceeded to go to two superbowls afterwards and win one. 

As the comedy bit said: "You just...get rid of one of the best quarterbacks of all time? You choose to do that? Really? Huh". 

Then he proceeds to completely waste the next talent he gets. That's gotta be up there.

It was I think legitimately up in the air if Manning could have come back, and his skills did decline, if he had stayed w/the Colts he would never have gotten the same kind of protection he got at Broncos.  But, yeah, I think Irsay is 2nd worst.

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I'm throwing a curve ball and saying James Dolan is the worst owner.

As far as the NFL goes, can we pick the people of Green Bay? If not, I'd say Woody Johnson deserves a vote. If it's who is the worst person, let Ziggy, Jerry and Irsay fight for that title. 

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6 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

Dunno, he got rid of Peyton Manning, who proceeded to go to two superbowls afterwards and win one. 

As the comedy bit said: "You just...get rid of one of the best quarterbacks of all time? You choose to do that? Really? Huh". 

Then he proceeds to completely waste the next talent he gets. That's gotta be up there.

I mean, I totally understand the decision to let Manning go.  They had just drafted his replacement and they wanted to give the new guy playing time.

The fact that they've utterly failed to protect him or put together a defense that isn't godawful is certainly questionable, though.

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1 minute ago, Tywin et al. said:

I'm throwing a curve ball and saying James Dolan is the worst owner.

As far as the NFL goes, can we pick the people of Green Bay? If not, I'd say Woody Johnson deserves a vote. If it's who is the worst person, let Ziggy, Jerry and Irsay fight for that title. 

I'll say this for York; get him away from football-related issues and he's not bad bordering on quite good as far as NFL owners go. But just as another example of how his NFLing sucks, for like 3 years you could tell who was backed and who was sacked by the preemptive 'leak' campaigns. 

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5 minutes ago, briantw said:

I mean, I totally understand the decision to let Manning go.  They had just drafted his replacement and they wanted to give the new guy playing time.

They hadn't drafted Luck yet, but that was the plan. 

That said, it is...well, it's very unusual to decide to get rid of one of the best QBs of all time, injury status or no. Who proceeded post-injury to have his best statistical year ever with another team. That was...odd. Especially doing so while getting absolutely nothing in return for him. 

5 minutes ago, briantw said:

The fact that they've utterly failed to protect him or put together a defense that isn't godawful is certainly questionable, though.

Look, they obviously looked at Russell Wilson's success and figured that Luck could emulate that

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38 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

They hadn't drafted Luck yet, but that was the plan. 

That said, it is...well, it's very unusual to decide to get rid of one of the best QBs of all time, injury status or no. Who proceeded post-injury to have his best statistical year ever with another team. That was...odd. Especially doing so while getting absolutely nothing in return for him. 

They already knew they had the first pick and, thus, Luck at the time, though, right?  I mean, they knew they were drafting Manning's replacement.  

I agree it's unusual to decide to let one of the best QBs ever go, but it's not like he was going to have that statistical season in Indy.  I think they saw the writing on the wall, knew they weren't good enough to compete even with Manning, and thus decided to start developing his replacement.  Now, you can argue that they've failed to develop Luck because he's constantly getting demolished due to an ineffective offensive line, and the team has spent tons of high picks on more receivers instead of bolstering their offensive and defensive lines (which is typically the first step toward putting together a great team).  But I think the decision to let Manning go was at least defensible and practical.

They have definitely failed to give Luck the support he needs, but that's a different argument.  Manning probably would have gotten legit murdered behind that offensive line.  

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