princess brittany

jon and dragon

30 posts in this topic

10 hours ago, MinscS2 said:

I don't believe that Jon is Ice and Fire either.
Being a Targaryen doesn't make you Fire, and being a Stark doesn't make you Ice. There's more to it than a family name.
It's the environment, persona and actions of Jon that makes him Ice, just as the environment, persona and actions of Dany makes her Fire.
I interpret the "Song of Ice and Fire" as them coming together to save the world. 
But then I also interpret the whole gender-ambiguity of the Prince/Princess that was promised as referring to the both of them (or their child.)
 

Rhaegar said: "He is the prince that was promised, and his is the song of ice and fire". He was saying right things but about wrong baby. Aegon Stark was that prince, not Aegon Martell.

Also Jon does have fire: 1. He's Targaryen, 2. He bonded with dragon (I doubt that if in his place was Viserys, Drogon wouldn't have chomped off his hand), 3. He was resurected by Lord of Light, who is a Fire God.

During her ritual Melisandre said: "We beg the Lord to share his fire, and light a candle that has gone out. From darkness, light. From ashes, fire. From death, life."

So let's wait and see, though I'm 100% sure that Jon is Ice and Fire, and that the prophecy is about him, and him only, not about him and Dany, or their baby.

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8 minutes ago, Megorova said:

Rhaegar said: "He is the prince that was promised, and his is the song of ice and fire". He was saying right things but about wrong baby. Aegon Stark was that prince, not Aegon Martell.

Also Jon does have fire: 1. He's Targaryen, 2. He bonded with dragon (I doubt that if in his place was Viserys, Drogon wouldn't have chomped off his hand), 3. He was resurected by Lord of Light, who is a Fire God.

During her ritual Melisandre said: "We beg the Lord to share his fire, and light a candle that has gone out. From darkness, light. From ashes, fire. From death, life."

So let's wait and see, though I'm 100% sure that Jon is Ice and Fire, and that the prophecy is about him, and him only, not about him and Dany, or their baby.

Why does Rhaegar then look at Dany and say there must be one more? 

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16 minutes ago, Megorova said:

Rhaegar said: "He is the prince that was promised, and his is the song of ice and fire". He was saying right things but about wrong baby. Aegon Stark was that prince, not Aegon Martell.

Rhaegar thought many things, and he was wrong about many things as well. He thought that his child with Lyanna would be a girl (Visenya, third head of the dragon.)
All he knew was that Azor Ahai would be a descendant from Aerys and Rhaella.
He didn't know at the time that he was about to have a baby sister who also fills this criteria, a sister who was their Aerys and Rhaella's third child.

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Also Jon does have fire: 1. He's Targaryen, 2. He bonded with dragon (I doubt that if in his place was Viserys, Drogon wouldn't have chomped off his hand), 3. He was resurected by Lord of Light, who is a Fire God.

Being a Targaryen doesn't make you "fire".
If being able to touch a dragon without getting your hand chopped of is all that's required to bond with it, then Tyrion has also bonded with Rhaegal and Viserion.
I'll concede his Resurrection, he was brought back by R'hllor (presumably), but that doesn't make him "fire". 

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During her ritual Melisandre said: "We beg the Lord to share his fire, and light a candle that has gone out. From darkness, light. From ashes, fire. From death, life."

Sounds like a reasonable chant when you're trying to appease the Lord of Light. Don't see what it has to do with Jon though.

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So let's wait and see, though I'm 100% sure that Jon is Ice and Fire, and that the prophecy is about him, and him only, not about him and Dany, or their baby.

It's not impossible that it only refers to Jon, but I wouldn't bet everything I own on it.

Edited by MinscS2

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On 08/09/2017 at 3:43 AM, TywinBestCharacter said:

I just really don't like Jon Snow... He's kind of a fantasy hero played straight-- courageous, honest, kind, with plot armor thick enough the Night King's spear arm wouldn't pierce it. Giving him a dragon just feels cheap and unearned. Being a Targ =/= dragon rider. Its about having a ferocity Dany clearly possesses that Jon, as the fantasy stereotype, obviously lacks.

Agree, the only character being wild and ferocious enough seems to me to be Arya. Her heroin was Visenya (Aegon little sister :) ) , she has now also a valyrian steel weapon, and even Cersei said she was as wild as her animal.

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In the books, I hope never, as of now I don't think it makes sense for his character arc.

In the show, 3rd episode I would guess. Somewhere in the middle of the season. Though I hope they explain it somewhat well and not just, he responded well to the dragon so the dragon lets him ride (same thing happened with Tyrion so he better ride one then). I don't even like the idea that since he is a Targ they let him ride. It took Danny a long while to ride her dragons or even control them. Are they going to say that now she did all the work Jon can reap the benefits? Personally, I don't like that either.

I am pretty convinced they will do it on the show but I really hope they explain it.

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2 hours ago, btfu806 said:

In the books, I hope never, as of now I don't think it makes sense for his character arc.

In the show, 3rd episode I would guess. Somewhere in the middle of the season. Though I hope they explain it somewhat well and not just, he responded well to the dragon so the dragon lets him ride (same thing happened with Tyrion so he better ride one then). I don't even like the idea that since he is a Targ they let him ride. It took Danny a long while to ride her dragons or even control them. Are they going to say that now she did all the work Jon can reap the benefits? Personally, I don't like that either.

I am pretty convinced they will do it on the show but I really hope they explain it.

I almost think the idea will come directly from Daenerys. Once she accepts him as a Targaryen she will say something about how the other dragon is named after his father and they should see if he will accept him as a rider. Strategically it also makes sense. Given that white walkers can take down dragons, they need a rider for Rhaegal if he is going to go into battle. Jon is the most likely choice. 

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I'm giving it a 50/50 chance that Jon will ride Rhaegal into battle in the next season.
At one time I was certain that he would, but I'm beginning to doubt it.
It feels more and more like something people want to happen that something that actually will end up happening.

Jon is a really good fighter and inspirational front figure.
Putting him on a dragon is a "waste" of his potential, combat prowess and valyrian steel.
Rhaegal doesn't really need a rider in order to kill wights.
I would love to see Jon, Daenerys, Rhaegal and Drogon bullrush (or is it dragonrush?) The Nightking and Viserion however. :P
 

Edited by MinscS2

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45 minutes ago, MinscS2 said:

I'm giving it a 50/50 chance that Jon will ride Rhaegal into battle in the next season.
At one time I was certain that he would, but I'm beginning to doubt it.
It feels more and more like something people want to happen that something that actually will end up happening.

Jon is a really good fighter and inspirational front figure.
Putting him on a dragon is a "waste" of his potential, combat prowess and valyrian steel.
Rhaegal doesn't really need a rider in order to kill wights.
I would love to see Jon, Daenerys, Rhaegal and Drogon bullrush (or is it dragonrush?) The Nightking and Viserion however. :P
 

That would be awesome.

The main reason i thought would make sense to have a rider for Rhaegal is that its another pair of eyes to watch out for ice spears. 

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3 hours ago, jcmontea said:

I almost think the idea will come directly from Daenerys. Once she accepts him as a Targaryen she will say something about how the other dragon is named after his father and they should see if he will accept him as a rider. Strategically it also makes sense. Given that white walkers can take down dragons, they need a rider for Rhaegal if he is going to go into battle. Jon is the most likely choice. 

Yeah, I would be fine with that, as long as it's SOMETHING. Ha.

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3 hours ago, jcmontea said:

I almost think the idea will come directly from Daenerys. Once she accepts him as a Targaryen she will say something about how the other dragon is named after his father and they should see if he will accept him as a rider. Strategically it also makes sense. Given that white walkers can take down dragons, they need a rider for Rhaegal if he is going to go into battle. Jon is the most likely choice. 

Nah, I think Jon will do something, possibly stupid, and either Rhaegal comes to save him, or Rhaegal's on the ground, and Jon mounts Rhaegal to make Rhaegal get out of the melee; alternatively, Rhaegal catches a spear or ballista bolt or whatever to the shoulder like Drogo did, and Jon pulls it out.

Then Daenerys will want to know how and why Rhaegal is responding to Jon/letting Jon ride without Daenerys. Because, of course, Jon hasn't told her about being Rhaegar and Lyanna's son yet.

Alternatively, riding Rhaegal will convince Daenerys about Jon's parentage if she learned about it previously and was skeptical.

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